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Grass D.Tecs OX vs Sponge?
https://ooakforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=13329		 Page 1 of 4
Author:  auzcar [ 22 Aug 2010, 03:47 ]
Post subject:  Grass D.Tecs OX vs Sponge?
Hi! I know this topic has been touched before and the opinions seems to be very conflicting. I've read some topics at Noppentest.de but since I don't speak German I have to use Google Translate and that makes it very hard to understand. What I want to know is what the differences are between D.Tecs OX and D.Tecs with sponge when playing a modern defender game. Currently I'm playing with OX but I have some problems with my chops having too little underspin when I only get a moderately spinny drive/loop to chop on. Also pushing against underspin doesn't work that well. Would getting a D.Tecs with 1.2mm sponge help to solve these problems? Usually a sponge under the pips help you make your own spin and I suspect it would in this case too, but D.Tecs seems to be an "unusual" rubber. If there is anyone here that have experiences with D.Tecs with sponge I would highly appreciate your thoughts on the matter and also your thoughts on how the D.Tecs with sponge plays overall as a chopping LP.

Thanks in advance!
Author:  deva sarjan [ 22 Aug 2010, 08:29 ]
Post subject:  Re: Grass D.Tecs OX vs Sponge?
1,6 mm. grass dtecs, blade matsushita pro, chopping 20 minutes against medium medium-fast top spins...
distance:medium-long...
on fh: 1,9 mm.tackifire drive, water based glued..
dtecs was faster than tackifire drive...a clear speedglued effect...rubber is jelly like...
not a forgiving equipment, requires precise timing and position..
had best control feeling when brushing (chopping) the ball. when I chop well I don't feel it as a fast rubber....and very heavy backspin!.. as much as curl p1r,
probably even more...
no experience with OX and 1,2 mm versions...
Author:  Prean-Clone [ 22 Aug 2010, 14:38 ]
Post subject:  Re: Grass D.Tecs OX vs Sponge?
I play with Grass DTecS with 1.2 and 1.6mm sponge but I play more of an attacking style.

If you're having trouble against moderate loops, try attacking them with a punch block or a simple pip flat hit (if it can be considered simple).

Against pushes, try more of a slide block, with placement being the key, a well timed slide block can be pushed right into your opponents elbow causing all sorts of trouble.

Hope this helps a bit even though we have different styles.

Prean-Clone

Blade: Stiga All-Around Oversized WRB
FH: Sriver FX 1.9mm or 729 Higher 2.0mm
BH: Dr. Neubauer Fighter 1.2mm or Grass DTecS 1.6mm
Author:  Prean-Clone [ 22 Aug 2010, 14:43 ]
Post subject:  Re: Grass D.Tecs OX vs Sponge?
oops, being tension pips they tend to lay down alot when chopping, and are fast for long pips.

Prean -Clone
Author:  Wang Tao [ 22 Aug 2010, 16:42 ]
Post subject:  Re: Grass D.Tecs OX vs Sponge?
I´ve played mainly D-Tecs OX on my bh since the ban of Super Block. I´ve used only OX-rubbers, so I really can give you an opinion only about that. I don´t chop much as I think it is quite hard to control. But when chopping, the spin is good. The main use for me is close to table blocking (or push blocking) and for that it is ok, I guess.
Author:  Konkrete [ 23 Aug 2010, 07:03 ]
Post subject:  Re: Grass D.Tecs OX vs Sponge?
I tried it with sponge and found it took away all the aspects that make DTecs superb. Prean-Clone gives some excellent advice, but for chopping incoming low spin balls, try to chop vertically but finish laterally ( in a sort of L shape). This will get you the extra spin and also stop you firing the ball off the end of the table. It's not an easy technique but effective when you get it right.
Author:  auzcar [ 23 Aug 2010, 23:12 ]
Post subject:  Re: Grass D.Tecs OX vs Sponge?
Well, I won't start to attack with my pips since I feel it's a bit inconsistent and it doesn't really fit in to my game plan. I will probably end up trying the 1.2mm version but I would appreciate some more feedback from people who have chopped with the sponged versions of D.Tecs.
Author:  Lorre [ 24 Aug 2010, 00:59 ]
Post subject:  Re: Grass D.Tecs OX vs Sponge?
Auzcar, I've read your PM and report you some of my findings tomorrow.

Cheers,

Lorre
Author:  auzcar [ 24 Aug 2010, 01:25 ]
Post subject:  Re: Grass D.Tecs OX vs Sponge?
Thanks! I highly appreciate it.
Author:  Bulldog [ 25 Aug 2010, 05:23 ]
Post subject:  Re: Grass D.Tecs OX vs Sponge?
I am new to the forum. I came back to table tennis about 5 seasons ago following a 25 year break.

I quickly switched to Neubauer Superblock and used it with great success until the FLP ban.

The season before last was a nightmare. Last season I used Bomb Talent on the backhand with songe and then graduated to GrassDTecs with 1.2 sponge.

Right at the end of the season i finally switched to GrassDTecs OX in rsd. Sensational improvement followed immediately. I have now recovered my confidence and hope to return to play in the Premier Division of my local league within 2 sesons.

There is a world of difference between Grass DTecs OX and with sponge. If you block at the table and use fast pushing to disrupt you have to use OX. I also find I can achieve a good level of backspin when chopping from distance although this is not my strength.
Author:  auzcar [ 25 Aug 2010, 05:33 ]
Post subject:  Re: Grass D.Tecs OX vs Sponge?
Of course blocking with OX is much better compared to sponge but that's not how I play. I almost only chop on my backhand (except when I'm caught at the table, which happens about 2 times per match) and for this, sponge is usually better. However, since the pips on D.Tecs is quite unique and made for reversing spin, this rule might not apply when it comes to this LP. However, it must be a reason why both Joo Se Hyuk and Park Mi Young plays it in 1,6mm. It's just that sometimes I feel a little too chained to spin reversal when I'm chopping and that's something a better player can take advantage of. In my opinion you need to be much more consistent when chopping with OX since the chops usually are less "dangerous" compared to sponged LP.
Author:  Bulldog [ 25 Aug 2010, 05:48 ]
Post subject:  Re: Grass D.Tecs OX vs Sponge?
You are absolutely correct. I am in trouble if I am forced back from the table.

I block and chop block with my backhand and look to loop or kill any balls which come back high enough. I have had to use a slower blade to accommodate the D.Tecs OX as I needed more control.

I am sure the top players you mentioned agree with you that it is better to use sponge for a modern defensive game.

The reason I love our sport so much is the variety of different styles there are out there and the amount of equipment there is to experiment with!
Author:  auzcar [ 25 Aug 2010, 05:52 ]
Post subject:  Re: Grass D.Tecs OX vs Sponge?
Bulldog wrote:
The reason I love our sport so much is the variety of different styles there are out there and the amount of equipment there is to experiment with!


Absolutely right! The only thing hurting because of this is my wallet :oops:
Author:  auzcar [ 29 Aug 2010, 05:14 ]
Post subject:  Re: Grass D.Tecs OX vs Sponge?
Well, I haven't received my D.Tecs 1.2mm yet but I'm just back from a practice session with P1R 1.0mm (I thought I'd try some other sponge LP's). I have played with P1R quite a lot before and I liked it then but this time I felt like it was too dead and I missed the lively character of D.Tecs. The good thing was that I managed to set up a better defensive game when I had the sponge because I could always put spin on the ball which prevented my opponents from blasting the ball past me. This was exactly what I want with my switch back to sponge LP and I hope I can do the same with D.Tecs 1.2mm.
Author:  Lorre [ 29 Aug 2010, 05:41 ]
Post subject:  Re: Grass D.Tecs OX vs Sponge?
Auzcar, don't forget to write a little review about your sponged DTechs. I'm curious about how you'll be experiencing the DTechs...
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