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Overview of many pips-out rubbers with sponge or ox
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Author:  martinspin [ 03 Jan 2011, 00:00 ]
Post subject:  Overview of many pips-out rubbers with sponge or ox
Styles with pimples-out rubbers
DIS Disturbing game close to the table with pushes and lifts
BLOCK Straigth game close to the table with blocks, counterattackings and smashes
OFF Offensive game with loops, pushes, chop blocks and "short" defense
DEF Defensive game in half distance with chops and disturbing drives
ALL Variable game in all distances

Youtube playlist with the new video tests
Pimples-out rubbers tested with the new poly ball

Online data
Spreadsheet with data to coverings & blades


Tested coverings sorted by styles

DIS
DER MATERIALSPEZIALIST L.S.D. 1.0 mm (LONG); DIS 92, BLOCK 91, OFF 87, DEF 89; DIS 91 (p-ball tested)
DONIC Spike P1 OX (LONG); DIS 92, BLOCK 90, OFF 92, DEF 91; DIS 92 (p-ball tested)
GIANT DRAGON 612 OX (MEDIUM); DIS 95, BLOCK 94, OFF 86, DEF 92; DIS 94 (p-ball tested)
GIANT DRAGON Giant Long; DIS 87; BLOCK 86; OFF 85; DEF 85;
HALLMARK Phoenix; DIS 93; BLOCK 89; OFF 85; DEF 81;
FRIENDSHIP R.I.T.C. 729 Dr. Evil OX (SHORT) DIS 93; BLOCK 92; OFF 91; DEF 92; DIS 93 (p-ball tested)
GLOBE 888 OX (SHORT); DIS 93; BLOCK 90; OFF 84; DEF 88; DIS 91 (p-ball tested)
PALIO New CK531A 0.6 mm (LONG); DIS 91; BLOCK 91; OFF 89; DEF 91; DIS 91; DIS 93 (p-ball tested)
SAUER & TRÖGER Hellfire OX (LONG); DIS 95, BLOCK 94, OFF 93, DEF 92; DIS 95 (p-ball tested)
SAVIGA 27 OX (LONG); DIS 90, BLOCK 87, OFF 89, DEF 88; DIS 90 (p-ball tested)
SPINLORD Zeitgeist; DIS 89; BLOCK 88; OFF 87; DEF 86;
TIBHAR Grass D.TecS OX (LONG); DIS 90; BLOCK 86; OFF 88; DEF 87; DIS 90 (p-ball tested)
XIOM Guillotine-S; DIS 89; BLOCK 88; OFF 88; DEF 86;

BLOCK
ARMSTRONG Twister; DIS 85; BLOCK 96; OFF 94; DEF 88;
BUTTERFLY Feint-OX; DIS 84; BLOCK 87; OFF 86; 85; DEF 86;
DER MATERIALSPEZIALIST Predator OX (LONG); DIS 90; BLOCK 93; OFF 91; DEF 92; BLOCK 93 (p-ball tested)
DER MATERIALSPEZIALIST Predator 1.3 mm (LONG); DIS 91; BLOCK 93; OFF 92; DEF 92; BLOCK 93 (p-ball tested)
DR NEUBAUER Killer 1.5 mm (MEDIUM); DIS 90; BLOCK 91; OFF 90; DEF 90; BLOCK 91 (p-ball tested)
GIANT DRAGON Meteorite Soft; DIS 85; BLOCK 87; OFF 86; DEF 83;
GIANT DRAGON Dragon Talon; DIS 88; BLOCK 90; OFF 88; DEF 87:
GLOBE 889 OX (SHORT); DIS 92; BLOCK 94; OFF 90; DEF 92; BLOCK 94 (p-ball tested)
JOOLA Orca; DIS 90; BLOCK 92; OFF 89; DEF DEF 84;
JOOLA Orca; DIS 90; BLOCK 92; OFF 89; DEF DEF 84;
METEOR 575 OX; DIS 93; BLOCK 94; 94; 93; BLOCK
MILKY WAY 955; DIS 90; BLOCK 91; OFF 89; DEF 88;
NEOTTEC Tokkan; DIS 90; BLOCK 92; OFF 92; DEF 91;
JOOLA Orca; DIS 90; BLOCK 92; OFF 89; 8DEF 4;
TIBHAR Grass Ultra; DIS 89; BLOCK 90; OFF 90; DEF 87;
TSP Curl P-3α R; DIS 91; BLOCK 92; OFF 92; DEF 89;
TSP Curl P-3α R; DIS 91; BLOCK 92; OFF 92; DEF 89;
YASAKA Phantom 008; DIS 90; BLOCK 93; OFF 93; DEF 91;
YASAKA Phantom 0012; DIS 91; BLOCK 93; OFF 92; DEF 90;

OFF
AIR Upupupup U2; DIS 86; BLOCK 86; OFF 89; DEF 84;
AIR Upupupup U3; DIS 86; BLOCK 89; OFF 89; DEF 88;
AIR Upupupup U5; DIS 83; BLOCK 86; OFF 90; DEF 87;
AIR Upupupup UQ; DIS 74; BLOCK 82; OFF 92; DEF 75;
AMSIR Flutter; DIS 66; BLOCK 72; OFF 88; DEF 81;
AMSIR Surprise; DIS 66; BLOCK 74; OFF 85; DEF 80;
ANDRO Chaos; DIS 77; BLOCK 82; OFF 87; DEF 86;
ARMSTRONG Twister EXT; DIS 86; BLOCK 92; OFF 96; DEF 91;
ARMSTRONG Attack 8 Type L OX (MEDIUM); PUSH 92; BLOCK 93; OFF 94; DEF 93; OFF 94 (p-ball tested)
ARMSTRONG Attack 8 Type L 1.8 mm (MEDIUM); PUSH 91; BLOCK 92; OFF 93; DEF 91; OFF 93 (p-ball tested)
AVALOX Mo; DIS 75; BLOCK 81; OFF 87; DEF 83;
BOMB Hammer OX (SHORT); DIS 92; BLOCK 92; OFF 93; DEF 92; OFF 93 (p-ball tested)
BUTTERFLY Feint AG; DIS 81; BLOCK 86; OFF 89; DEF 85;
BUTTERFLY Feint-Soft; DIS 82; BLOCK 87; OFF 88; DEF 84;
BUTTERFLY Feint Long II; DIS 85; BLOCK 85; OFF 87; DEF 87;
BUTTERFLY Feint Long III; DIS 82; BLOCK 85; OFF 90; DEF 87;
CTT National Pogo; DIS 87; BLOCK 87; OFF 90; DEF 88;
DAWEI 388C-1 OX (MEDIUM) DIS 89; BLOCK 90; OFF 91; DEF89; OFF 91 (p-ball tested)
DAWEI 388D; DIS 85; BLOCK 89; OFF 91; DEF 88;
DAWEI 388D-1; DIS 82;BLOCK 90; OFF 92; DEF 87;
DER MATERIALSPEZIALIST Breakout 1.5 mm sponge (SHORT) DIS 89; BLOCK 88; OFF 90; DEF87; OFF 90 (p-ball tested)
DOUBLE FISH 1615 (Hard); DIS 82; BLOCK 87; OFF 87; DEF 83;
DR NEUBAUER Fighter; DIS 88; BLOCK 88;OFF 89; DEF 88;
DR NEUBAUER Monster Classic; DIS 86; BLOCK 86; OFF 88; DEF 86;
FRIENDSHIP RITC 755-2; DIS 87; BLOCK 88; OFF 90; DEF 87;
FRIENDSHIP RITC 837; DIS 86; BLOCK 87; OFF 88; DEF 86;
GIANT DRAGON Giant Long Soft; DIS 83; BLOCK 84;OFF 88; DEF 85;
GLOBE Mo Wang DIS 91; BLOCK 91; OFF 92; DEF 91;
HALLMARK Friction Special 2; DIS 86; BLOCK 87; OFF 89; DEF 85;
JAPTEC DL-01; DIS 88; BLOCK 88; OFF 89; DEF 85;
JUIC Leggy R; DIS 88; BLOCK 88; OFF 91; DEF 84;
METEOR 8512; DIS 83; BLOCK 87; OFF 89; DEF 86;
NEXY Chaos; DIS 85; BLOCK 91; OFF 92; DEF 86;
NIMATSU Zerberus; DIS 86; BLOCK 87; OFF 89; DEF 89;
NITTAKU Screw One (OX); DIS 87; BLOCK 89; OFF 91; DEF 90;
NITTAKU Moristo LP; DIS 86; BLOCK 88; OFF 90; DEF 86;
PALIO CK531A; DIS 85; BLOCK 90; OFF 90; DEF 87;
PALIO WP 1013 OX (MEDIUM); DIS 94; BLOCK 93; OFF 95; DEF 94; OFF 95 (p-ball tested)
PRASHIDA 1615; DIS 84; BLOCK 88; OFF 89; DEF 86;
SANWEI Code; DIS 86; BLOCK 87; OFF 88; DEF 88;
SWORD Scylla; DIS 84; BLOCK 87; OFF 88; 88;
TIBHAR Grass; DIS 87; BLOCK 88; OFF 89; DEF 89;
TSP Curl P-2; DIS 88; BLOCK 88; 8OFF 9; DEF 88;
TSP Curl P-H; DIS 89; BLOCK 89; OFF 91; DEF 90;
TSP Super Spinpips 1.0 mm (MEDIUM); DIS 91; BLOCK 92; OFF 93; DEF 92; OFF 93 (p-ball tested)
XIYING 979; DIS 88; BLOCK 88; OFF 89; DEF 87;
XIYING 889 OX (SHORT); DIS 92; BLOCK 92; OFF 94; DEF 90; OFF 94 (p-ball tested)
YASAKA Phantom 007; DIS 91; BLOCK 91; OFF 92; DEF 91;
YASAKA Phantom 009; DIS 88; BLOCK 91; OFF 92; DEF 89;
YASAKA Phantom 0011; DIS 93; BLOCK 95; OFF 96; DEF 94;

DEF
AIR Upupupup US; DIS 84; BLOCK 84; OFF 86; DEF 90;
AMSIR Sensation; DIS 70; BLOCK 79; OFF 83; DEF 87;
ANDRO LP-22; DIS 75; BLOCK 82; OFF 87; DEF 92;
DAWEI 388C-1 1.8 mm (MEDIUM) DIS 88; BLOCK 89; OFF 91; DEF 92; DEF 91 (p-ball tested)
DER MATERIALSPEZIALIST Superwall OX (LONG) DIS 91; BLOCK 89; OFF 92; DEF 93; DEF 92 (p-ball tested)
DER MATERIALSPEZIALIST Undertaker OX (LONG) DIS 91; BLOCK 88; OFF 90; DEF 92; DEF 91 (p-ball tested)
DONIC Alligator Def; DIS 82; BLOCK 85; OFF 85; DEF 87;
DONIC Spike P1 1.5 mm (LONG); DIS 92, BLOCK 91, OFF 91, DEF 92; DEF 92 (p-ball tested)
DONIC Spike 2 OX (LONG); DIS 90, BLOCK 90, OFF 91, DEF 93; DEF 92 (p-ball tested)
DONIC Piranja FD TEC; DIS 82; BLOCK 87; OFF 89; DEF 89;
DOUBLE FISH 1615 (Soft); DIS 86; BLOCK 87; OFF 88; DEF 90;
FRIENDSHIP R.I.T.C. 729 Dr. Evil 1.0 mm (MEDIUM) DIS 91; BLOCK 91; OFF 91; DEF 93; DEF 93 (p-ball tested)
GLOBE 979; DIS 87; BLOCK 87; OFF 91; DEF 92;
HAIFU Octopus OX (LONG) DIS 89; BLOCK 90; OFF 91; DEF 92; DEF 92 (p-ball tested)
JOOLA Octopus; DIS 86; BLOCK 89; OFF 90; DEF 91;
LION Claw; DIS 85; BLOCK 87; OFF 88; DEF 90;
METEOR 845 OX; DIS 91; BLOCK 93; OFF 94; DEF 95;
NITTAKU Screw; DIS 81; BLOCK 85; OFF 87; DEF 89;
SAVIGA 27 1.5 mm (LONG); DIS 92, BLOCK 85, OFF 87, DEF 93; DEF 91 (p-ball tested)
SPINLORD Stachelfeuer; DIS 86; BLOCK 88; OFF 88; DEF 90;
SPINLORD Degu II 1.0 mm (SHORT); DIS 92, BLOCK 93, OFF 94, DEF 95; DEF 95 (p-ball tested)
TIBHAR Grass D.TecS 1.2 mm (LONG); DIS 88; BLOCK 86; OFF 89; DEF 93; DEF 91 (p-ball tested)
TSP Curl P1-R 1.0 mm (LONG) DIS 87; BLOCK 61; OFF 88; DEF 90; DEF 89 (p-ball tested)

ALL
61 second WIND FT; DIS 92; BLOCK 93; OFF 93; DEF 92;
BOMB Hammer 2.0 mm sponge (SHORT); DIS 92; BLOCK 93; OFF 93; DEF 92; ALL 93 (p-ball tested)
BOMB Talent; DIS 81; BLOCK 74; OFF 81; DEF 84;
DAWEI Saviga V; DIS 87; BLOCK 91; OFF 89; DEF 92;
DINGO SWISS Zik-Zak OX (LONG) DIS 93; BLOCK 92; OFF 92; DEF 93; ALL 93 (p-ball tested)
DINGO SWISS Ding Yi 1.8 mm (SHORT) DIS 92; BLOCK 93; OFF 93; DEF 93; ALL 93 (p-ball tested)
DONIC Akkadi L1; DIS 89; BLOCK 86; OFF 86; DEF 89;
DONIC Akkadi L2; DIS 86; BLOCK 81; OFF 84; DEF 88;
Double Happiness C-7; DIS 84; BLOCK 88; OFF 85; DEF 90;
Double Happiness C-8; DIS 88; BLOCK 86; OFF 83; DEF 90;
Double Happiness Cloud & Fog III; DIS 87; BLOCK 82; 87; DEF 90;
DOUBLE FISH 820A OX (MEDIUM) DIS 93; BLOCK 94; OFF 95; DEF 93; ALL 94 (p-ball tested)
DR NEUBAUER Boomerang Classic; DIS 84; BLOCK 83; OFF 84; 87;
FRIENDSHIP RITC 755; DIS 88; BLOCK 87; OFF 84; DEF 89;
FRIENDSHIP Kokutaku 755; DIS 93; BLOCK 92; OFF 93; DEF 89;
GIANT DRAGON 8228A OX (MEDIUM); DIS 92; BLOCK 93; OFF 94; DEF 93; ALL 93 (p-ball tested)
GIANT DRAGON 8228A 1.0 (MEDIUM); DIS 93; BLOCK 93; OFF 94; DEF 94; ALL 94 (p-ball tested)
GIANT DRAGON Cropcircles; DIS 93; BLOCK 94; OFF 93; DEF 93;
GIANT DRAGON Snowflake; DIS 92; BLOCK OFF 93; DEF 92;
GIANT DRAGON Meteorite; DIS 87; BLOCK 82; OFF 85; DEF 85;
GLOBE Mo Wang II DIS 91; BLOCK 92; OFF 93; DEF 93;
GUO QIU MG Miracle Attack; DIS 90; BLOCK 89; OFF 91; DEF 87;
GUO QIU MG Miracle Loop; DIS 91; BLOCK 88; OFF 89; DEF 88;
HAIFU Octopus 1.0 mm (LONG) DIS 91; BLOCK 92; OFF 92; DEF 91; ALL 92 (p-ball tested)
HALLMARK Frustration; DIS 87; BLOCK 86; OFF 88; DEF 84;
JOOLA Badman; DIS 84; BLOCK 83; OFF 88; DEF 84;
JOOLA Shark; DIS 86; BLOCK 85; OFF 87; DEF 85;
KOKUTAKU Tuple 911; DIS 83; BLOCK 82; OFF 84; DEF 87;
METEOR 9012; DIS 88; BLOCK 91; OFF DEF 89;
METEOR 71-1; DIS 90; BLOCK 87; OFF 92; DEF 88;
METEOR 71-2; DIS 88; BLOCK 87; OFF 84; DEF 88;
MILKY WAY Neptune; DIS 93; BLOCK 89; 89; DEF 93;
MILKY WAY Neptune Soft; DIS 94; BLOCK 93; OFF 93; DEF 94;
NITTAKU Wallest One (OX); DIS 93; BLOCK 94; OFF 93; DEF 93;
SPINLORD Dornenglanz OX; DIS 90; BLOCK 90; OFF 90; DEF 89;
STIGA Destroyer; DIS 87; BLOCK 86; 8OFF 9; DEF 90;
TIBHAR Extra Long; DIS 87; BLOCK 86; OFF 88; DEF 90;
MILKY WAY Pluto; DIS 80; BLOCK 80; OFF 77; DEF 84;
TIBHAR Mythik; DIS 89; BLOCK 90; OFF 89;DEF 91;
TSP Curl P-3; DIS 91; BLOCK 90; OFF 92; DEF 91;
TSP Curl P-4 OX; DIS 92; BLOCK 93, OFF 94; 94;
TUTTLE Summer - 3C 1.5 mm (SHORT); DIS 91; BLOCK 92; OFF 93; DEF 93; ALL 92 (p-ball tested)
Author:  theOldDuffer [ 03 Jan 2011, 01:19 ]
Post subject:  Re: Great review about all available long pips rubbers
Quote:
Dear long pips friends

The following is the result of long lasting tests and a sort of summary of these tests with long pips. I often tried and played different long pips and was never totally happy with my equipment. So I began to study this stuff closer. I measured all pips: geometry, distances, tackiness, springiness, aspect ratio and so on. I hoped to read much into understanding the abilities of the pimples. But these helped not very much. So I decided to test all long pimples at the ball machine.


Great Job.
tOD
Author:  nathanso [ 03 Jan 2011, 02:31 ]
Post subject:  Re: Great survey about all available long pips rubbers
Fantastic! Thank you for posting this and the time you obviously spent on this project. I now have a lot of reading to do..!
Author:  dwruck [ 03 Jan 2011, 03:33 ]
Post subject:  Re: Great survey about all available long pips rubbers
Wow, this is impressive. I'm surprised that CTT National Pogo did not make any of the "recommended" lists. I would have thought it would have made the "allaround game with blocking and attacking strokes" list.
Author:  Def-attack [ 03 Jan 2011, 03:35 ]
Post subject:  Re: Great survey about all available long pips rubbers
Fantastic effort! I just wished it would have been done before - would have saved me some money :D On the other hand, it is kind of fun to test an conclude... Now I just have to test all those rubbers you found good for chopping :sweat:
Author:  mynamenotbob [ 03 Jan 2011, 05:47 ]
Post subject:  Re: Great survey about all available long pips rubbers
Wow! Epic project and useful information.

Of course, since the majority of these were tested with sponge, the properties in OX could be quite different. Very good info for sponge players though.
Author:  martinspin [ 03 Jan 2011, 07:25 ]
Post subject:  Re: Great survey about all available long pips rubbers
mynamenotbob wrote:
Wow! Epic project and useful information.

Of course, since the majority of these were tested with sponge, the properties in OX could be quite different. Very good info for sponge players though.


OX on slower and softer blades is perfect in my eyes. On faster and harder blades tacky pimples need spong.
Author:  haggisv [ 03 Jan 2011, 07:33 ]
Post subject:  Re: Great survey about all available long pips rubbers
Fantastic effort martinspin!!! :clap: :clap: :clap:

I've stickied your post, as it will make an excellent reference!
Author:  martinspin [ 03 Jan 2011, 07:35 ]
Post subject:  Re: Great survey about all available long pips rubbers
haggisv wrote:
Fantastic effort martinspin!!! :clap: :clap: :clap:

I've stickied your post, as it will make an excellent reference!


Thanks, Alex :D
Author:  haggisv [ 03 Jan 2011, 07:41 ]
Post subject:  Re: Great survey about all available long pips rubbers
Just a questions... for the "blade / rubber combos" you list some rubbers as very grippy and some as not grippy. The very grippy are on fast blades, the ungrippy on slow blades.

What does the grip refer to? I notice you have Giant Long as a very grippy pip for fast blades, but giant long soft (which has the same topsheet but has a dampening sponge) as very ungrippy. Can you explain what they refers to please?
Author:  martinspin [ 03 Jan 2011, 08:00 ]
Post subject:  Re: Great survey about all available long pips rubbers
haggisv wrote:
Just a questions... for the "blade / rubber combos" you list some rubbers as very grippy and some as not grippy. The very grippy are on fast blades, the ungrippy on slow blades.

What does the grip refer to? I notice you have Giant Long as a very grippy pip for fast blades, but giant long soft (which has the same topsheet but has a dampening sponge) as very ungrippy. Can you explain what they refers to please?


I measured the grip like on the following picture. I increased the angle an stopped when the plate began to move. I made this procedure with two weigth (250 g / 1000 g) and found out, that there can be a big difference between the gip of the surface (lower weigth) and the grip of the necks (higher weigth). I caculated the average of the two measurements.

Image


I also measured the aspect ratio of each covering. There is quite a differece between the topsheet of the Giant Long and Giant Long Soft.

Giant Long has an aspect ratio of 1,1 (1,6/1,4) and a thicker ground layer (0,4 mm).
Giant Long Soft has an aspect ratio of 1,1 (1,7/1,6) and a thinner ground layer (0,3 mm).

I think the thinner ground layer of the Giant Long Soft make the difference.
Author:  haggisv [ 03 Jan 2011, 08:08 ]
Post subject:  Re: Great survey about all available long pips rubbers
Wow very interesting way of measuring martinspin... you continue to impress me! :oops: :lol:

I'm surprised there is such a difference in aspect ratio of those 2 rubbers. Since they only have a single ITTF approval for this rubber, you'd have to wonder if it's just lack of quality control...
Author:  martinspin [ 03 Jan 2011, 08:13 ]
Post subject:  Re: Great survey about all available long pips rubbers
haggisv wrote:
Wow very interesting way of measuring martinspin... you continue to impress me! :oops: :lol:

I'm surprised there is such a difference in aspect ratio of those 2 rubbers. Since they only have a single ITTF approval for this rubber, you'd have to wonder if it's just lack of quality control...


Hey Alex

Sorry, the grip of the Giant Long Soft is lower but not so much. It was a mistake by me and I corrected it. Thanks for your input :)
Author:  mynamenotbob [ 03 Jan 2011, 08:24 ]
Post subject:  Re: Great survey about all available long pips rubbers
martinspin wrote:
mynamenotbob wrote:
Wow! Epic project and useful information.

Of course, since the majority of these were tested with sponge, the properties in OX could be quite different. Very good info for sponge players though.


OX on slower and softer blades is perfect in my eyes. On faster and harder blades tacky pimples need spong.

This may be true in some cases, but Tibhar Grass D.Tecs in OX and on a hard blade is widely considered the most disturbing pip there is at the table, while with sponge you rate it as equally disturbing as the relatively harmless Tibhar Extra Long. :o

Another highly disruptive pip in OX is Bomb Talent, which was rated as one of the lowest in disturbance with sponge.

So while I'm sure your findings are valid when using sponge, in my opinion I don't think they can be accepted as accurate for OX players.
Author:  martinspin [ 03 Jan 2011, 08:48 ]
Post subject:  Re: Great survey about all available long pips rubbers
mynamenotbob wrote:
martinspin wrote:
mynamenotbob wrote:
Wow! Epic project and useful information.

Of course, since the majority of these were tested with sponge, the properties in OX could be quite different. Very good info for sponge players though.


OX on slower and softer blades is perfect in my eyes. On faster and harder blades tacky pimples need spong.

This may be true in some cases, but Tibhar Grass D.Tecs in OX and on a hard blade is widely considered the most disturbing pip there is at the table, while with sponge you rate it as equally disturbing as the relatively harmless Tibhar Extra Long. :o

Another highly disruptive pip in OX is Bomb Talent, which was rated as one of the lowest in disturbance with sponge.

So while I'm sure your findings are valid when using sponge, in my opinion I don't think they can be accepted as accurate for OX players.


Your are right. OX or spong depends on the rubber, blade and style. Some rubbers like the D.TecS can be played in OX at every distance and other long pimples need spong. I think D.TecS is an exception under the long pimples coverings :D
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