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PostPosted: 16 May 2016, 11:43 
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ridderz65 wrote:
When playing a chopping game modern defence, would Hellfire or Easy P suit the style better?


Hellfire pips have more friction, because the pip tip has rough surface while Easy P smooth


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PostPosted: 10 Jun 2016, 10:21 
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I have started to use Hellfire against certain type of opponents, especially those who play with little spin. I tend to push off the table against no spin players with Talon. Talon is the best against spin but Hellfire has great control against no spin balls. Started beating players that beat me when I play Talon.

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PostPosted: 11 Jun 2016, 00:53 
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very good observation PB...

never thought of changing the lp for a different opponent...

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PostPosted: 11 Jun 2016, 02:57 
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111Iceman111 wrote:
very good observation PB...

never thought of changing the lp for a different opponent...


Talon is horrible against dead balls as the ball tends to float long off the table on pushes against no spin. I usually push aggressively.. It's almost a attack type shot and with talon, I push a lot off the table.. Talon has a flat trajectory while Hellfire has a lot higher trajectory but the ball tends to come down and stop and is very uncomfortable for those types opponents..
A couple of weeks ago, I lost to a player with Talon 0:3.. Played him 2 more times with the Hellfire and beat him 3:0 both times..

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PostPosted: 11 Jun 2016, 08:14 
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so, why not stay on hellfire? against all?

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PostPosted: 12 Jun 2016, 04:08 
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111Iceman111 wrote:
so, why not stay on hellfire? against all?

It's not good against loopers.. Ball comes off too high, makes it easier for them to go for the kill.
I like Talon a lot better if I play against a typical offensive player, especially due to the lower trajectory of Talon.

BTW, won 2 more times against the same player who often beats me when I play with Talon. It's now 4:0 against him with Hellfire.. (last match went 5 games, the other 3 were 3:0)
My game with the pips is fairly aggressive with Talon as I block my opponents topspin, producing underspin. This forces the opponent to push and then I aggressively push with Talon as a offensive shot. That shot does not work well with Hellfire. I use Hellfire against opponents who are patient and mix in dead balls.. like other long pips players.. Against all others, Talon is better.

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PostPosted: 12 Jun 2016, 06:15 
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i found hellfire to be good at all but not best in one thing... similar as dawei 388D-1
very good allround but vs some specific styles it weaker and vs some other better (depends on ur preferences)

so it we need,choppers find a pip that is covering our most weaker spot (for me its playing vs high skilled players)
so for amatauers where spin is lower and game is slower i prefer grass dtecs
but vs very high skill players i prefer dornenglanz
and i still choosed dornen becuse vs high players i need to have top quality shots and vs amateurs i dont need it cause i have many others tools to win

so my opinion is go for ur best.. if u can beat higher skill player than go it even if is it hellfire or other pip (for me hellfire isnt enough)

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PostPosted: 12 Jun 2016, 21:24 
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Pushblocker wrote:
111Iceman111 wrote:
so, why not stay on hellfire? against all?

It's not good against loopers.. Ball comes off too high, makes it easier for them to go for the kill.
I like Talon a lot better if I play against a typical offensive player, especially due to the lower trajectory of Talon.

BTW, won 2 more times against the same player who often beats me when I play with Talon. It's now 4:0 against him with Hellfire.. (last match went 5 games, the other 3 were 3:0)
My game with the pips is fairly aggressive with Talon as I block my opponents topspin, producing underspin. This forces the opponent to push and then I aggressively push with Talon as a offensive shot. That shot does not work well with Hellfire. I use Hellfire against opponents who are patient and mix in dead balls.. like other long pips players.. Against all others, Talon is better.


so if you would pull that aggressive push against underspin out of the equation, wouldnt hellfire be better?

in other word, if you would need to survive good opening shot from a good player and make them push the ball after 1st or 2nd spin, and then attack that push with your FH (thats my style, i rarely push with lp), would then hellfire be better? (dont get lost in that sentence, i overcomplicated it a bit lol)

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PostPosted: 12 Jun 2016, 22:16 
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111Iceman111 wrote:
Pushblocker wrote:
111Iceman111 wrote:
so, why not stay on hellfire? against all?

It's not good against loopers.. Ball comes off too high, makes it easier for them to go for the kill.
I like Talon a lot better if I play against a typical offensive player, especially due to the lower trajectory of Talon.

BTW, won 2 more times against the same player who often beats me when I play with Talon. It's now 4:0 against him with Hellfire.. (last match went 5 games, the other 3 were 3:0)
My game with the pips is fairly aggressive with Talon as I block my opponents topspin, producing underspin. This forces the opponent to push and then I aggressively push with Talon as a offensive shot. That shot does not work well with Hellfire. I use Hellfire against opponents who are patient and mix in dead balls.. like other long pips players.. Against all others, Talon is better.


so if you would pull that aggressive push against underspin out of the equation, wouldnt hellfire be better?

in other word, if you would need to survive good opening shot from a good player and make them push the ball after 1st or 2nd spin, and then attack that push with your FH (thats my style, i rarely push with lp), would then hellfire be better? (dont get lost in that sentence, i overcomplicated it a bit lol)


HELLFIRE is better against no spin and Talon is better against spin. My game is all based on my aggressive push which is my best shot. Playing HELLFIRE, I take away my best weapon. The reason why it works so well against certain players is because that push is not very useful against certain players as they just push back my aggressive push and I also end up pushing off the table if they mix in no spin.
I don't use my forehand a lot except for the occasional 3rd ball attack if my opponent misreads my serve and to kill a high ball.. i do not attack a lot with my forehand. Hellfire is probably better if used in combination with a good forehand. I can't say for sure as it's not my playing style. All that I use it for is against players who play spinless or mix in spinless balls. What it also works well is when I misread the amount of underspin on a serve. If I misread heavy underspin as moderate underspin, I will put the ball in the net with Talon due to the lower trajectory. HELLFIRE is a lot more foregiving for that as the trajectory is higher. Hellfire produces a completely different curve..

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PostPosted: 12 Jun 2016, 23:23 
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garbol wrote:
...
so for amatauers where spin is lower and game is slower i prefer grass dtecs
but vs very high skill players i prefer dornenglanz ...


that's pretty much my experience with grass dtecs. against players who are not as good as me I can easily frustrate them and win easily. I don't think I have ever won a match using grass dtecs against players better than me while I have some success with dornenglanz and other pips.

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PostPosted: 13 Jun 2016, 08:40 
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Pushblocker wrote:
HELLFIRE is better against no spin and Talon is better against spin. My game is all based on my aggressive push which is my best shot. Playing HELLFIRE, I take away my best weapon. The reason why it works so well against certain players is because that push is not very useful against certain players as they just push back my aggressive push and I also end up pushing off the table if they mix in no spin.
I don't use my forehand a lot except for the occasional 3rd ball attack if my opponent misreads my serve and to kill a high ball.. i do not attack a lot with my forehand. Hellfire is probably better if used in combination with a good forehand. I can't say for sure as it's not my playing style. All that I use it for is against players who play spinless or mix in spinless balls. What it also works well is when I misread the amount of underspin on a serve. If I misread heavy underspin as moderate underspin, I will put the ball in the net with Talon due to the lower trajectory. HELLFIRE is a lot more foregiving for that as the trajectory is higher. Hellfire produces a completely different curve..


i see, tnx...thats what i wanted to hear...so hf is better for me i think then....

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PostPosted: 20 Jun 2016, 03:51 
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How is modern defence chopping with OX Hellfire? I watched a video made by Sauer & Tröger about Hellfire and I saw him chopping with hellfire and it looked like he was using the OX. The opponent was putting a lot of pushes and loops into the net. I'm guessing OX Hellfire gives great effect when digging chops?


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PostPosted: 20 Jun 2016, 06:03 
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ridderz65 wrote:
How is modern defence chopping with OX Hellfire?


I've never used Hellfire. However, I can tell you the answer. Modern defence chopping with OX Hellfire is fine.

Quote:
I watched a video made by Sauer & Tröger about Hellfire and I saw him chopping with hellfire and it looked like he was using the OX. The opponent was putting a lot of pushes and loops into the net. I'm guessing OX Hellfire gives great effect when digging chops?


Maybe. Or maybe the opponent isn't such a good player. Maybe Pascal is a great chopper.

You're still looking for someone to say: Hey, Ridderz, you should use Hellfire in OX - it will solve all your problems! Suddenly your chops will be LOADED with spin! Weak players will cower before your evil spin reversal. Strong players will be unable to probe your backhand with fast no-spin balls, and blast your returns! Never again will you hit balls into the net! All your pushes will be low over the net, and of just the right length to cause indecision!

Unfortunately, anyone who says that to you will be lying. Or just winding you up.

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PostPosted: 21 Oct 2016, 16:41 
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Hi Guys,

After a couple of poor results I decided my six year old sheet of DTecS was finally letting me down. I have decided to switch to Hellfire ox red on a Tibhar Stratus Powerdefense with Tibhar Evolution black 2.0mm on my forehand. Gone for a straight handle as I am determined to start twiddling.

I hope the set up arrives today for weekend practice and possibly a match on Monday night.

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PostPosted: 29 Oct 2016, 05:26 
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Hi Everybody,

I had a two hour practice session with Hellfire last Sunday. My match on Monday was postponed unfortunately.

I found the pips to be gripper than my very old sheet of DTecS and very fast initially. However as I got used to the setup as a whole I liked it more and more.

It is early days but a colleague with whom I practiced and who is a coach felt the Hellfire had less effect but more control than DTecS. By the end of our session I was blocking very short off heavy topspin and my fast push was beginning to work.

The rubber is great for what I call emergency blocks and I was serving some good disguised pip balls. Clearly a very good quality rubber but I hope to play possibly five matches in quick succession to bed it in!

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