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Hellfire - new LP by Sauer & Tröger!
https://ooakforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=22474		 Page 10 of 13
Author:  auzcar [ 02 Dec 2013, 04:21 ]
Post subject:  Re: Hellfire - new LP by Sauer & Tröger!
I had a session with the Hellfire on the VKM a few days ago but I don't think this will be the LP for me, felt like I could control the Dornenglanz better when attacking underspin which is why I tried HF in the first place and since it was that shot that made me want to try Hellfire in the first place it probably won't be a better choice for me. IMO Dornenglanz is a bit better in the defensive strokes with the exception that you can create more spin on your own with it when chopping.
Author:  Geddk [ 02 Dec 2013, 04:39 ]
Post subject:  Re: Hellfire - new LP by Sauer & Tröger!
Try HF on a stiff, hard blade with medium speed.
I have tried HF on VKM and I didn't like it as you.

Cheers
Geddk
Author:  auzcar [ 06 Dec 2013, 20:45 ]
Post subject:  Re: Hellfire - new LP by Sauer & Tröger!
Gave the Hellfire another go last night, it worked better and for some reason it seems to work very well for me in matches, can't really put my fingers on why though. It's probably because I can do more with the ball compared to Dorneglanz, however, I'm popping up a lot more blocks and chops since it has a higher throw than Dornenglanz. Somebody said earlier in the thread that Hellfire is very linear and I'm not sure I agree with that, Dornenglanz is definitely more linear IMO. The results in the matches might just be because I had a good night though, will have to test further so say for sure.

I feel like I'm in sort of a play style crisis, and to be honest I don't feel like I've had a clear game plan for the past 4-5 years, not even when I was at my peak and played really well.
Author:  Bulldog [ 07 Dec 2013, 10:05 ]
Post subject:  Re: Hellfire - new LP by Sauer & Tröger!
Hi auzcar

Which type of strokes did you use when you attacked with the Hellfire?

Bulldog
Author:  auzcar [ 07 Dec 2013, 22:25 ]
Post subject:  Re: Hellfire - new LP by Sauer & Tröger!
Bulldog wrote:
Hi auzcar

Which type of strokes did you use when you attacked with the Hellfire?

Bulldog


Mostly the forward lifting side-swiping stroke on backpin but also some quick driving motions. Had another session with it today and it definitely felt better, it's definitely easier to block harder hits compared to Dornenglanz, just like Variatio felt as well. Will persist with it for at least a week more before I evaluate it but it keeps giving very good results in match play whilst feeling a bit unpredictable at times when doing drills. Probably just have to get used to it I guess, the blade angle is definitely different compared to Dornenglanz.
Author:  theOldDuffer [ 08 Dec 2013, 12:27 ]
Post subject:  Re: Hellfire - new LP by Sauer & Tröger!
auzcar wrote:
Bulldog wrote:
Hi auzcar

Which type of strokes did you use when you attacked with the Hellfire?

Bulldog


Mostly the forward lifting side-swiping stroke on backpin but also some quick driving motions. Had another session with it today and it definitely felt better, it's definitely easier to block harder hits compared to Dornenglanz, just like Variatio felt as well. Will persist with it for at least a week more before I evaluate it but it keeps giving very good results in match play whilst feeling a bit unpredictable at times when doing drills. Probably just have to get used to it I guess, the blade angle is definitely different compared to Dornenglanz.


What do you have to do differently with the angles?
tOD
Author:  theOldDuffer [ 08 Dec 2013, 12:27 ]
Post subject:  Re: Hellfire - new LP by Sauer & Tröger!
auzcar wrote:
Bulldog wrote:
Hi auzcar

Which type of strokes did you use when you attacked with the Hellfire?

Bulldog


Mostly the forward lifting side-swiping stroke on backpin but also some quick driving motions. Had another session with it today and it definitely felt better, it's definitely easier to block harder hits compared to Dornenglanz, just like Variatio felt as well. Will persist with it for at least a week more before I evaluate it but it keeps giving very good results in match play whilst feeling a bit unpredictable at times when doing drills. Probably just have to get used to it I guess, the blade angle is definitely different compared to Dornenglanz.


What do you have to do differently with the angles?
tOD
Author:  auzcar [ 09 Dec 2013, 00:53 ]
Post subject:  Re: Hellfire - new LP by Sauer & Tröger!
Due to the grip Hellfire requires a more closed blade angle when blocking and a bit more open when pushing compared to Dornenglanz. It's like always when changing LP, you need some time to adjust and to keep the balls low over the net. Starting to really like it in the attack though, works very well to flip/drive like does Sun Jian Fei on short underspin balls.
Author:  Geddk [ 09 Dec 2013, 04:01 ]
Post subject:  Re: Hellfire - new LP by Sauer & Tröger!
I don't have that same feeling regarding those 2 LP's....

To me DG becomes grip-pier than HF when the
ball is sinking into the pips. And that is actually one
of the things I like best about DG. Light brush to the
ball feels almost frictions-less. :P

Heavy strokes it acts almost like an inverted.

Atm. these 2 LP's is my favourites with D.Tecs and Joola Badman.

Cheers

Geddk
Author:  auzcar [ 09 Dec 2013, 20:26 ]
Post subject:  Re: Hellfire - new LP by Sauer & Tröger!
Geddk wrote:
I don't have that same feeling regarding those 2 LP's....

To me DG becomes grip-pier than HF when the
ball is sinking into the pips. And that is actually one
of the things I like best about DG. Light brush to the
ball feels almost frictions-less. :P

Heavy strokes it acts almost like an inverted.

Atm. these 2 LP's is my favourites with D.Tecs and Joola Badman.

Cheers

Geddk


Then we have to agree to disagree ;)

IMO Hellfire is grippier in all strokes but it's also slower which makes it easier to block harder hits. When blocking a harder hit with Dornenglanz it's more common that the ball bites and goes long but IMO this is because the higher speed and shorter dwell time makes it harder to control.
Author:  auzcar [ 11 Dec 2013, 20:08 ]
Post subject:  Re: Hellfire - new LP by Sauer & Tröger!
Have had another two sessions with the Hellfire and I like it more and more, I've got used to the angle and can keep the ball much lower now with the exception of reflex shots, but as always that comes with time and practice. The attacking shots that I had some troubles with in the beginning is now very safe, more so than with Dornenglanz, not as effective though.

I feel like I have more control in every stroke compared to Dornenglanz, except in chopping, but I'm getting there. Dornenglanz is more effective though and harder for the opponent to read but I've realised that control is far more important to me on the BH since I'm primarily a FH player.

Will as of now change to the Hellfire on my main setup and stick to it during this season if the stupid EJ virus can keep calm.
Author:  isean [ 07 Apr 2014, 10:13 ]
Post subject:  Re: Hellfire - new LP by Sauer & Tröger!
What hardness (degree) of sponge?
Author:  Bulldog [ 29 Jun 2014, 23:53 ]
Post subject:  Re: Hellfire - new LP by Sauer & Tröger!
I played a push blocker at our club this morning who has just switched to Hellfire in ox black which he uses on the backhand of a Tibhar Stratus Powerdefense. He was using Grass DTecS black ox on the same blade. He believes he is going to achieve better control but I think he is going to lose some effect. He was dead blocking and punching pretty well. I found him far more difficult with DTecS but I am using a faster blade now and my pips shots to his forehand inverted rubber were difficult for him to handle.

He then played a left hander with a wickedly fast spin laden loop and only lost deuce in the fifth so perhaps it will work for him against that type of player.

Bulldog
Author:  auzcar [ 01 Oct 2014, 06:32 ]
Post subject:  Re: Hellfire - new LP by Sauer & Tröger!
After deciding to switch to Hellfire I bought another sheet to have on my backup blade as well, and to my surprise the new sheet was quite different from the old one. The new one had a thinner base sheet, was more shiny and also more transparent. It played a bit different as well, slower and with more dwell/less catapult. It was even more controlled than the older sheet but maybe a tad bit less reversal, but that might be because the old one is just that, old.

Have anyone else encountered this? Is your sheet shiny or matte/dull? If you look at the base sheet that is.

EDIT: I haven't decided how I feel about this yet, didn't get to try it out in any matches, only drills and hitting. I feel a bit uneasy since I played pretty well this weekend and I felt really confident and settled with the setup, which is a feeling I seldom get nowadays.
Author:  AA [ 01 Oct 2014, 06:41 ]
Post subject:  Re: Hellfire - new LP by Sauer & Tröger!
yes, this was reported on several german websites/forums like this one and was documented with pictures.
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