OOAK Table Tennis Forum

Steven.
Why you have chosen T80-FX, but not T05-FX? It is softer on J.S.H?

isean,

The hardness of T80-FX is identical to that of T05-FX, since the topsheet and sponge are made of the same material. However, the larger pip spacing for T80-FX makes that rubber feel softer.

There are several reasons why I prefer T80-FX. These include (1) the larger pip spacing which results in greater passive control (see the Science of Tenergy video) which I prefer when chopping fast loops with lots of topspin (one can still generate a tremendous amount of spin with T80-FX), (2) the softer feel also allows for greater feedback when chopping (see the excellent post on feedback by Kees at viewtopic.php?f=43&t=18107 ), (3) the lower throw when counter-looping at mid-distance and far from the table, and (4) the greater speed when counter-looping at mid-distance and far from the table. However, this is my personal preference. There are plenty of modern defenders that prefer other forms of Tenergy on the JSH blade. My impression is that the most popular Tenergies on the JSH blade are T05 and T64.

Note that this post was edited on March 13.

Steven

_________________
Butterfly Joo Se Hyuk
Butterfly Tenergy 80-FX 1.9mm
TSP Curl P1R 1.4-1.7mm
--------------
Returned to table tennis September 2011
Canada National Team Member, 1973-1975
--------------
1972-1987
Brickell Balsa/Birch 3-ply Blade
Yasaka Mark V 1.5mm
Joola Toni Hold AntiTopspin 2.5mm

Which are specialized Tenergies in contrary to T80, IMO the best Tenergy for us mortals.

I suspect the water on rubber behaviour change is just the inevitable build up of grease and oil on the rubber surface. Rubber is waterproof, so I think it would just be about other substances affecting the surface tension of the water.

_________________
Timo Boll ALC ST
FH Tibhar Evolution MX-P Max
BH Tibhar Evolution FX-S 1.8
185g

Lorre,

I hadn't thought of T80 in this way, but it certainly makes sense. However, it is interesting that 40 years ago the two best loopers in the world, Istvan Jonyer and Dragutin Surbek, used Tackiness D and Sriver-L, respectively. Those rubbers are so much slower and produce much less spin than any of the Tenergies. Their loops were very powerful with plenty of topspin. But, they were tremendous athletes too.

Steven

_________________
Butterfly Joo Se Hyuk
Butterfly Tenergy 80-FX 1.9mm
TSP Curl P1R 1.4-1.7mm
--------------
Returned to table tennis September 2011
Canada National Team Member, 1973-1975
--------------
1972-1987
Brickell Balsa/Birch 3-ply Blade
Yasaka Mark V 1.5mm
Joola Toni Hold AntiTopspin 2.5mm

so_devo,

Thanks for your interesting explanation. I would expect that grease and oil would alter the surface tension, but it is outside my background to know why. Does your answer imply that a good cleaning with a rubber cleaner would restore the behavior of the water on the surface of the rubber, i.e., water accumulation in particular locations, when it is cleaned?

Steven

_________________
Butterfly Joo Se Hyuk
Butterfly Tenergy 80-FX 1.9mm
TSP Curl P1R 1.4-1.7mm
--------------
Returned to table tennis September 2011
Canada National Team Member, 1973-1975
--------------
1972-1987
Brickell Balsa/Birch 3-ply Blade
Yasaka Mark V 1.5mm
Joola Toni Hold AntiTopspin 2.5mm

Given good technique those rubbers are still capable of producing significant spin. However, the game has become faster and looping a lot easier with current speed glue rubbers. Given the current time to react to a loop you need equipment that with a short stroke or even a passive stroke delivers significant spin. The new rubbers deliver that, while the old ones cannot.

However, disadvantage of these new rubbers is that nowadays talentless Chip and Dale from around the corner can produce significant topspin without having a decent technique. Compare it with music: how many celebrities can really sing? I find it harder for skilled people to stick out from the crowd nowadays, while people without skill are honoured for their skills (which they don't have).

_________________
There's always stuff to improve!

My blog on being a LP defender beyond 2000 USATT and the pips discrimination that comes along with that

Lorre,

I have noticed something similar. Back in 1974 (a long time ago), I was fortunate to have had to opportunity to play a match against Dragutin Surbek. His forehand loops were incredible, in terms of both spin and speed. When I returned to table tennis in 2011, I was very surprised to encounter table tennis players with USATT ratings of 2100-2200 producing loops with similar speed and spin to that of Dragutin Surbek (this is assuming that my memory of long ago is correct). This would be analogous to entering a table tennis club 40 years from now, and finding some of the better club players producing loops comparable to present-day Xu Xin.

On the other hand, I am able to do forehand loops with Tenergy 80-FX that are so much faster, with much more topspin and control than I ever could have imagined. For me, this is very enjoyable.

Steven

_________________
Butterfly Joo Se Hyuk
Butterfly Tenergy 80-FX 1.9mm
TSP Curl P1R 1.4-1.7mm
--------------
Returned to table tennis September 2011
Canada National Team Member, 1973-1975
--------------
1972-1987
Brickell Balsa/Birch 3-ply Blade
Yasaka Mark V 1.5mm
Joola Toni Hold AntiTopspin 2.5mm

Yes, I'm having the same dual feelings. However, I'd like the good use of equipment to pay off against those kind of players. With the 40mm celluloid ball this was still the case somewhat, but with the current plastic ball this is no longer the case. I hope the raise of the net height makes it, so technique will become more important again.

_________________
There's always stuff to improve!

My blog on being a LP defender beyond 2000 USATT and the pips discrimination that comes along with that