OOAK Table Tennis Forum

All, curious as to what you all have to say about this?

One of my bread and butter moves is to push (in the horizontal inverted sense) with both LP and Inverted twiddling a lot ala Chtchetinine. I typically only do this with P-1R 1.0mm sponge, whereas if I play ox I tend to only throw that in every now and again due to the lower grip.

I have found that many LP users do not perform that LP horizontal push vs. push at all.

If you do use it, when do you chose to use it what colors your choice as to whether to push with inverted or push with LP?

OX? Sponge?

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Blog: "Holy Chtchet!" ⇝

Projects: Player Equipment Grid ⇝ Comprehensive Thin Inverted Chopping Rubbers Grid ⇝ Please send me corrections or new submissions

I've been explicitly taught that attempting an inverted style push with even a grippy lp such as fl3 is a bad idea. As such, it's not a shot I play at all.


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Yasaka Sweden Classic | 802 OX | C8 OX
Check out my blog - LordCope's Latest Learning Log - 10+ years of accumulate mistakes!

Many choppers, particularly Chtchetinine, use this as a tactic to get popups or incite mistakes. If you watch him play, you'll see he does this all the time.

Now, if someone said not to do this with OX pips, I'd be more inclined to agree with that as they're far more predictable.

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Blog: "Holy Chtchet!" ⇝

Projects: Player Equipment Grid ⇝ Comprehensive Thin Inverted Chopping Rubbers Grid ⇝ Please send me corrections or new submissions

Both.

Depending on what I am attempting to do next....if I need speed I used the side swipe lp push.

If I need time I'll wait and do the inverted style push with a larger motion.

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Thanks! But what reasons do you have for doing an inverted-style push with the LP vs. twiddling and doing an actual inverted push with the smooth rubber?

_________________
Blog: "Holy Chtchet!" ⇝

Projects: Player Equipment Grid ⇝ Comprehensive Thin Inverted Chopping Rubbers Grid ⇝ Please send me corrections or new submissions

Glad this one came up,I was using the pips to push back against an inverted chopper in this weeks match,for 3 pushes this was ok as I waited for an opening to attack with f/h,if it went beyond 3 pushes the next one sailed off the end with exactly the same motions and effort and has me puzzled and I seem to remember Round Robin talking about this some time ago but forget if there was an explanation or solution?

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Tsp Black Balsa 3.0 Tenergy 05 1.9 388d ox black

I think that with ox pips the "inverted push" in unstable. I mostly roll or bumb the opponents underspin push back with topspin. It's most reliable shot.

I just had long match against chopper, who chopped ball to be and rolled it back. Long duels, but you just have to keep ball on the table.

With sponged pips the push against underspin is difficult to me keep tight, but it might be question of equipment choice.

I'll ask Adam when I see him tomorrow to remind me why, but he is most insistent. And for context, he's a modern defender, who played with FL3 for 15 years before changing to P1-R, and represented Poland in the Olympics, so he has some idea what he's talking about!

From memory, his perspective is that trying to play inverted strokes with LP is basically just playing a s*** inverted shot with a s*** inverted rubber. You're going to deliver a weak ball, which your opponent can punish.

If other high level players do it, there's obviously justification, and he may be simplifying for me, or it may be that it's only effective with very good technique. I'm not sure.

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Yasaka Sweden Classic | 802 OX | C8 OX
Check out my blog - LordCope's Latest Learning Log - 10+ years of accumulate mistakes!

Spin change. Speed change. Stroke size change....

Have options is a very good thing.

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I'd think the idea would be to confuse the other guy. Obviously the push (against backspin) with the long pips would have a lot less backspin (or maybe even topspin) and the push with inverted would have heavy backspin. The challenge, of course, is controlling your pushes - you can't really use the same stroke, the long pips will cause the ball to pop up if you do. But you can at least make it LOOK like an inverted push. But you'd have to be able to do both strokes interchangeably at any given time, on both forehand AND backhand, much easier said than done.

This is how I started out playing in the early 1980s - back then there was no two color rule and you could really do things to the other guy. Twiddle and serve with the long pips, for instance - almost guaranteed pop-up. Problem was I'd miss the kill about half the time.. And people started avoiding you because they hated constantly pushing the ball off the table.

Iskandar

Push with DG ox is very tricky to perform. That ball is always slow and either popup or dive inside the net.

I prefer to hit with the open blade or side sweep (less destructive, but more precise) and sometimes I roll drop shot just for variation. With the first two it is easy to keep the ball low and rubber junk factor would plays itself.

Full chop is easier to control then push, but it is obviously not very dangerous for an opponent.