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Dr N Gangster
https://ooakforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=31525		 Page 2 of 6
Author:  TraditionalTradesman [ 21 Sep 2017, 01:28 ]
Post subject:  Re: Dr N Gangster
mynamenotbob wrote:
Here's a shocker. I've been testing this and all the claims in the description are pretty much true!

I stuck it on one of my Barricade blades and it felt good right from the start. Great control. Good spin reversal. Perfect speed. Takes spin well. Takes hard hits well. Attacks well. Can execute all the normal long pips shots. Made some unforced errors due to not being used to it yet, but not that many.

My initial impression is for my game style this seems to be the best friction long pips I've tried so far. Don't know about the durability or whether I'll still love it in a month, but for now I can't wait to practice more with it.


I agree with you completely. I've been using this rubber for about three months now, after having used the Viper for the previous year or so. The Gangster solved the two main issues I had with the Viper: occasionally high trajectory on passive blocks and (hopefully) broken pips. The Gangster keeps the ball low and very controlled, and so far, no problem with pips breaking. I'd say that its attacking capability diminishes somewhat as the pips soften a bit over time (common with many long pips), but you do get other benefits from softer pips, so it's a trade-off. My impression is that spin reversal is very slightly less than with the Viper, but I could be imagining that. In any event, unless something magical comes along, I think I'll be sticking with this one for the foreseeable future.
Author:  TTnightmare [ 21 Sep 2017, 03:51 ]
Post subject:  Re: Dr N Gangster
Well I'm also amazed. Amazed of the above reviews. I have tried the Gangster for a month now and I've come to the conclusion it is not as good as Number 1. This maybe because I'm not as good a player as the ones who like the rubber but the number 1 gives me more control, more reversal/distruptive and the pips on the Gangster started to break particularly at the edges. I am going back to the No 1.
Author:  Riot207 [ 27 Sep 2017, 03:19 ]
Post subject:  Re: Dr N Gangster
Good day everyone, long time lurker!

I apologize if this is the wrong thread for an introduction but I'm highly interested in this rubber and am seeking guidance!


So a little background on me:

Due to an martial arts accident over a year ago, has left me unable to back hand loop or banana flick with inverted rubber. I've since made the switch from a dual wing looper to a modern defense player, focusing on close to the table play with bumps (as I slowly learn them), and chop block/punch block (not sure if these are different or interchangeable terms) with mid distance chops, and attacking weak returned balls.

I'm enjoying that feeling of learning something brand new every time I play and has lead to much success over the last two months of play. Needless to say, I'm a recovering EJ'er and I've got the itch..BIG TIME.

My current setup (since I haven't put the time into a fancy smancy signature yet ;)):

Blade: Tibhar Stratus Defense
FH Rubber: Butterfly Tenergy 05 - 1.9mm
BH Rubber: Butterfly Feint Long II - 0.5mm

What I love about this current set up is the amount of feel I have with this blade (used the tibhar stratus powerwood prior to this). I can feel when the ball hits my pips, then I can place the ball where I want it.. It's also great for attacking the ball as long as its on the rise! (I assume that is the case for most pips?) I primarily used 2.1mm for tenergy on my fh and have moved to 1.9mm.. I feel this has helped me tremendously with chopping mid distance from the table, while not taking away from the spin/speed of my loops. (At least that's the feed back club players have mentioned after playing me)

The one thing I don't like about the Feint II is I'm finding that even with 0.5mm sponge I'm having a hard time finding how much power to put on my chops or pushes and often times the ball falls off the end of the table. I feel this has a lot to do with my technique and the habits I've developed from being an inverted player for over a decade. So I will not say that it's the sponge making it go long off the table..If anyone has suggestions to a more, "less punishing" long pips than Butterfly Feint II; I'm all ears.

With that said, I was very interested in the Dr. N Gangster..

Cause hell, if you're a gangster you must play with the most gangster of products right?!

No in all seriousness, I thought it seemed like a great rubber/brand to try OX LP out with. It seems from what I've gathered lurking; is that ox offers more control than sponge pips but offers less spin reversal. I feel with no sponge I may have a better time keeping the ball on the table..

I'm open to suggestions, criticism or just a plain, "Dude, why don't you try this LP and work you way up to this LP" ...

Appreciate your time in reading this, have a great rest of your day!

-TJ
Author:  TraditionalTradesman [ 28 Sep 2017, 05:54 ]
Post subject:  Re: Dr N Gangster
Riot207 wrote:
It seems from what I've gathered lurking; is that ox offers more control than sponge pips but offers less spin reversal. I feel with no sponge I may have a better time keeping the ball on the table.


"Spin reversal" is the term usually used for what happens when the ball with spin makes passive contact with a long pips rubber (meaning on a passive block). What happens, as most of us know, is that there's some degree of reversal in the spin, in that topspin comes back as underspin, etc. OX has HIGHER spin reversal than sponged pips. What sponged pips offer you is more ability to generate YOUR OWN spin. The sponge, in other words, makes the pips a bit closer to an inverted rubber. Of course, you generate your own spin by grazing the ball in some way.

So if someone gives me a loop and I block the ball back with a thick-sponged long pips rubber, it's going to come back more or less dead, whereas if I block it back with an OX long pips rubber, it's going to come back with some light underspin. However, if I do a heavy CHOP back, the sponged pips will be able to generate more underspin, and that's especially true if you're getting a loop that doesn't have tons of spin on it.

As for control, OX is certainly better for at-the-table play because big loops tend to pop up off of sponged pips, as you've noticed, so that you have to adjust your bat angle downwards to compensate for that, and it's not always easy. The main weakness of OX pips is dealing with no-spin, especially fast, long no spin, since you can't generate too much of your own spin, so the ball that you're going to be sending back is also close to no-spin, which gives you a smaller margin for error, if that makes sense.

With all that said, yes, I think the Gangster is a great rubber to try out if you're planning on primarily playing close to the table. It keeps the ball low and short, but you can still attack with it when you need to. I've found it to be pretty durable as well.
Author:  Riot207 [ 29 Sep 2017, 02:39 ]
Post subject:  Re: Dr N Gangster
Quote:
OX has HIGHER spin reversal than sponged pips. What sponged pips offer you is more ability to generate YOUR OWN spin.


This makes sooooo much more sense now! Thank you very much for correcting me!!!

I've since ordered this rubber, and am excited to get hitting with it. May I ask you or anyone else for things I should watch out for or maybe just keep in mind when going from sponge LP to OX pips?
Author:  Bulldog [ 03 Oct 2017, 16:49 ]
Post subject:  Re: Dr N Gangster
Is Gangster noticeably better at reversing the plastic ball? Dr N claims it was developed to deal with the plastic ball. I am losing matches against people I used to cane because I can't get passive reversal!
Bulldog
Author:  TraditionalTradesman [ 04 Oct 2017, 00:58 ]
Post subject:  Re: Dr N Gangster
It has decent reversal, but no, unfortunately, I wouldn't say it's "noticeably better" than other similar long pips rubbers at reversal on passive blocks.
Author:  peterpong [ 04 Oct 2017, 01:43 ]
Post subject:  Re: Dr N Gangster
Bulldog wrote:
Is Gangster noticeably better at reversing the plastic ball? Dr N claims it was developed to deal with the plastic ball. I am losing matches against people I used to cane because I can't get passive reversal!
Bulldog

what were you winning them with ?
Author:  Bulldog [ 04 Oct 2017, 02:52 ]
Post subject:  Re: Dr N Gangster
It's irrelevant what I was using as it isn't working well with the plastic ball. My team mate who is a coach is adamant about it. I need to find a pip which I can use to passively reverse topspin and to help me push aggressively against backspin to create at least mild topspin of my own.
Bulldog
Author:  TraditionalTradesman [ 04 Oct 2017, 07:01 ]
Post subject:  Re: Dr N Gangster
Bulldog wrote:
I need to find a pip which I can use to passively reverse topspin and to help me push aggressively against backspin to create at least mild topspin of my own.


Unfortunately, with the combo of the minimum friction rules and the new heavier, less spinny ball, I'm not sure such a thing exists. There are a number of pips that are all approximately equal in their reversal (Dr. N's Viper and Gangster, Grass d.techs, Giant Dragon Talon & Giant Dragon Snowflake, Spinlord Dormenglanz, Joola Badman Reloaded, etc.), but if you want higher reversal on passive blocks, slick anti is the only option there ... and that, of course, comes with its own set of complications.
Author:  LordCope [ 07 Oct 2017, 03:56 ]
Post subject:  Re: Dr N Gangster
I was just talking to my friend Rowden, who takes a keen interest in all matters material. He says a number of players he knows have tried this and all think it's marvellous. Especially on fast/balsa blades. He earnestly recommended I give it a try! :devil:
Author:  Roy [ 07 Oct 2017, 09:35 ]
Post subject:  Re: Dr N Gangster
Bulldog wrote:
Is Gangster noticeably better at reversing the plastic ball? Dr N claims it was developed to deal with the plastic ball. I am losing matches against people I used to cane because I can't get passive reversal!
Bulldog

I lost over 100 rating points in the change to plastic balls. :( After change I also lost to same people I used to win.

I would say that propably no ox pip will get my rating points back, because there is not enough disturbance and spin variance left.

My solution was to move to sponged pips with more chopping instead of blocking at the table. It has worked OK.
Author:  Bulldog [ 07 Oct 2017, 09:40 ]
Post subject:  Re: Dr N Gangster
I agreee. Thinking of trying slick anti again or pips with 1mm of sponge. When I used Super Block I had 1mm so might go for Gangster with 1mm.
Bulldog.
Author:  Rob M [ 08 Oct 2017, 14:43 ]
Post subject:  Re: Dr N Gangster
Can anyone compare this to other common LPs such as Viper, Talon, Hellfire, Dtechs etc?
Is it really the symbiosis of deception and control?

Thanks guys
Author:  Riot207 [ 11 Oct 2017, 00:28 ]
Post subject:  Re: Dr N Gangster
I've had just over a week to play with gangster OX, let me tell you, the service return with gangster is nothing short of amazing. I can return literally any service that my opponents give me, without really even having to think.

I've noticed club members and people out side of my club changing how they play me just after a few points; due to how easily I can return their services.

I believe this rubber was truly made for the new 2017 ABS plastic ball's (I've played with both DHS and Donic's ABS ball so far). The spin reversal is quite good in comparison to the 2014-2016 XSF and Nittaku Premium Poly Balls. I did compare the spin reversal to my butterfly feint II but felt it wasn't a fair comparison as the feint II has .5mm of sponge and I could impart way more spin reversal on the ball with my touch over just letting the rubber put the reversal on the ball.

Chop-Block, close to the table: I've found that if I keep a relaxed grip, the ball just falls over the net with adequate spin reversal.
Chopping mid distance, keeps the ball very low and has tons of reversal.
Chopping long distance: I found I really need to put some power into my chops in order to get the ball over the net. When they do go over the net, they're extremely low, and have tons of backspin on the ball.

I'm still very new to LP (about 3 months of play time coming from 12 years of being a dual wing looper) so I'd take my quick review with a grain of sand until someone with more experience can either validate or debunk my findings.


Cheers!
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