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PostPosted: 21 Apr 2011, 03:16 
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I have started this as an answer to another thread, and think it might serve the community best as its own thread. Please feel free to add or correct. I am just going by my experience.

Complete list of Short (and medium) Pips rubbers as recognized by the ITTF:

Globe
889 Out

Air
Panamera
Classique

Amsir
Shot

Andro
Blowfish
Blowfish +
Hexer
Hexer+
Classic
Logo
Revolution COR PO

Armstrong
Aka Mark Max
Attack 3 Type L
Attack 3 Type M
Attack 8 Type L
Attack 8 Type M
Attack 8 Type M EXX
Red Mark Type 1-3
Red Mark Type 1-4
Red Mark Type 1-5
Rosin
Twister EXT
W-α Εx x

BANCO

Impact Energie

BOMB
Hammer Out
King Roc Out

BUTTERFLY
Flarestorm II
Challenger Attack Out
Challenger Large Out
Flarestorm
Large 44 DX
NS 44
Orthodox-DX,103
Pecular
Raystorm
Rein
Relop Large
Speedy-P.O.
West Will

DAWEI
388C-1

Donic
Baxster
Baxter LB
Twister LB
Twister 40
Akkadi K 1
Akkadi K 2

Double Fish

820 A

Double Happiness

651
652
874
C7
Dragonow
Nittaku C7
Sharping
Sharping Nittaku

Dr Neubauer

Diamant
Pistol
Leopard
Tornado Ultra

Friendship

729 105
Kokutaku 563-1
Kokutaku 802-40
RITC 729 563
RITC 729 563-1
729 Dr. Evil
RITC 799
RITC 802
RITC 802-1
RITC 802-40

Gambler

Peacekeeper

Giant Dragon

015 Blast
016 612
8228 A

GKI

Nano Attack

Globe


888
889
889-2

Haifu

003 Penguin
004 Dolphin

Hallmark

Half Long
Magic Pips
Panther
[u]
Joola[/b]

Express Ultra
Snabb
Staccato
Tango Ultra

Juic

Patisuma III
Master Spin
Master Spin 2
Pips Ace
Patisuma I
Patisuma II

Kokutako

Clitter
Tuple 110
Tuple 119

K-P

003 Struggle 800

Meteor

575
71-2
845

Milky Way

Pluto

Mizuno

Booster EV
Booster SA
Polaris

Nexy
Kairos

Nittaku


003 Specialist Hibiki
004 Narucross 44
006 Hammond FA Speed
018 Royallarge
021 Pimple Slide
Express
Hammond FA
Moristo 44
Moristo SP
Specialist Chikara Out
Specialist One Out
Specialist Soft Out
Specialist Soft HS Out
Super Large
Universal- Ribbon

Palio

003 Flying Dragon
004 Power Dragon
WP1013
[u]
Peace[/b]

001 LGO 44

PRASIDHA

820
Action
Speed-F

Reactor

001 Mirage
002 Rafale
003 Pioneer

Sanwei

Ghost

Stiga

Clippa
Radical
Royal

Tibar


Grass Flex
Speedy Soft
Speedy Soft DTecs

TSP

Curl P-2
Milli Tall II
Miracle
Miracle Super
Spectol
Super Spinpips
Tyranno

Tuttle


007 Summer - 3C
009 Winter - 3E

Victas

001 VO - 101
002 VLB - 301
005 VO -102

Winning


NP - 1
NP - 2
NP - 6
NP - 8

XIOM

011 Zava 1
025 Zava II
Styx - SP

XIYING

889

Yasaka

003 Xtend LB
005 Marvelous
013 Rakza PO
A-1-2 A-1
A-1-2 A-2
Cobalt α
Cobalt X1
Cobalt X2
Large Pro
Original
Original A-1
Original A-2
PB-1
Xtend PO



Grippy short pips:

Stiga

Clippa
Radical


Friendship:

802-40

Globe

889-2

Butterfly

Flarestorm
Flarestorm 2
Raystorm


TSP

Spin Pips

Joola

Joola Tango Ultra
Express Ultra


Dr Neubauer

Dr. Neubauer Tornado Ultra


Classic short pips:

Andro
Blowfish


Double Happiness
651
652


TSP:
Spectol

Friendship
Friendship 802
Friendship 802-1
Friendship 799
Dr. Evil (hard bat)

Kokutako

Tuple 119


Stiga
Royal

Yasaka:



Butterfly



Joola
Snabb

Donic
Baxter

Dr Neubauer
Leopard
Pistol

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Last edited by ian demagi on 25 Aug 2011, 10:03, edited 23 times in total.

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PostPosted: 21 Apr 2011, 03:29 
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Yasaka A1 is a hardbat rubber and doesn't belong in a list of sponge rubbers.

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PostPosted: 21 Apr 2011, 04:41 
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speedplay wrote:
Why not? Isn't it approved for ITTF events? Isn't it a short pips rubber? I think this list is for ALL sp rubbers, with or with out sponge, as it's about the grip on the pips.


Same reason a tree doesn't belong in the same category as a dove, a pidgeon, and a rooster, especially when a hardbat rubber is being put in the same category with a sponge rubber as a 'classic short pip.' Would it make sense to put an antispin on a list of inverted rubbers? They have separate forums, even though they both consist of pips-in rubber on a sponge.

It actually has little to do with the grip on the pips when you take into account the fact modern SPs have a sponge underneath. I could have two pips with a similar grip, but the presence or absence of sponge makes it an entirely different kind of rubber, and even without a sponge, modern SPs would still have more spin.

This is also supposed to be a resource where SP players can select SPs they would like to try. SP users are not looking for hardbat rubbers, and hardbat players are not looking for SPs, or any rubber with sponge. This thread was also started in the short pimple rubber forum. Hardbat rubbers would belong in the hardbat forum.

If it's going to be on the list, it at least should be in a different category from sponge rubbers since it doesn't make sense for it to be paired with something like Spectol. Since a list of hardbat rubbers is already readily available, it doesn't make sense to try and merge it with a list of sponge rubbers.

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PostPosted: 21 Apr 2011, 05:57 
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speedplay wrote:
abdulmuhsee wrote:
Yasaka A1 is a hardbat rubber and doesn't belong in a list of sponge rubbers.



Why not? Isn't it approved for ITTF events? Isn't it a short pips rubber? I think this list is for ALL sp rubbers, with or with out sponge, as it's about the grip on the pips.



Mine has 2.2 mm sponge under it. It is very old-but very lightly used. Is it not legal anymore? If not, I will be happy to take it off.

I am certainly willing to keep the list up to date.

Ian

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PostPosted: 21 Apr 2011, 06:19 
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Would Friendship 799 go into classic?

Ian

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PostPosted: 21 Apr 2011, 06:38 
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ian demagi wrote:
Mine has 2.2 mm sponge under it. It is very old-but very lightly used. Is it not legal anymore? If not, I will be happy to take it off.

I am certainly willing to keep the list up to date.Ian


Ah, I see. I think what happened is that Yasaka had a rubber called A1 which they discontinued then replaced with the hardbat rubbers A1 and A2. They don't make whatever rubber it used to be anymore, and A1 now refers to one of the hardbat rubbers they make.

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PostPosted: 21 Apr 2011, 06:47 
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abdulmuhsee wrote:
Yasaka A1 is a hardbat rubber and doesn't belong in a list of sponge rubbers.


I'm with Speedplay. All Tequilla is Mezcal, but not all Mezcal is Tequilla. Substitue Cognac for Tequiila and Mezcal for Brandy if you're European to get my drift.

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PostPosted: 21 Apr 2011, 07:50 
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tsp spinpip, joola tango ultra, butterfly raystorm should be listed on the grippy list IMO.

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Last edited by hclnnkhg on 21 Apr 2011, 08:45, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: 21 Apr 2011, 08:14 
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antipip wrote:
I'm with Speedplay. All Tequilla is Mezcal, but not all Mezcal is Tequilla. Substitue Cognac for Tequiila and Mezcal for Brandy if you're European to get my drift.


Alright then, let's be sure to add medium and long pips to the list as well then, since they're all pips out too, the difference being less than a millimeter and all, and then we'll bunch Tenergy 05, DHS Skyline 2, and Toni Hold Anti together on the inverted rubber list, since they're all inverted too :-/.

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Last edited by abdulmuhsee on 21 Apr 2011, 08:16, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: 21 Apr 2011, 08:16 
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Well we need to decide what Classic "is"

For me its a rubber that is resistant to spin, capable of creating its own to a degree, scrubs off incoming spin and replaces it with its own moderate to modest spin. Pips out is about speed and control through short strokes and low throw angle to be classic short pips out.

Strokes used with classic pips out are: flat hit, punch block, top spin drive, and hard dead pushes. What does everyone else think?

totally agree about medium pips out!

Ian

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PostPosted: 21 Apr 2011, 10:33 
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modern SPs: spinny, high tension, very modern in all specs.

classic: about as sensitive to spin as an anti rubber (not including 804) and spinny as an old sheet of butterfly premade crap.

so we are all set...

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PostPosted: 21 Apr 2011, 10:45 
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Another way to differentiate SPs is whether they are "cooked" or "raw" as explained in this thread: viewtopic.php?f=56&t=8175

Hardbat rubbers would be a third category in my opinion as the lack of sponge alters the characteristics.

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PostPosted: 21 Apr 2011, 18:09 
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Xiom's SP are in the grippy,
Most of Butterfly are (Flare, Ray, Flare 2), though their Challenger attack and speedy po are in-between.
Andro's Blowfish and BF+ are grippy, but their Logo is classical.

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PostPosted: 21 Apr 2011, 20:53 
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speedplay wrote:
If you could explain the difference between what you call a hard bat rubber and a regular short pips rubber, then please do so, with out using birds and doves as examples.

Is it the lack of sponge? Cause, as a former LP player, I've always considered both ox and sponged LP as LP and nothing else.

I also think that I've read that the hard bat comittee have approved new rubbers to be used in hard bat tournaments, regular short pips that is. So, I fail to see the difference between them.

How ever, the difference between regular inverted and anti is plain obvious, as is the difference between short and long pips. As for medium pips, I'll leave that to those who use it.


You've obviously never used a hardbat rubber before if you don't know the difference. To be as simple as possible, both the grip is less than even classic chinese attack pips, and the pips are constructed differently, being much thinner than any modern SP.

Also, the only new hardbat rubber that has been approved in the last few years is Valor, which was designed specifically as a hardbat rubber and is only USATT-approved. 'Regular short pips' without sponge, as you call them, such as 802, were tested and declined because they did not play like or resemble classic hard rubber.

The only rubber on the approved hardbat list that even has the option of coming in sponge (though not for hardbat of course) is Gambler Peace Keeper, which isn't even considered a short pip due to its characteristics/pip construction and is a rare exception.

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PostPosted: 22 Apr 2011, 01:34 
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Apologies to the original topic, hopefully the list'll keep on growing.

I'm confused abdulmuhsee.

I see anti as a reversed rubber, that because of it properties is reffered to as anti (a sub category of reversed rubbers much like tacky or sticky rubbers are).

In your opinion where does andro classic fit in, hardbat, short pimple or both?

Where (if I wanted to) should I post about my gambler peacekeeper rubber that is fitted on a toni hold blade with 0.5mm anti sponge (taken from the now banned / unauthorised 'frictionless' joola anti spin long pips, the other side of the blade has the ITTF approved but no longer authorised (payment?) tornado antiloop super kilspin?

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