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PostPosted: 15 Jan 2018, 03:36 
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Blade: BTY Joo Se Hyuk
FH: BTY T05FX MAX
BH: TSP Curl P4/P1r 1-1.3 mm
Hi everyone,

Currently, i'm a LP chopper but am thinking to switch to SP. From the things I've heard about TSP SSPCII i find it very hard to not order sheet, but need a little guidance, and have struggled to fined any info on it at the moment. I'm very aware on the Pros and cons of sponge thickness with LP's, but have no clue with SP. For LP's, 1mm works best for me, so I want something comparable to that speed wise with SP. Is 1mm to little for SP? Any thoughts much appreciated!

BTW forgot to mention i'm looking for controlled chops but still the ability for strong attacks.

Thanks

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Modern Defender
S/U 1-Blade:Joo Sae Hyuk ST FH: BTY T05FX MAX BH: TSP Curl P1r 1-1.3 mm
S/U 2 - Blade: BTY Gionis Carbon Def FH: DHS Tin Arc 5 BH: TSP Curl P4 1-1.3 mm


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PostPosted: 15 Jan 2018, 03:39 
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Joined: 13 Jun 2017, 00:31
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Blade: VKMO
FH: Yasaka Mark V GPS Red Max
BH: TSP SSPC2 Black 1.9mm
At least 1.5 mm
EDIT: Look at my signature; I use 1.9mm for this rubber. And it’s going to be kind of different from LP chopping.

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Blade: Victas Koji Matsushita Offensive FL
FH: Yasaka Mark V GPS Max
BH: TSP SuperSpinPips Chop 2 1.9

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PostPosted: 15 Jan 2018, 03:45 
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Blade: VKMO
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BH: TSP SSPC2 Black 1.9mm
Other SP’s you might find interesting are 802-40 and TSP Spectol; they’re both SP’s that are pretty known for chopping.

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Blade: Victas Koji Matsushita Offensive FL
FH: Yasaka Mark V GPS Max
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PostPosted: 15 Jan 2018, 04:29 
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Blade: Innershield ZLF
FH: Chop-City!
BH: Curl P-4 OX
I have used the SSCS 2 in all thicknesses from .3 up to the highest.

It is quite grippy and will not play like LP at all, even in the thinnest. Basically the thinner you go the slower it becomes on soft shots and the faster it goes on hard shots (due to bottoming out on the blade). The thick sponge is of a dampening kind, so it tries to slow the ball down while still allowing more spin to be imparted. All in all, I think it's safer in the thinner version but more versatile in shot selection with the thicker sponges.

I find the spin degree is still quite high in the .3 version, especially at lower levels of play.

You may also consider the tibhar super defence in .5 or .1 if you want something grippy but still light and slow.

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Tenergy 80 fx 1.7
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PostPosted: 15 Jan 2018, 05:06 
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I recall reading a professional review on Spectol where the reviewer said they could get much more backspin with 1.8 than 1.5 probably due to the pips not being that grippy so sink into the sponge is key to spin.

With a more grippy pip like Degu 2 this is recommended at its thinnest 1mm for defense e.g chopping - see you tube videos


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PostPosted: 15 Jan 2018, 09:30 
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ModernDef, if you want to try out SSPC2, look at Yuto Muramatsu for reference; he uses it with a pretty thick sponge, definitely above 1.5mm from photos. Maybe 1.7-1.8mm. Like skilless slapper said, it's really grippy so your chop stroke has to be quite fast and active, even more so than with the P1-R from what I've seen in videos.

EDIT: IMHO though, SSPC2 is pretty controlled for choping if you are able to overcome the problem of chopping very spinny topspin. Now that I look back, when everyone said that the sponge is really dampening and really slow, they weren't exaggerating; now that I'm able to control this rubber to some degree, I definitely agree with them.

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Blade: Victas Koji Matsushita Offensive FL
FH: Yasaka Mark V GPS Max
BH: TSP SuperSpinPips Chop 2 1.9

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PostPosted: 29 Mar 2018, 17:59 
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Blade: BTY Innershield
FH: BTY Tenergy 80FX (1.9mm)
BH: TSP Curl P4 (1mm)
I've got SSPCS2 in 0.3-0.6mm, 1m and 1.4-1.7mm (which I thought was max? but maybe not).

It's the most inverted-like SP I've ever used. The levels of spin it generates is frighteningly similar to inverted and you can still use SP-like techniques for punching, etc.

That all sounds great in theory, but it makes it very difficult to play with against heavy spin. Trying to chop a proper loop requires you to be the correct (further than LP) distance away from the table with quick reactions and a load of swing/arm speed. If you don't register significant dwell on the ball when chopping, you'll throw your chop off the end of the table, guaranteed. I actually found it harder to float the ball with SSPCS2 than with inverted for some bizarre reason too.

Personally, for SP chopping, the only option that ever worked for me was Spectol. It doesn't generate monstrous backspin but it DOES generate enough for opponents to net chops and it's generally much easier to use. Floating the ball is really easy and if you're out of position you'll find this shot vital for SP chopping - stretch a bit, play a lower-dwell chop and the ball will still go back. I won a good number of points with this shot as opponents regularly misread it and threw their next loop off the end of the table.

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[Other gear I've used]
Blades: Butterfly Defence 3, Butterfly Defence Pro, Butterfly Innerforce ZLC, Butterfly Innershield, Butterfly Joo Saehyuk, DHS Power G7, Stiga Offensive Classic Carbon
SPs: Friendship 802 (1.5), TSP Spectol (1.3, 2.1), TSP Spectol Speed (1.3), TSP Super Spinpips Chop Sponge 2 (0.5, 1.3)
LPs: Butterfly Feint Long II (1), Butterfly Feint Long III (0.5, 1.3), Tibhar Grass D.TecS (OX), TSP Curl P1-R (0.5, 1, 1.3), TSP Curl P4 (1.3)
Full list (PM me for price): https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1xNLwjz5uZq_FcCowBgZ4zk1NwU83xVyCRoo0zhphu3w/edit?usp=sharing
==================================================================================================================================================
My blog: "Learning to play: as a modern defender": http://ooakforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=58&t=22254
My YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCtazeX ... oICGS9bqNg


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PostPosted: 29 Mar 2018, 18:02 
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Blade: BTY Innershield
FH: BTY Tenergy 80FX (1.9mm)
BH: TSP Curl P4 (1mm)
Next time I get a chance to record some footage, I think I might do a comparison of Curl P1-R, Curl P4, SSPCS2 and Spectol.

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[Other gear I've used]
Blades: Butterfly Defence 3, Butterfly Defence Pro, Butterfly Innerforce ZLC, Butterfly Innershield, Butterfly Joo Saehyuk, DHS Power G7, Stiga Offensive Classic Carbon
SPs: Friendship 802 (1.5), TSP Spectol (1.3, 2.1), TSP Spectol Speed (1.3), TSP Super Spinpips Chop Sponge 2 (0.5, 1.3)
LPs: Butterfly Feint Long II (1), Butterfly Feint Long III (0.5, 1.3), Tibhar Grass D.TecS (OX), TSP Curl P1-R (0.5, 1, 1.3), TSP Curl P4 (1.3)
Full list (PM me for price): https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1xNLwjz5uZq_FcCowBgZ4zk1NwU83xVyCRoo0zhphu3w/edit?usp=sharing
==================================================================================================================================================
My blog: "Learning to play: as a modern defender": http://ooakforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=58&t=22254
My YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCtazeX ... oICGS9bqNg


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PostPosted: 29 Mar 2018, 21:00 
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Blade: Stratus Powerdefense
FH: Rozena 1,9
BH: Grass D'Tecs 1,2
Completely agree with every one here. I tried out SP on BH for chopping several times using FS 802, FS 802-1, SSPC, SSPC II, Spectol, Degu, Degu II, Speedy Soft and Aggressor, thicknesses between 1,0 and 1,8 mm. Best results I got with thin-sponged (~1mm) low-grip SP such as Speedy Soft (and Aggressor, of course; but you would not consider this rubber a traditional SP, as its top sheet is anti-like).

Why do you want to switch to SP? Easier pushing? For me it didn't work out, I am way more consistent with sponged LP. Pushing is more a question of practice. Sponged LP can be used well enough for inverted like blocks and drives and chopping is VERY MUCH easier. Perhaps you should try to contact leatherback, since he used SP for quite some time - and even he seems to be back to LP (C&F III?).

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PostPosted: 29 Mar 2018, 21:03 
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Joined: 22 Feb 2017, 04:18
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Blade: TSP 5.0
FH: Musa 2.0
BH: Keilar 1.8
Spectol whilst originally a fast attacking rubber, with the poly ball it is now quite suitable for backhand use on defensive blades. The non boosted sponge means it is now relatively slow for short pip with excellent control of speed and direction plus good chops/chop blocks. Not that great for imparting topspin from flick/loop type strokes but for someone coming from LP this would not be an issue. I only have a 1.2mm sheet but apparently the thicker sponge the better for chopping as the soft sponge aids spin generation.


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PostPosted: 10 May 2018, 03:19 
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Blade: BTY Grubba ALL /old model
FH: Nittaku H3 Neo
BH: Spectol 1.7-1.9
ChasFox wrote:
I recall reading a professional review on Spectol where the reviewer said they could get much more backspin with 1.8 than 1.5 probably due to the pips not being that grippy so sink into the sponge is key to spin.

With a more grippy pip like Degu 2 this is recommended at its thinnest 1mm for defense e.g chopping - see you tube videos


I have tested Spectol (also Spectol Speed and Spectol 21) in 1.0 to 2.15 for BH chopping.
For some reasons, the sponge in 1.8 and 2.15mm seems to be much softer and elastic in those thicknesses. Because of that, IMHO, the spin capability is way much bigger with them.
Currently, I play with 1.8mm but contemplating switching to 2.15mm.
Also the thicker the sponge, the more inverted it plays making it easier for me to attack.

I tested Degu 2 in 1.0 and 1.5mm.... More grip than Spectol but the sponge is much faster and bouncier.

Note that when I started chopping with SP, I chose Spectol Speed because of its harder sponge. I seem to have more feedback with harder sponges. After few years of practice, I realized how much more spin potential softer sponges have.

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Before Modern Defense (in black playing a 2100+ player:https://youtu.be/if__7emBFqA


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PostPosted: 10 May 2018, 03:52 
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Blade: TSP 5.0
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I have only tried an old sheet of Spectol in 1.2mm black on similar balsa blades to yours.

I like the idea of trying say 1.8 to get more spin on all shots but what are the downsides e.g will it be a lot bouncier/faster and thus hard to control in the short game, blocking and pushing.


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PostPosted: 10 May 2018, 04:08 
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Blade: BTY Grubba ALL /old model
FH: Nittaku H3 Neo
BH: Spectol 1.7-1.9
ChasFox wrote:
I have only tried an old sheet of Spectol in 1.2mm black on similar balsa blades to yours. I like the idea of trying say 1.8 to get more spin on all shots but what are the downsides e.g will it be a lot bouncier/faster and thus hard to control in the short game, blocking and pushing.


The TSP Balsa blades are fast of hard impact but not bouncy on slow impact.
Thinner sponge (Spectol) makes it more blade dependent.
With 1.8mm, you will lose some feedback but gain a lot of spin and power for blocking and hits.
If you are used to thick inverted rubbers, short game/pushing isn't a problem at all with Spectol.... the rest is practice ;)

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BTY Grubba ALL+ (old model) / Nittaku H3 Neo / Spectol 1.7-1.9

Before Modern Defense (in black playing a 2100+ player:https://youtu.be/if__7emBFqA


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PostPosted: 10 May 2018, 04:13 
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Blade: BTY Grubba ALL /old model
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BH: Spectol 1.7-1.9
Another thing.... I have few sheets of Spectol 1.5, 1.8 and 2.15mm.
Cut for the same head size, the 2.15mm sheet is lighter than the 1.5 and similar to 1.8... Go figure!!?

1.8 and 2.15mm sponges have a slightly different color than the 1.5mm and much softer. Not sure why.

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BTY Grubba ALL+ (old model) / Nittaku H3 Neo / Spectol 1.7-1.9

Before Modern Defense (in black playing a 2100+ player:https://youtu.be/if__7emBFqA


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PostPosted: 10 May 2018, 16:22 
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The softer sponge may explain why you are finding 1.8 Spectol much better for chopping than the thinner versions, i.e it was not just the extra thickness


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