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PostPosted: 26 Feb 2014, 11:54 
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Another follow up here regarding LP question.

I see Zhou uses the side swipe return vs what looks to be backspin a lot. And there is another video of Chen Weixing demonstrating the stroke here as well.



While the video is good to see how it is performed, can someone explain the logic to the stroke for me? Why do it? What spin takes place? ex: vs backspin and return is side swiped, what does the server get? (is it topspin with very little side?)

Thanks.

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PostPosted: 26 Feb 2014, 13:10 
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I've recently discovered that vs topspin, I can actually loop a ball. Its almost the same stoke as a loop vs backspin. Anyways, I believe this stoke is creating slight topspin back towards the opponent (the balls at least seems to arch as if topspin) If that is the case, the spin is not reversed then. Is this correct? Is this what is commonly referred to as the roll over shot? I have no idea what that is.


Suds:

With a grippy and sponge LP, it plays closer to inverted so you're right. I'm no master technician here but I refer to strokes that have the blade cover the top of the ball, just like doing a regular loop with inverted, I call those "roll - overs" but any OOAKers out there please correct me if I'm wrong. And the angle varies with the characteristics of the lp (sponge, grippiness). I see some people go straight up with an open face while others brush over the ball like a regular stroke. The kind of spin would be backspin to no spin since to even slight top spin depending on the brushing. (If the blade was just still the incoming topspin would be continued and backspin would rebound but since you are rolling over, that negates some of the backspin so it might result in no spin or even top...)

Could be wrong here but I'm going with what I know.

Also, with BH's video above maybe he can better answer those questions. IMO when you use the side swipe, it's an alternative to just pushing back an incoming backspin ball. Sometimes that motion leads to netted balls. The side swipe allows you to be aggressive by adding some side spin of your own and the pips continue the incoming back spin so you are sending back some strong side-top shots to add pressure...its also a safe shot.

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PostPosted: 27 Feb 2014, 01:49 
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timeout wrote:
Also, with BH's video above maybe he can better answer those questions. IMO when you use the side swipe, it's an alternative to just pushing back an incoming backspin ball. Sometimes that motion leads to netted balls. The side swipe allows you to be aggressive by adding some side spin of your own and the pips continue the incoming back spin so you are sending back some strong side-top shots to add pressure...its also a safe shot.


This makes sense as I've found pushing back backspin balls aggressively hard to do. I know I've certainly netted a few of those balls in my day. Either that or sent them long. I wonder if the side swipe somehow stabalizes the flight. Either way, I'm excited to try this technique.

As far as the loop vs topspin, I've been performing that vs a robot. I think I'm going to have to set up a paddle (like a return board) to really see what the ball is doing. I might have to take some video to get your guy's opinion. I'm playing with Palio CK531a OX. Thanks for the info.

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PostPosted: 27 Feb 2014, 01:54 
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If u really want to see what the ball is doing when u experiment draw a thick circle around your robot balls with a sharpie marker. It's easy to see the spin that way.

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PostPosted: 28 Feb 2014, 11:59 
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Yes draw a thick arrow...I have used pen and it was too thin...

Also I just got slapped around by a kid looper with good high back spin balls from his bh ...
He would return by low serves or any of my low spin serves by jabbing with his bh inverted...
The balls would be directed at my bh and I would push those back and we would rally like this until he got a good ball for a fh loop, either spiny slow or loop kill, I couldn't get out of it as he adjusted to my push blocking style...I should have use Zhou xi tong aggressive side spin stroke!

I fell into a trap and just pushed with normal stroke and this kid kept pushing back with the same consistency...this is exactly why you should use the side swipe to break out of the LOOP because if he got a high one...he would kill it!

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PostPosted: 28 Feb 2014, 23:32 
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I marked some balls and my roll over (loopish stroke) vs topspin definitely has topspin going back. This is great as there are a few players at the club who have adapted to thinking the ball is reversed no matter what. Previously they were right in what I would do vs topspin in my short hop chop blocks. Now I feel like I have more options to confuse them. :)

I practed the swipe vs backspin. I like it and plan to use it vs short backspin serves. It'll just take time to get good at it.

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PostPosted: 13 Mar 2014, 03:37 
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samsonopp wrote:
few zhou xintong videos found at http://v.youku.com/v_show/id_XNjE2NzYyNTA4.html


Really good video. Good quality. Lets you get some good information.

What I like is how well Zhou can attack backspin (particularly vs the serve). She always puts a little side on it but until just now, I haven't noticed that her side is always going with the spin of the ball.

I'm a lefty so I've been practicing this side/swipe motion vs backspin balls. It's great when it gets on but as I think about it, if I stroke the traditional backhand across my body, say vs righties pendulum serve, I'm going against the spin. Rather, I should take those with the forehand and do a punching motion going with the spin... Or with the backhand but just go the opposite direction.

Zhou's opponent tries giving a reverse pendulum (or punch serve rather) at 9:16 and you see Zhou punching it in the opposite direction she had typically been doing it so far in the match. Staying true to always going with the spin.

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PostPosted: 30 Sep 2014, 11:04 
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According to the authorized distributor in my country, both the Runlox-5 and Bizelox cpens are out of production (I didn't ask about shakehand).

Good thing there are plenty of alternatives. I wonder what she will choose next?


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PostPosted: 30 Sep 2014, 23:46 
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While training "no less than 100 hours per month", with the Provincial team she changed the lp "every five or six days", upon joining the National B Team "every three or four days", and when drilling against strong players, "every two or three days". She said the short pips break quickly too.

She changed the blade every six months to a year, shoes not so often because playing in her style she runs less.

http://read.sportpaper.cn/pingpangmag/h ... 245907.htm


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PostPosted: 03 Oct 2016, 02:40 
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At a ranking of #85 in 2014, it seems that she stopped playing internationally, but she is on the national team (if I'm not mistaken) and - I believe - is training the others, male and female, against long pips. She has pumped up the offense quite a bit and sometimes seems to have a more aggressive body language. I could be wrong about some of these dates.

This is from 2016. She wins vs. a strong older male penholder (Xu Xiaofeng) who seems to be playing with short pips. Warning, he brutalizes her 11-2 in the first game:
http://www.weishi.com/t/200056801757996 ... 8017579963

Apparently at the same event she wins against a female shakehander (Li Zhuyun) with long pips on the back. This page has a lot of videos and this is the last one:
http://www.weishi.com/u/54090927

Some (most? all?) of this seems to be from 2015/2016, judging from the appearance and body language. It includes some hitting vs. very strong males and also Ding Ning. The title says "Officially Introducing Zhou Xintong".
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=80RMB3g_iPQ

This video is from the 2015 China Women's Team Championship Semifinal. She loses the match but there's lots of great action. I would suggest the point beginning at 2:14, for example. This site sometimes makes you wait:
http://v.qq.com/x/page/q0168e0payz.html


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PostPosted: 04 Oct 2016, 01:43 
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Zhaoyang wrote:
At a ranking of #85 in 2014, it seems that she stopped playing internationally, but she is on the national team (if I'm not mistaken) and - I believe - is training the others, male and female, against long pips. She has pumped up the offense quite a bit and sometimes seems to have a more aggressive body language. I could be wrong about some of these dates.

This is from 2016. She wins vs. a strong older male penholder (Xu Xiaofeng) who seems to be playing with short pips. Warning, he brutalizes her 11-2 in the first game:
http://www.weishi.com/t/200056801757996 ... 8017579963

Apparently at the same event she wins against a female shakehander (Li Zhuyun) with long pips on the back. This page has a lot of videos and this is the last one:
http://www.weishi.com/u/54090927

Some (most? all?) of this seems to be from 2015/2016, judging from the appearance and body language. It includes some hitting vs. very strong males and also Ding Ning. The title says "Officially Introducing Zhou Xintong".
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=80RMB3g_iPQ

This video is from the 2015 China Women's Team Championship Semifinal. She loses the match but there's lots of great action. I would suggest the point beginning at 2:14, for example. This site sometimes makes you wait:
http://v.qq.com/x/page/q0168e0payz.html


awesome stuff. These type of players are rare & hard to find on US mainstream channels ex: youtube. You have to go to YouKU for a lot of them and here you've posted several sites I've never heard of.

Anyways, keep up the good work. thanks.

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PostPosted: 04 Oct 2016, 06:24 
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thanks! she is fun to watch :clap:

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PostPosted: 04 Oct 2016, 23:36 
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Edit: I had posted that I though her blade had changed again, based on those new videos above, but after examining this matter very closely I changed my mind.


Last edited by Zhaoyang on 12 Oct 2016, 09:55, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: 05 Oct 2016, 03:45 
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I can't get over enough of how much good content is on this weishi site.

Just find a player you like. Copy their name, even though I can't read a single thing from it, past it in the search and go nuts. Currently looking at everything 黄建疆 :)

Zhaoyang, you're the best.

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PostPosted: 06 Oct 2016, 01:45 
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Edit: I posted some numbers here which I later determined were incorrect. I improved my methods and reposted, two posts down from here.


Last edited by Zhaoyang on 01 Dec 2017, 05:23, edited 1 time in total.

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