OOAK Table Tennis Forum

Tonight I lost against a player who is very defense orientated. No matter what serve I'd do, he'd return with backspin. Not so much a severe chop as a strong backspin push. The reason I say not a severe chop as I've seen real choppers in action and its not like that but still pretty good backspin for our standard.

I'm looking for some tactics against this type of player. At times he would pop up a return or send them long but not as often as I would like and there was a bit too much spin that I wasn't confident to loop them so got stuck in a bit of a pushing game. Worked early as I was 2 games up but then he made a few less errors and worked his way into it to win in the 5th. One thing is that when I do get a good spinny slow loop in he really can't control it and nearly always hits it long. I know as soon as I do one I've virutally won the point.

Is it a matter of just getting better at this shot and loop everything possible or are there other things I can do such as a certain serve that might give him trouble or at least set up an easy shot for me?

Note that the match before I beat someone I hadn't beaten about 3 years. I was playing really well and looping quite well but the difference was that this guy doesn't play with lot of spin, he's just very very solid so I was able to play a very aggressive game and have control.

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Donic Waldner Senso V1,FH Baracuda Big Slam 2.0mm ,BH Victas Triple Regular 2.0mm

So did you try all options on your serve? Long topspin, long dead, long sidespin (with and without either some mixed in topside or underside).

Did you go short side, side top or top (double bounce)?

Rare players can chop all of these. I did play a player once in Utah who seemed to be able to chop or push anything. I had to open and loop. May as well try or go down swinging!

A lot of this unfortunately has to do with serving and looping ability and the ability of the opponent. If you have deceptive serves, you can serve no spin and topspin combinations and no spin and backspin combinations both short and long and see what kinds of returns you get. If their flick is poor, short topspin tends to be really effective as they rarely will be able to push that short, but a skilled opponent can chop it short even if high if he reads it.

Looping repeatedly is an option but if your opponent hardly attacks, there is no need to do this. Sometimes, if you have a good push, pushing wide or with sidespin may get weaker returns for you to attack.

In addition to a slow spinny loop, you need a relatively flat drive/smash against the high ball. It soesnt have to be very flat, but it has to harder to chop than a topspin oriented shot. A good loop gets popped up and then you need to learn to open your paddle and then flat hit or smash the ball.

Lastly, be aware of what you are serving. Sometimes, when I play a player like this, I make the mistake of serving too many heavy backspin serves which they dig into and give e heavy chop back, which is not bad if I am set to loop the third ball, but is bad if I don't have the positioning or energy to loop the ball. Lighter backspin/no spin mixed in gets you easier balls to attack. But you need the deceptive mix - obvious serves will get quality returns.

Hope any of this helps.

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Cobra Kai TT Exponent (Mercy effs up your Game)
One-Loop Man: One Loop... Again????
Lumberjack TT Exponent

"We don't rise to the level of our expectations, we fall to the level of our training" - Archilochus

Yes. At the end of the day you need to be able to lift backspin very consistently. Aim to loop every long chop he gives you - even if you miss in the beginning. It will be good for your development.

This person is a regular at our small practice sessions so I might even be able to practice against him.

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Donic Waldner Senso V1,FH Baracuda Big Slam 2.0mm ,BH Victas Triple Regular 2.0mm

We would be more than happy if You just always give Us Our favourite topspin ball. ;P (Member of Chopper Association)

Both Carbon and Next answer true, train to chopper strength, play to His weakness

Tonight I again played the above player. I played pretty defensive and hardly hit a spinny forehand, might have only been once or twice and both times the ball came back long. The match was so close that I wasn't confident enough to keep looping the backspin and risk losing the point so got trapped playing his game.

I did try the short topspin serves as suggested and for a while it was working really well, they were popping up for an easy put away. Then he started changing his approach and it wasn't so easy.

We both had phases of momentum and the game could have gone either way. In the last game I got to 8-5 when he hit the top of the net and it dribbled over. That point would have made it real nice bit he worked his way back in and then at 9-10 down and serving I went for one I'd got a couple of free points from and went for a bit much and sent it long. Dumb mistake, and not something I often do.

My summation is as above, I need to back myself more looping against backspin but also practice over and over.

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Donic Waldner Senso V1,FH Baracuda Big Slam 2.0mm ,BH Victas Triple Regular 2.0mm

DOH I just wrote a big reply then closed the tab by accident!!

The only way to consistently beat pushers is to learn how to consistently loop the ball. Most pushers, especially those at a higher level, can return a wide array of serves with a heavy backspin push.

In our local league we have pushers right up to Division 1 standard. They serve well, receive really well, push heavily and consistently, and can occasionally slap a ball past you. Below that standard we have pushers who can be beaten with good serves or by messing them up with pimples, or because they just don't push heavily/consistently enough so they make attacking easy.

The reason we don't have any pure pushers in our Premier division is because as soon as they play against someone who can loop the ball consistently, they have no ability to win the game. Obviously a pusher can become a chopper if they're able to chop away from the table but even then there are only three "choppers" in our Premier (of which I'm one!) because an orthodox looper who can consistently lift backspin can dictate the play against a defensive player.

In my last 3 league matches I've played 7/9 defensive players. 2 pure choppers, 1 push/blocker, 2 retrievers and 2 blockers. I won all of those games apart from one.

The match I lost was against a retriever. Double inverted. He pushed heavily and relentlessly into my left arm. I couldn't lift the ball enough to attack with my pimples, I couldn't play half-shots because the backspin was too heavy and I couldn't serve or pimples-push him into making mistakes. That meant I had to be brave enough to come all the way round my backhand corner to play my forehand. In the first end I did that and took the end, but as soon as I was a couple of points behind it got really difficult. Before I next play him I intend to work on my twiddled inverted loop - hopefully if I loop a couple at him from that wing early in the game it'll discourage him from relentlessly pushing into my backhand.

But yeah, not really sure why I told you that Work on playing against backspin on both wings if possible, otherwise practice your footwork well enough to enable using your forehand against pushes right into your backhand corner. If I was coaching a new player, it's one of the very first things I'd look to teach.

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Sounds like my scenario exactly. Heavy pushes with the occasional attacking slap past you.

Looks like more loop practice it is.

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Donic Waldner Senso V1,FH Baracuda Big Slam 2.0mm ,BH Victas Triple Regular 2.0mm

Heh heh heh... sounds like our weekend doubles group. I'm the only one who tries to loop. There's a hitter of sorts, the other two mainly push. The best of the four is one of the pushers, plays with an old dead bat. I'd say none of us is better than 1350.

Iskandar