OOAK Table Tennis Forum

My practice partner is in his mid 40's. He's an ex-tennis player and has been playing table tennis for many years. Over this time he's built is own way of doing things and though its far from text book, it can be quite effective. With his technique though, does come with some problems which with slightly better technique, I think he can be a bit more consistent on certain shots such as loops and smashes.

Similar to myself, we've tried rebuilding his forehand and despite him being a decent sports person and a clever person, he just can't pick up the feel of the technique. I'm feeling like I should be able to help him but struggling a bit on what to do next. I've tried various approaches and when he does air swings, he starts on the right track but as soon as a ball comes at him, he tends to go back to his old habits.

As posted in another thread, here is the video of him in action


I'm not so much asking what he's doing wrong as we've both analysed the video and come up with several things. What I'm interested in is what approach do I take, is there any drills that will help? As I said, the best he looks is when there is no ball. Perhaps he needs to do some time in front of the mirror?

I don't think so as I believe anyone can change if they really want to and work hard but perhaps some people are so ingrained in their old habits that there is no escape?

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Donic Waldner Senso V1,FH Baracuda Big Slam 2.0mm ,BH Victas Triple Regular 2.0mm

I think this is a very pertinent and interesting question. You can see in my attempts to learn a backspin serve that I am having similar issues. In my shadow swings, my form is good, but as soon as I hit the ball, my bad habits come in.

Basically, this is the same when trying to correct or retrain anything, especially something with muscle memory associated with it. All you can do is repeat, repeat, repeat, and look for rapid feedback. Based on what I've learned from Brett, the following template seems to be the right approach:

- Start with 10 mins of shadow swings a day. This will really help the brain start to internalise the mechanics.
- Next move to slow, deliberate practice, focussing purely on the mechanics, and letting your brain work out the adjustments necessary to send the ball in the right direction. A robot is ideal for this, but a practice partner who can return the ball with a good degree of accuracy, or feed multiball is also good. You're looking for a pace of a shot every 1-1.5 seconds, so well below match speed, and you're looking to hit the ball at well below power/pace.
- Video the slow deliberate practice, and stop after two minutes to get feedback. Notice one thing to try to work on, and visualise the shot with the correction in place. Then do a few shadow swings, and then go back to the slow practice.
- Repeat - keep checking back every two minutes and making corrections
- Keep up the visualisation and shadow swings away from the table

If you keep doing this for a month, you will surely overcome your bad habits.

Now: what's the motivation for this? If there's no motivation, you won't stick at it. So ensure you're doing it for a reason that matters to you, to get you through the periods where you feel fed up at your lack of progres, and bored with the same old practice!

I'm on this journey now... but others have travelled it, and it's proven to be successful.

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Yasaka Sweden Classic | 802 OX | C8 OX
Check out my blog - LordCope's Latest Learning Log - 10+ years of accumulate mistakes!

I think as LordCope has mentioned, the biggest part is the goal and the motivation. I improved my loop and counterhit to make my forehand more formidable against higher rated players. It didn't get me what I thought it would get me, but the motivation kept me at it and I get better every day.

Sometimes, I wonder about the value of general stroke training for adults. If it isn't structured in a way that addresses specific problems the student is facing, it is hard to get motivated. Sometimes, you have to look at how you are losing points in a match to see that if this was better, a lot of things would change.

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Cobra Kai TT Exponent (Mercy effs up your Game)
One-Loop Man: One Loop... Again????
Lumberjack TT Exponent

"We don't rise to the level of our expectations, we fall to the level of our training" - Archilochus

Well, alrighty then.

My regular hitting partner also has some pretty odd strokes. He also has a tennis background.

At this point he has taken to hitting my loops as hard as he can at the table. You'd be surprised how often it works. It works because my loops are often pretty high. I'm still going for a margin of error while developing. He's decided that blocking is no good against it anymore - so just smack it hard and hope that works out.

This turned into a complete disaster for him at a tourney - he wasn't 'on' and lost nearly every point when someone looped at him.

Sadly, due to his thought that my loops aren't very good (ones he's quite used to) - he's come to the conclusion there is no point in working on them himself. He's dooming himself to being a 1400 rated player forever and I am helpless to fix this it seems.

The funny thing is that my loop game gives lots of players trouble and is pretty reliable every day - his game has moments of disaster and success.

What makes you think the reason he missed your loops is because they aren't good?

Sometimes, the reason people hit your loops is that they are good - they actually have spin to work with. It's when loops don't have spin that it is harder to use the existing spin on the ball to smash them.

A point sometimes comes when the spin is so heavy that it makes smashing harder, but I doubt those are the kinds of people your opponent is facing as he probably wouldn't be able to even think about smashing were that the case.

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Cobra Kai TT Exponent (Mercy effs up your Game)
One-Loop Man: One Loop... Again????
Lumberjack TT Exponent

"We don't rise to the level of our expectations, we fall to the level of our training" - Archilochus

I don't want to thread jack, but the loop isn't a 'kill' shot in his opinion, so it's a pointless shot.

I guess if my loop kill was better he would not have that opinion? In the end it's really difficult to get him to consider training differently.

Nah. Some people never get the thing about looping. Even Ma Long at one time looped like you. Even I at one time looped like you. But it doesn't get better unless you start. And when you do it properly, you are .1600+ automatically.

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Cobra Kai TT Exponent (Mercy effs up your Game)
One-Loop Man: One Loop... Again????
Lumberjack TT Exponent

"We don't rise to the level of our expectations, we fall to the level of our training" - Archilochus