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PostPosted: 15 Aug 2012, 01:54 
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Bogeyhunter wrote:
Honestly, I think my girl could pick a team with 2nd tier players like Wang Liqin, Chen Qi and Ma Lin to win team. Training? They all have personal coaches.
I'm sure you know how far Chinese are ahead of the world.


Honestly?
Guess in your eyes, your little girl is equal or close to a Liu Guoliang or you believe that CNT's sucess is base on the players and not coaching staff.
So why don't CNT get a young Chinese girl to be head coach rather?

Maybe if you can hear what LGL communicates to his players during game break or time outs, then you will certainly think otherwise, honestly.

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PostPosted: 15 Aug 2012, 11:25 
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ZApenholder wrote:
Bogeyhunter wrote:
Honestly, I think my girl could pick a team with 2nd tier players like Wang Liqin, Chen Qi and Ma Lin to win team. Training? They all have personal coaches.
I'm sure you know how far Chinese are ahead of the world.


Honestly?
Guess in your eyes, your little girl is equal or close to a Liu Guoliang or you believe that CNT's sucess is base on the players and not coaching staff.
So why don't CNT get a young Chinese girl to be head coach rather?

Maybe if you can hear what LGL communicates to his players during game break or time outs, then you will certainly think otherwise, honestly.


I don't want to get into "behind computer war of words" with you but do you think a team of Wang Liqin, Chen Qi and Ma Lin will beat German or Korea or Japan team?

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PostPosted: 15 Aug 2012, 17:59 
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Bogeyhunter wrote:
ZApenholder wrote:
Bogeyhunter wrote:
Honestly, I think my girl could pick a team with 2nd tier players like Wang Liqin, Chen Qi and Ma Lin to win team. Training? They all have personal coaches.
I'm sure you know how far Chinese are ahead of the world.


Honestly?
Guess in your eyes, your little girl is equal or close to a Liu Guoliang or you believe that CNT's sucess is base on the players and not coaching staff.
So why don't CNT get a young Chinese girl to be head coach rather?

Maybe if you can hear what LGL communicates to his players during game break or time outs, then you will certainly think otherwise, honestly.


I don't want to get into "behind computer war of words" with you but do you think a team of Wang Liqin, Chen Qi and Ma Lin will beat German or Korea or Japan team?


Yes, I think a third string CNT team could even cause an upset,
second string can match or beat.

At the end of the day, credits must be given to the head coach, coaching staff, managment/team leaders and all practice partners. Without them, these heros are just zeros. The comparison of German Coach in Chinese Team won't work if these German Coach don't do the same, but I would say if you put German Team under LGL's system with something like 50 people behind 3 players - it will work, but not some kid.

I also don't want to get into word war, but to think that certain people believe that any kid can replace LGL (of all coaches) is really a big insult (at first I thought you guys were joking). Could your kid even say 10% of what LGL says to his players during time out?
Well, actually it doesn't matter what the rest of the world think, it is important what the players think, and all of them are grateful they have LGL as head coach and coaching them to victory. A good soldier is useless if you don't have good generals.

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PostPosted: 15 Aug 2012, 19:07 
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Let me add something that Yang Ying stated in one of the games.

Liu GuoLiang has one of the best minds in the game.
He can see things that other people don't see or take longer to see.
He can read his players very well
During the 1 min break inbetween games or time out, he adds so much value to boost his players.
As from a player point of few, it is a chess/mind game and no longer about skills.
With someone like LGL sitting behind you can see (from a different angle) a lot more than you as a player.

Now some kid can do that?
I don't even think your average 50 year old amateur player with 35 years history of playing TT 10 hours a week can do that - yet alone some kid.

LGL went through one of the toughest coaches in Cai, and even at 36 years old, he has been in the game for about 10 hours a day for 20 years. That is 10h x 300d x 20 = 60 000 hours. Your kid needs to be 7 years old just to breath the same time/length of air to even match LGL TT hours.

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PostPosted: 15 Aug 2012, 19:41 
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I never said my kid is better than L GL or can replace him. I guess someone assumed it?
Do I really think 2nd team will win. Hell yea!!! Or my kid pick an order to play and they will win? Yes again.

Disagree? Fine with me.

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PostPosted: 15 Aug 2012, 20:11 
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Bogeyhunter wrote:
I never said my kid is better than L GL or can replace him. I guess someone assumed it?
Do I really think 2nd team will win. Hell yea!!! Or my kid pick an order to play and they will win? Yes again.

Disagree? Fine with me.



Well, this thread is about Liu Guoliang and not about your kid or the players.

You were suggesting that your kid can pick players and still win (in a LGL thread)
Same applies if people are saying that the players will win without LGL being there - your kid just sit in the back and pick the player order and do nothing for the rest of the match
What does that mean?

If you are putting your kid into LGL's shoe etc, or stating that players can still win without a LGL figure, then that just means he adds zero value to the Gold medal won by his players - which is okay, but to state that even your kid can do that, then it is more of an insult than just saying that LGL added zero value. So I think you were joking about your kid picking the team, as it is way beyond just a paper with a list of players name.

Great players doesn't make a great coach, and from results - in consideration with the current TT enviroment and conditions, LGL has proven to me he is a greater coach than just a great player.
I have been invovle with coaching as well as knowing how the Chinese system works. So I know what goes on behind the scene, It is not easy!

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Last edited by ZApenholder on 15 Aug 2012, 20:56, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: 15 Aug 2012, 20:54 
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Yeah yeah...I insult L GL. Gonna ban me?
L GL - great player, but best coach ever? Not until he proves that he can win without those 3 of the best 5 players in the world.
And that's my point, when someone has #1, #2 and #3 or #4 players in the world his team is expected to win.

Sorry MOD, just feel like posting everything I think lately. Trying to match ZAP's 13 average posts a day at MYTT. I got 3 more today.

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PostPosted: 15 Aug 2012, 21:04 
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Bogeyhunter wrote:
Yeah yeah...I insult L GL. Gonna ban me?
L GL - great player, but best coach ever? Not until he proves that he can win without those 3 of the best 5 players in the world.
And that's my point, when someone has #1, #2 and #3 or #4 players in the world his team is expected to win.

Sorry MOD, just feel like posting everything I think lately. Trying to match ZAP's 13 average posts a day at MYTT. I got 3 more today.


As I said, no need to use your daughter as a comparison tool to degrade LGL - even if people believe his players deserve all the credit
Also, whats your purpose of bringing in MyTT into this? You have nothing else you can use? lol

Sad to think that as LGL did his job correctly and getting his soldiers to be top 5 in a world - is wrong.....
I don't know what can make you happy, you sure think differently to most people I know.

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PostPosted: 16 Aug 2012, 00:02 
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ZApenholder,

Just because a number of members do not think LG is the greatest coaches ever does not mean we think he is horrible. He MAY be the absolute greatest ever, but no one really knows because he has 5 aces in his hand come poker time. I think he is/was one the great players of all time-that is pretty well agreed on. In terms of getting people to agree with this title thread is almost impossible. Only way it would happen would be for him to migrate to any other country and pull off the upset-then you will get more agreement. Till then, you are arguing an impossible case no matter how much behind the scenes info you got.

PS I think most would agree with Bogeyhunter on this one.


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PostPosted: 16 Aug 2012, 00:19 
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PostPosted: 16 Aug 2012, 00:34 
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vanjr wrote:
ZApenholder,

Just because a number of members do not think LG is the greatest coaches ever does not mean we think he is horrible. He MAY be the absolute greatest ever, but no one really knows because he has 5 aces in his hand come poker time. I think he is/was one the great players of all time-that is pretty well agreed on. In terms of getting people to agree with this title thread is almost impossible. Only way it would happen would be for him to migrate to any other country and pull off the upset-then you will get more agreement. Till then, you are arguing an impossible case no matter how much behind the scenes info you got.

PS I think most would agree with Bogeyhunter on this one.


I understand and can support the ones that don't think LGL is the best - as I have stated already. So rather give the credit to the player than stating - even my daughter can get it right..... etc, as is a bit over board or "ridicules" - isn't that so?
If the daughter is that good, why the heck doesn't China come and scout her? maybe the whole CNT team is wrong and doing a bad job lol, any ways, LGL is good (labelled as one of the best in CNT), his players are good, the whole system of Zhang Jike from age 6 to 24 is good.

So why is Bogeyhunter commenting on my post per day in MyTT, what is wrong with that? If every one has 0.000001 post per day, then the forum will be very empty, plus if people think I am not providing value information, then be man and tell me straight!. I am happy he added 3 post today :D
I just wondered if he ran out of things to talk about to bring in "personal related things" - and I would like to thank the Mod in reminding us on the rules.

BTW, I don't like LGL as a person, but I respect him as a coach of China and I might not agree to all his methods (some are just too crue), but it works. And for a powerhouse like China that can trust LGL with this job, I think he is better at it them some little kid or even other coaching staff for that matter.

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PostPosted: 16 Aug 2012, 02:02 
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Liu Guoliang is a monster of a coach. Don't know about being one of the greatest ever, but with his pedigree as a player he gets his stubborn CNT members' attention like no other come game time, and that's a well-known fact in CNT circles. He's also widely credited in China for building the most formidable decade in Chinese men's table tennis in history, after he was specifically targeted by ITTF to institute hidden service ban and the banning of his rubber that forced him to retire prematurely. Even his name alone (the "Pillar of the Nation") strikes fear in the hearts of most tt students in China.


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PostPosted: 16 Aug 2012, 05:49 
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ZApenholder wrote:
Also, whats your purpose of bringing in MyTT into this? You have nothing else you can use? lol


No propose at all. Just type whatever come thru my mind.
4 today!!!

"If people think I am not providing value information, then be man and tell me straight" - Sorry for not being a man enough and just drop a hint. Well then, next time I'll be more straight.

Sorry again Mod. Don't mind if you delete this. Just feel like I expressed my opinion and somehow he came up with "Lui can do !@#$% in 1 minute" and I never mention that L GL can't do it. Never even mention he's a bad coach. I just say a fact(well maybe not a fact but you get my point) that ....... I'd done with L GL so let's do a comparison that a basketball coach who has Kobe + L James + K Durant + ....10 more super star names.... and win world championship would be a well done job but greatest ever?

Taking a Norway, Portugal, China or non top-10 country in the world to win World basketball championship would be the great one.
Or I think it'd never happen but I don't think L GL can coach Portugal, Sweden or even Korea and win world championship or the Olympic.
Many just happy to get a medal, don't have to be gold or silver.
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PostPosted: 16 Aug 2012, 06:06 
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Bogeyhunter wrote:
ZApenholder wrote:
Also, whats your purpose of bringing in MyTT into this? You have nothing else you can use? lol


No propose at all. Just type whatever come thru my mind.
4 today!!!

"If people think I am not providing value information, then be man and tell me straight" - Sorry for not being a man enough and just drop a hint. Well then, next time I'll be more straight.

Sorry again Mod. Don't mind if you delete this. Just feel like I expressed my opinion and somehow he came up with "Lui can do !@#$% in 1 minute" and I never mention that L GL can't do it. Never even mention he's a bad coach. I just say a fact(well maybe not a fact but you get my point) that ....... I'd done with L GL so let's do a comparison that a basketball coach who has Kobe + L James + K Durant + ....10 more super star names.... and win world championship would be a well done job but greatest ever?

Taking a Norway, Portugal, China or non top-10 country in the world to win World basketball championship would be the great one.
Or I think it'd never happen but I don't think L GL can coach Portugal, Sweden or even Korea and win world championship or the Olympic.
Many just happy to get a medal, don't have to be gold or silver.
http://tabletennista.com/2012/8/table-t ... 0-olympic/


you are incredible

Please ask your kid to coach China, as you provided info that TT is in danger, so we need some one to get China to loose - but I recomend you can start another thread to do that. So this thread can just be about LGL's credit or lack of rather than some super kid, please?

So you win okay? happy?
Bye bye

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PostPosted: 16 Aug 2012, 09:02 
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LGL is easily the Phil Jackson of modern table tennis... Well respected in China, disliked/dismissed by most outside of his domain.

The fact is I have yet to hear one bad word about him from any Chinese player or coach, including those who moved overseas... He commands great respect among the Chinese community, and I don't think he gives a damn about what foreigners think anyway... There are haters about anything, anywhere.


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