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PostPosted: 10 Aug 2012, 10:37 
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Is Liu Guoliang one of the all time best Coaches ever?
His side line approach , his time outs, His words that bring back players back from sure loses, his ability to get superstars to play as a team, his enjoyment, his support, his openness about what he says to players and how they feel in certain situations, His planing, his calmness, his ability to do his job description, his will to win, his inventiveness
His pure ability to be the best and to get the best out of everyone and his ability to win


http://www.ittf.com/_front_page/ittf_full_story1.asp?ID=28719&Competition_ID=2003&Category=&Competition_ID=&

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PostPosted: 10 Aug 2012, 14:02 
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No doubt he's a great coach, however I'd imagine probably any competent coach would win with a team consisting of the world's top five players.

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PostPosted: 10 Aug 2012, 14:23 
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LGL is one of the great Chinese coaches but probably not the best.
One thing is different: he doesn't "fix" the match results for his players. Players are allowed to play for real.


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PostPosted: 10 Aug 2012, 15:35 
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mynamenotbob wrote:
No doubt he's a great coach, however I'd imagine probably any competent coach would win with a team consisting of the world's top five players.

yes good point, but hasn't he a been a reason for getting these players to the top, even over all these years does it happen that much to have all the Worlds best from 1 Country

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PostPosted: 10 Aug 2012, 15:39 
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shaolinTT wrote:
LGL is one of the great Chinese coaches but probably not the best.
One thing is different: he doesn't "fix" the match results for his players. Players are allowed to play for real.

I think that he must be considered one of the best ever considering his age, his results and his ability to lift players at the right time.
I do agree that in theory in the past Wang Hao, would have been selected to win this Olympics so it's great to know (or feel we know) that it was just a open fair match

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PostPosted: 10 Aug 2012, 15:55 
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rodderz wrote:
mynamenotbob wrote:
No doubt he's a great coach, however I'd imagine probably any competent coach would win with a team consisting of the world's top five players.

yes good point, but hasn't he a been a reason for getting these players to the top, even over all these years does it happen that much to have all the Worlds best from 1 Country

Well, Shi Zhihao's results with the women certainly match Liu's.

Also if Rosskopf and Liu switched places, China would still win.

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PostPosted: 10 Aug 2012, 22:48 
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mynamenotbob wrote:

Also if Rosskopf and Liu switched places, China would still win.


I don't agree that if Rosskopf and Liu switch places that China would still win.
The coach is not just the guy sitting outside while his player is playing a match. And a lot of people are just taking that China has top5 so default - any coach will make this team win? So let me ask, how did China get players into the top5? Who coached them?

LGL has been invovled with CNT as headcoach I think for about 10 years now.
Before that he was a mentor, a big brother to a lot of players, and before that he was a national hero, where a lot of youngsters want to grow up and be a LGL or be an olympic champion etc.

LGL has one of the most technical minds and knows how to read his players problem and knows what to say and how to say it. There is no doubt that he can turn his players around - from defeat to wins. He doesn't just tell his player - good shot or don't worry, but rather in 1 min he can redo an entire strategy.

Close training, LGL uses tough love and really bring all these super stars to the ground and to teach them to be humble. He will drill them hard and not shy on pinpointing what flaws his star may have, including stating that if you can't get it right - you can retire now. His attitude is go big or go home, there is no inbetweens. He is scary and players have fear in them, but they have more respect too. Overall the coach-student with LGL has been a success the past few years.

I believe if it wasn't for LGL, China wouldn't be so dominent, as TT is evoled more into a Chess game than a racket sport.
He really added a lot of value, as the saying goes - Table Tennis at this high level is no longer about technique, but rather phsycological, and CNT has LGL to coach them there.


I think it will just get harder and harder for any CNT head coach.
And I think LGL is a much better coach than as a TT player.

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PostPosted: 11 Aug 2012, 00:30 
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One of the best players maybe...


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PostPosted: 11 Aug 2012, 18:05 
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I tend to agree, Sir.

However I am more amazed by the pioneers of Chinese's table tennis coaching.
Coach Liu is awesome for continuing the momentum. Exceptionally awesome at that.

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PostPosted: 11 Aug 2012, 18:31 
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I have to say, I think I could be the Chinese coach and they would keep on winning for a long time yet. It's the infrastructure BELOW the coach which makes his job so much easier than, say, the coach of your average European team.

Probably Zhang Xielin (women's coach for years) has the best success rate of any. And it would have been more had he not indulged in plenty of match-fixing and 'Friendship' dumping (such as Zhang Li's World Championship dumps to Pak Yung Sun).

Respect to Guoliang, though. He got the job while still young (and very soon after his playing career ended) and he has done it with aplomb.


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PostPosted: 14 Aug 2012, 01:28 
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rodderz wrote:
Is Liu Guoliang one of the all time best Coaches ever?
His side line approach , his time outs, His words that bring back players back from sure loses, his ability to get superstars to play as a team, his enjoyment, his support, his openness about what he says to players and how they feel in certain situations, His planing, his calmness, his ability to do his job description, his will to win, his inventiveness
His pure ability to be the best and to get the best out of everyone and his ability to win


http://www.ittf.com/_front_page/ittf_full_story1.asp?ID=28719&Competition_ID=2003&Category=&Competition_ID=&


I was joking with friends when watching the team final that my 3 years old girl could be a head coach sitting court side and win the Olympic gold!!!!
All she has to do is to pick order of who play first, second and double and we all know it's super easy when choices to pick from are Wang Hao, Ma Long and ZJK. Any order would get the job done.

:)

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PostPosted: 14 Aug 2012, 02:01 
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I am happy that you guys all think that any one can be a LGL of CNT and coach them to victory and that is an easy job. So in other words LGL can sleep and his army will still win? Or LGL can retire, and the momentum will still continue?

LGL hinted that he wants to retire by age 40.
So to me, this is indeed a difficult job and it comes with a lot of stress, hardwork and over time. The brain and experience is what
makes LGL so important to China and a lot of people don't dare say they can replace LGL. Not even KLH imo.
I wish it was indeed that "easy" as you guys pointing it out to be, as I wish to see LGL longer than just retiring in a few years time.

I see a lot of people are pointing out on the technique part of the players. LGL is there for the phsycological part + strategy, while the only technical part will be new discoveries or strokes/services etc. The technique part is for the individual coaches to worry about. Each coach has 2 students, and all are under LGL.

If the coaches before CNT is that good/succesfull and given all or most of the credit of the CNT Gold medal team, then why isn't all the ex prov or ex CNT players (that went throught he same system) that choose to play for another country not in the top 10 in the world too? Besides Feng of Singapore, I don't see much of your theories showing good results.

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PostPosted: 14 Aug 2012, 06:57 
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Bogeyhunter wrote:
rodderz wrote:
Is Liu Guoliang one of the all time best Coaches ever?
His side line approach , his time outs, His words that bring back players back from sure loses, his ability to get superstars to play as a team, his enjoyment, his support, his openness about what he says to players and how they feel in certain situations, His planing, his calmness, his ability to do his job description, his will to win, his inventiveness
His pure ability to be the best and to get the best out of everyone and his ability to win


http://www.ittf.com/_front_page/ittf_full_story1.asp?ID=28719&Competition_ID=2003&Category=&Competition_ID=&


I was joking with friends when watching the team final that my 3 years old girl could be a head coach sitting court side and win the Olympic gold!!!!
All she has to do is to pick order of who play first, second and double and we all know it's super easy when choices to pick from are Wang Hao, Ma Long and ZJK. Any order would get the job done.

:)

Maybe but not the 2 years of preparation needed to get the players to 1,2.3,4 in the World, China is under all sorts of pressure to succeed and if they take the foot off the throat for a second it allows others thru , like 209 World teams for the Women, Liu is just good at being a winner

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PostPosted: 14 Aug 2012, 06:57 
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ZApenholder wrote:
mynamenotbob wrote:

Also if Rosskopf and Liu switched places, China would still win.


I don't agree that if Rosskopf and Liu switch places that China would still win.
The coach is not just the guy sitting outside while his player is playing a match. And a lot of people are just taking that China has top5 so default - any coach will make this team win? So let me ask, how did China get players into the top5? Who coached them?

LGL has been invovled with CNT as headcoach I think for about 10 years now.
Before that he was a mentor, a big brother to a lot of players, and before that he was a national hero, where a lot of youngsters want to grow up and be a LGL or be an olympic champion etc.

LGL has one of the most technical minds and knows how to read his players problem and knows what to say and how to say it. There is no doubt that he can turn his players around - from defeat to wins. He doesn't just tell his player - good shot or don't worry, but rather in 1 min he can redo an entire strategy.

Close training, LGL uses tough love and really bring all these super stars to the ground and to teach them to be humble. He will drill them hard and not shy on pinpointing what flaws his star may have, including stating that if you can't get it right - you can retire now. His attitude is go big or go home, there is no inbetweens. He is scary and players have fear in them, but they have more respect too. Overall the coach-student with LGL has been a success the past few years.

I believe if it wasn't for LGL, China wouldn't be so dominent, as TT is evoled more into a Chess game than a racket sport.
He really added a lot of value, as the saying goes - Table Tennis at this high level is no longer about technique, but rather phsycological, and CNT has LGL to coach them there.


I think it will just get harder and harder for any CNT head coach.
And I think LGL is a much better coach than as a TT player.

well said

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PostPosted: 15 Aug 2012, 01:04 
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rodderz wrote:
Bogeyhunter wrote:
rodderz wrote:
Is Liu Guoliang one of the all time best Coaches ever?
His side line approach , his time outs, His words that bring back players back from sure loses, his ability to get superstars to play as a team, his enjoyment, his support, his openness about what he says to players and how they feel in certain situations, His planing, his calmness, his ability to do his job description, his will to win, his inventiveness
His pure ability to be the best and to get the best out of everyone and his ability to win


http://www.ittf.com/_front_page/ittf_full_story1.asp?ID=28719&Competition_ID=2003&Category=&Competition_ID=&


I was joking with friends when watching the team final that my 3 years old girl could be a head coach sitting court side and win the Olympic gold!!!!
All she has to do is to pick order of who play first, second and double and we all know it's super easy when choices to pick from are Wang Hao, Ma Long and ZJK. Any order would get the job done.

:)

Maybe but not the 2 years of preparation needed to get the players to 1,2.3,4 in the World, China is under all sorts of pressure to succeed and if they take the foot off the throat for a second it allows others thru , like 209 World teams for the Women, Liu is just good at being a winner


Honestly, I think my girl could pick a team with 2nd tier players like Wang Liqin, Chen Qi and Ma Lin to win team. Training? They all have personal coaches.
I'm sure you know how far Chinese are ahead of the world.

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