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PostPosted: 19 Dec 2013, 00:31 
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Even if the Legend 105 technically is a medium pip, it plays very much like short pip, and it is perhaps best seen as a faster and more disruptive version of the 799, also by Friendship.
The Legend 105 was designed for shakehand forehand attack. There is a number of Chinese female players who, like Sim Ah Song, use MP on the forehand to attack with, as they lack the power to kill with SP, and therefore need disruption added to speed. This may also be why the Legend 105 is very light-weight, which makes it easier to handle repeatedly in a series of very quick and very fast returns. In my opinion it is too soft to use for a single-sided pips-out penholder style; harder rubbers tend to block better. If it is suitable for shakehand backhand use will depend on the player.
It plays like a SP in that it is insensitive to incoming spin and requires "flat" instead of grazing strokes. With these strokes it responds very fast, so it is also very effective to use with flicks over the table. It is also very acurate; its control is much better than, for instance, Friendships 802-40 Supersoft Pro short pip. The Legend 105 is faster as well. It is almost as fast as the new, factory-tuned Palio short pimpled rubbers; but it is not factory-tuned itself, which means it will retain its speed, whereas factory-tuned rubbers get slower over time. So, in practice, it is among the fastest attack pips available.
It is capable of making topspin, even away from the table (although like any pips-out rubber it will not really lift a dropping ball effectively), but the technique required is different from the one used for hard pips like 802 and 802-40; with the latter, the grip is on the tip of the pips and spin is made by grazing the ball very fast, rather superficiously. With the Legend, the topsheet is soft and the grip is more "inside", so you have to hit the ball inside the rubber and then add spin - it is, so to speak, a "deeper" grazing. Players used to classic SP will have to adjust for that, but players used to european short pips like Tibhar Speedy Soft will find the Legend 105 very similar.
The sink-effect of the Legend 105 is quite remarkable, at least as good or better than that of standard medium pips, and because it is so very fast, opponents have a lot of trouble to adapt to this. Flat hitting an incoming heavy loop, the Legend will reverse some of the spin; but if you add some wrist, your return will have a little topspin, and if you use a lot of wrist and hit he ball well into the rubber, the topspin on your return will be considerable. This is quite disruptive to opponents.
It is an absolutly ideal companion to LP on the backhand. It is very fast even on DEF blades. It can be used away from the table if needs be, that is where you are if you have to back off for chopping with the LP. It will kill bals that are returned to high, but also balls that are returned with awkward spin (side-top, side-back) which may occur in long-pip-to-pip exchanges; and it will produce very spinny serves - for that, the ball has to penetrate the rubber again, so a high toss will be handy.

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PostPosted: 19 Dec 2013, 00:50 
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Kees wrote:
It is an absolutly ideal companion to LP on the backhand. It is very fast even on DEF blades. It can be used away from the table if needs be, that is where you are if you have to back off for chopping with the LP. It will kill bals that are returned to high, but also balls that are returned with awkward spin (side-top, side-back) which may occur in long-pip-to-pip exchanges; and it will produce very spinny serves - for that, the ball has to penetrate the rubber again, so a high toss will be handy.


On your recommendation I've bought a sheet of this, with SpinLord Dornenglanz Black OX for the other side, to go one one of my Tibhar Defence Plus blades. The setup is a Christmas present, so I won't get to play it in anger until New Year... but I shall report back!

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PostPosted: 19 Dec 2013, 00:58 
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The Legend 105 is also sold in 1.7 mm with a slightly harder sponge (probably to prevent bottoming out on hard blocks), by eacheng.net. I guess this would be suitable for shakehand backhand.

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PostPosted: 19 Dec 2013, 01:08 
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Kees wrote:
The Legend 105 is also sold in 1.7 mm with a slightly harder sponge (probably to prevent bottoming out on hard blocks), by eacheng.net. I guess this would be suitable for shakehand backhand.


Mine is red, 1.9mm. From Japsko.

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PostPosted: 19 Dec 2013, 01:13 
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LordCope wrote:
Kees wrote:
The Legend 105 is also sold in 1.7 mm with a slightly harder sponge (probably to prevent bottoming out on hard blocks), by eacheng.net. I guess this would be suitable for shakehand backhand.


Mine is red, 1.9mm. From Japsko.

That would be the best one for forehand attack... Now I hope you'll like it, or my reputation will be shattered... :angel:

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PostPosted: 29 Dec 2013, 06:23 
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Just finished attaching it to my 2nd Tibhar Defence Plus, with SpinLord DG OX on t'other side. We shall give it a whirl on the "rubbish" table (nudge nudge), and then a proper knock on Monday at practice.

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PostPosted: 31 Dec 2013, 07:58 
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Not going to repeat myself here, but really for the sake of Kees - I've documented my impressions from first proper knock this evening on my 'blog'. But quick summary - really really pleased with this - it does everything - chops, blocks, spinny enough serves and flat hits. Lovely to play with. Thank you.

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PostPosted: 31 Dec 2013, 08:29 
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Kees wrote:
Even if the Legend 105 technically is a medium pip, it plays very much like short pip


It definitely plays like a short pip, having many of the characteristics of the Baxster I played with last season.

Quote:
the Legend 105 is very light-weight


Definitely lightweight. I have a very light blade, and OX on the other side, and the total bat weight is 87g.

Quote:
it is insensitive to incoming spin and requires "flat" instead of grazing strokes


I found I could return spinny serves not as easily as with the 755 on my other bat, or with the OX LP on this one, but still it was pretty insensitive compared to inverted.

Quote:
It is also very acurate; its control is much better than, for instance, Friendships 802-40 Supersoft Pro short pip.


I can't comment on the comparison, but I certainly found it very accurate - I could perform delicate drop shots and play nasty angles. Very nice to aim with.

Quote:
Players used to classic SP will have to adjust for that, but players used to european short pips like Tibhar Speedy Soft will find the Legend 105 very similar.


As mentioned, it felt not unlike the Donic Baxster, which is another exemplar European SP.

Quote:
Flat hitting an incoming heavy loop, the Legend will reverse some of the spin


I concur - I definitely experienced spin reversal on flat hits and blocks.

Quote:
It is an absolutly ideal companion to LP on the backhand.


This is my setup...

Quote:
It is very fast even on DEF blades.


Agreed - short hard hits flew - very good for flat hitting.

Quote:
It can be used away from the table if needs be


I was able to perform some pretty far back chops against loops with this.

Quote:
It will produce very spinny serves - for that, the ball has to penetrate the rubber again, so a high toss will be handy.


I don't have a very high toss, but even so I was able to give enough side or top to invite faults or easy 3rd ball hits on service.

To summarise - I agree with all of Kees' analysis - this is a superb rubber for my style, and works beautifully with the Tibhar Defence Plus.

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PostPosted: 10 Sep 2014, 05:44 
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I've been using Legend 105 1.9mm black for the past couple of sessions. It has replaced my 802 2.0mm 35* "special soft" sponge that I got from ZeroPong. I find the 105 to be better all around and definitely harder for opponents to play against. 105's strong points are accuracy, speed, and serve. It's also very light for a 1.9. Maybe I'm just bored with inverted but I'm having more fun playing with an SP/LP paddle.

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PostPosted: 10 Sep 2014, 23:14 
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I play with Legend 105 too and very happy with it. Great pip- easy to play with and not so easy to play against.
However it seems that 105 favours hard blades (hard outer ply) not soft ones. Legend fits perfectly my custom blade with anigre outer ply which I assume as medium hard. But when I tried to put it on my Hayabusa ZX that have limba outer ply it didn't work. Probably soft topsheet+soft sponge+soft outer ply give very muffled feeling. 802-40 fits soft outer ply much better.

P.S. My impression is that 105 Legend thread would have been more appropriate to Short Pimple rubbers section

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PostPosted: 04 Oct 2014, 07:46 
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Does anyone know how Legend 105 compares to Stiga Clippa? They are both the same price in the US.

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PostPosted: 15 Mar 2015, 02:19 
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Haven't played with the Legend 105, but from the descriptions here it sounds quite unlike the Clippa. Clippa is very grippy, plays almost like an inverted in my experience.

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PostPosted: 25 May 2015, 07:26 
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Actually, after 3 months of using 105 (again, since my first sheet's topsheet delaminated after extensive hardcore blocking practice), and some stroke adjustments which create a whole new strokes that become my signature backhand strokes inspired by wing chun's quick-slapping style combined with bruce lee's 1-inch punch :rofl: , I conclude this rubber is not a MP. From its physical appearance (pips height, width) even without precise measurement (just by comparing to some SPs and MPs), this rubber is a raw short pips, on the same classification as double fish's 820a 8)

Pros :
1. Good spin , especially when engaging sponge. This applies too with the 820a
2. What makes the difference between both is the speed. Since 820a's stock sponge is more on the dampening side, an extra oomph is needed to make a good pace, while it has superb control and easier to block any shots short right in front of the net. In the other hand, 105 has good speed on every offensive strokes due to elastic soft japanese sponge it uses. But, when you want to make a short blocks, though harder, it is not that much harder. Just a little adjusments, and you're there, with a greater attacking potential than 820a
3. Deception ? I feel both are the same. Still haven't found any difference except the blade angle which is normal (for me LoL)
4. Chops ? I cannot judge that well, since I rarely chops on matchplay, I prefer to end rallies quickly with forehand loopdrives and counterhitting, just the way fukuhara do (yes, I use her playstyle as one of reference other than tang peng and wang yuegu). Unless I'm a bit far from the table and I miss the timings on the backhand side, I won't chop, since 105 still able to generate good speed and spin for mid distance rally to keep the balls land on the table and give pressure to opponents.

What else, then,...oh well, to much good things I've experienced while using 105. Feel free to ask ;)

Now's the cons :
1. Don't know if this is qc issues or it's just me getting a bad batch, but its topsheet is pretty easy to separate from the sponge, luckily my 2nd one only slightly delaminated on the edges.
2. Again, don't know if this is qc issues, bad batch, or it is the intensity of my training sesions (20++ hours a week, yet I feel I'm still the same noob I used to be LoL), the pips started to break. Luckily only on the edges and it doesn't fully break apart so I decided to take a needle and some andro glue, put some drop of glue inside the pips' crack, press it a while, and it's good as new LoL

So where's the pluto ? Umm, I decided to keep it on my shelf for a while. Still can't get used to it, decided to focus on one setup for at least a year, and the club's 'pluto wars' is not as fun as it used to be since lots of people gave up using it LoL

Cheers,
Comodoensis

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