OOAK Table Tennis Forum

Dwell time can come from both the softness of the wood and the amount of flex in the blade.

For dwell due the softness of the wood, the closer the wood is to the point of impact, the greater the dwell. So, the outer ply will have the greatest contribution. If you have question about a certain type of wood, look up its Janka rating - it's a measurement of wood hardness. The lower the number, the softer the wood. The different varieties of cedar are on the low end of the scale and provide good dwell. Limba, too.

Dwell due to flex is a combination of type of wood and the physical composition of the blade. Things like the number and orientation of the plies, the percentage of wood grain running horizontally vs vertically, the overall thickness of the blade, the flexibility of each type of wood used all contribute to the flexibility of the blade.

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Ross
Handcrafted Table Tennis Blades

You must look at the combination about the kind of layers and also the kind of gluing. My tt-blade "Seven tt-holz" offers a real good dwell time because the kind of gluing and the direction from the different layers

uli

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Blade: ULMO Die Angel Off-
FS: Nimbus 2.0
BH: differnt LP (531a)

So if I wanted more dwell time on harder shots, should I move the soft wood to the second layer and get a core that didn't flex until hit hard?

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Blade: JOOLA Wing Medium
FH: Palio Thor's
BH: Yasaka Rakza 7 Soft

Welcome to the endless world of blade experimentation.

A soft medial ply can provide a cushion for a harder outer, so that its softness contributes more when the outer is hit hard. Regarding flex, my guess is that for the magnitude of forces involved, the deflection is going to be fairly linear for most blades. For highest flex, you want to either minimize the thickness and/or use high elasticity woods - especially on the outer plies (or orient the grain horizontally closer to the blades's surface). Each type of wood has its own modulus of elasticity (MOE - its measure of stiffness). The type of glue has a contribution (as Uli noted). The thickness of the plies has a contribution. There are so many variables involved that there's really no way to be fully certain of how a new composition will behave without empirical testing.

I'm convinced that this is why there is so little source data on blade composition - the manufacturer has expended so much time on experimental prototypes to arrive at a successful composition (some educated guesses and some luck) that they'd prefer not to give away the farm by revealing the details. What you do get is some crazy ad copy in marketingese - you know what I mean. "astounding disruptive blah due to blah, blah, blah"

IMO, that is.

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Ross
Handcrafted Table Tennis Blades

Thanks a lot Ross. Maybe as a Christmas present for myself you'll get an order from me lol.

I'm a chemical engineering major, so testing this stuff is very appealing to me.....except for the whole lack of money part so I have to ask tons of questions to get close to what I want....

As for the lack of blade composition information, that would be negated if someone took apart their blade to inspect the composition and assembly, but that might be another reason why blades can be so expensive. Nobody would really toss that much money just to see how exactly a TBS is assembled.

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Blade: JOOLA Wing Medium
FH: Palio Thor's
BH: Yasaka Rakza 7 Soft

I do wonder what the playing characteristics of cork are.

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Blade: American Hinoki 1-ply NWC 69 grams - Stiga Tube Carbo
FH: Juic 999 Turbo MAX - Andro Hexer HD 1.7
BH: Butterfly Spin Art 2.1 - Donic Acuda S1 Turbo 1.8

How fast is the westen red cedar on your site, ross?

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Blade: American Hinoki 1-ply NWC 69 grams - Stiga Tube Carbo
FH: Juic 999 Turbo MAX - Andro Hexer HD 1.7
BH: Butterfly Spin Art 2.1 - Donic Acuda S1 Turbo 1.8

Since it's very soft, it would be considered more of a control wood. However, make it thick enough (10mm) and you'd get some speed.

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Ross
Handcrafted Table Tennis Blades

I read that douglas-fir is almost identical to spruce.

Does anybody know about this?

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Blade: American Hinoki 1-ply NWC 69 grams - Stiga Tube Carbo
FH: Juic 999 Turbo MAX - Andro Hexer HD 1.7
BH: Butterfly Spin Art 2.1 - Donic Acuda S1 Turbo 1.8

I made a number of edits/updates/additions to the wood properties list, thanks to some helpful information provided by Julius.

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I. Re-Impact Tachi Plus 2019; FH: Nittaku FastArc G-1 1.4mm; BH: Saviga 77 Monster OX
II. Re-Impact Turbo; FH: Spinlord Sandwind 1.5mm; BH: DMS Kamikaze OX
III. Re-Impact Smart; FH: TSP Spinpips RED 2.1mm; BH: Dr. Neubauer Gangster OX
IV. Sauer & Troger Firestarter; FH: Spinlord Waran 1.8mm; BH: Giant Dragon Snowflake OX

So i saw spantex paper and black cloth on there. What would that do???? How about printer paper???

Does it cushion, or does it just use more glue the blade ends up stiffer?

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Happy Holidays 'round the world!

Basswood is also known as lime-tree.

Chequer tree [Sorbus torminalis, aka (wild) service tree, Elsbeere, Schweizer Birnbaum] is of medium hardness, very firm, but still elastic. As the second layer, it bestows a somewhat flatter return curve to the cover veneer. As outermost ply it is fast and especially useful for topspin with varying speed and spin.

very stiff and hard, this wood has, as an outermost ply, a flat return curve. It is mainly famous for providing much spin reversal to slick rubbers, but is also said to support smashing quite well.

Ipil (Intsia bijuga, aka merbau, kwila) is similar to wenge but somewhat less hard. It is also suited for near-table play, possibly with spin reversal, but somewhat slower than wenge.
Please be aware, according to Greenpeace large amounts of ipil timber sourced from illegal logging are being traded. At the current rate of logging the tree will go extinct within 35yr.

Maple. There is a big difference between Canadian and European maple, here I mainly refer to the latter. The wood is light, medium hard, slow, and has well-balanced properties with regard to spin and control. It may be used as any layer in a blade. Canadian maple is remarkably harder and more durable.

Okoumé (aka Gabun ) the wood is soft, rather elastic, and light-weight. It is typically used as core ply in ca. 2-4 mm thickness. It is an alternative to abachi as it is somewhat faster, spinnier, and has a flatter rebound curve.

Tineo (aka Indian Apple) is hard and has a somewhat flat return curve. As outer ply it is especially suited for topspin-smash play. It also supports spin reversal used with slick antis.

Wenge is extremely stiff and heavy. As outer ply, it is best suited for pips or antis operated near to the table, especially it supports spin reversal very well, but also some spin. It is not suited for pips in red, mounted without sponge because of its dark color shining through the rubber.

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Equipment: Dr Neubauer Firewall+ - Butterfly Tenergy 05 - Spinlab Vortex 2.3 (red sponge)

Now I know it's 100% Ayous
Might be a great transition to P700!

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GFoT |Blade : Timo Boll ALC • FH : DHS 3 Neo Provincial MAX • BH : Tenergy 64 MAX
Crossover to Takeover!

I do not know in therms of playing properties. However, in terms of biology, these are even different genera: douglas-fir is Pseudotsuga menziesii, whereas spruces belong biologically spoken to the genus Picea. Since often even neighboring species play different, it seems unlikely to me that the two mentioned ones play similar.

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Equipment: Dr Neubauer Firewall+ - Butterfly Tenergy 05 - Spinlab Vortex 2.3 (red sponge)

I just made a test blade and it looks okay.
Now I want to make a blade with a fast forehand and a very slow backhand for classic chopping with long pimples

I think Koto for the forehand is good, but what should I take for the backhand outer ply?
and what would you recommend for the inner plies and the core?

Thanks!

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Welcome to the dark side of table tennis....

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