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Two-Layer topsheet.
http://ooakforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=44&t=36062
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Author:  igorponger [ 10 Sep 2019, 09:35 ]
Post subject:  Two-Layer topsheet.

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Two-Layer topsheet. Manufacturing trickery.

Tamasu Butterfly SPINART
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Milky Way BIG DIPPER
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.... there are many more to come.

Author:  iskandar taib [ 10 Sep 2019, 12:23 ]
Post subject:  Re: Two-Layer topsheet.

If it's not Tenergy it's rubbish anyway, right? :lol: I think Russian forums must be full of these conspiracy theories.

Iskandar

Author:  haggisv [ 10 Sep 2019, 19:48 ]
Post subject:  Re: Two-Layer topsheet.

This should be checked during the ITTF approval stage... if they don't check for it, they've only got themselves to blame.

Author:  lasta [ 10 Sep 2019, 20:00 ]
Post subject:  Re: Two-Layer topsheet.

I don't think this is new. Even H3 national show these characteristics...

Any specific rule against material uniformity between outer layer and pips?

Author:  iskandar taib [ 10 Sep 2019, 20:50 ]
Post subject:  Re: Two-Layer topsheet.

The thing is.. what exactly do those photos show? Igor can claim to see two layer topsheets, but whether they are or not is open to interpretation. What exactly did they do to that poor sheet of Big Dipper? Use a bowtorch on it?

Iskandar

Author:  lasta [ 10 Sep 2019, 21:34 ]
Post subject:  Re: Two-Layer topsheet.

Hurricane 3

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Author:  iskandar taib [ 11 Sep 2019, 02:10 ]
Post subject:  Re: Two-Layer topsheet.

While that line MIGHT indicate there are two layers, it might also be caused by a shallow cut with a knife, followed by a deeper cut.

Iskandar

Author:  igorponger [ 11 Sep 2019, 06:20 ]
Post subject:  Re: Two-Layer topsheet.

UNMASK THE CGL RUBBERs

Composite Glue Layer (CGL) is a secret technology, and it is now growing very popular with many and many table tennis manufactures worldwide. Since it is an illegal black art, having been always prohibited by ITTF, none of manufacturers would dare to promulgate the secret for public's ears, to save one's life.

HOW DO I PROCEED.
You need some surgical skills to detach the outer tacky skin (finest skin of rubber material upto 0.1 millimeters thick) from the pimpled layer underneath.

Image
HEREBY, WE'D ASK YOU FOR SOME GOOD SERVICE :
-- Collect up all the rubber cuttings from your waste-basket and give them some thorough V-section, one after one. Be careful if using surgical knife for making dissections onto the rubbers.
-- Report us all the rubbers you did found to use the composite topsheet CGL. Be sure to attach a photo of the topsheet specimens .

Thank you a lot, in advance.


The most preffered rubbers to check for CGL
■ DHS Hurricane3 / DHS Hurricane2
■ Yinhe BIG DIPPER
■ Sanwei TARGET
■ Friendship 729-08
■ Haifu WHALE 2 / 3

Author:  iskandar taib [ 11 Sep 2019, 13:19 ]
Post subject:  Re: Two-Layer topsheet.

Hmph. It's what I've been saying all along - tacky rubbers are tacky because there's a layer of glue applied to the top. It comes off the "protector sheet" that you have to peel off before you use the rubber. But it's not molded into the topsheet, and it's a lot thinner than 0.1mm. And it wears off fairly quickly, which is when your rubber loses it's tack.

Dollars to donuts that nothing will ever happen - as usual, when Igor's last source of outrage is shown to be meaningless, he invents another one. Now he wants to "enlist" other people.

Iskandar

Author:  lasta [ 11 Sep 2019, 13:35 ]
Post subject:  Re: Two-Layer topsheet.

iskandar taib wrote:
Hmph. It's what I've been saying all along - tacky rubbers are tacky because there's a layer of glue applied to the top. It comes off the "protector sheet" that you have to peel off before you use the rubber. But it's not molded into the topsheet, and it's a lot thinner than 0.1mm. And it wears off fairly quickly, which is when your rubber loses it's tack.

Dollars to donuts that nothing will ever happen - as usual, when Igor's last source of outrage is shown to be meaningless, he invents another one. Now he wants to "enlist" other people.

Iskandar


Not to take sides, but the top layer of tacky rubber is either treated or bonded. This is the same for nearly ALL tacky rubbers and extends 1/4 to 1/2 of the non-pimple section of the topsheet. Not just a layer of glue. Also, most tacky rubbers don't wear off, a quick rinse and tackiness comes back.

Go to http://www.guoqiuhui.net for cross sections, to confirm that this is true for nearly/all tacky rubbers.

Author:  iskandar taib [ 11 Sep 2019, 14:09 ]
Post subject:  Re: Two-Layer topsheet.

If you look at ANY of those cross sections you can probably convince yourself that there is a separate layer at the top. For example:

Tibhar MX-S

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Victas V15 Limber

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Mark V (which existed long before 729 invented tacky rubbers.. :lol: )

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Not counting the top surface of the rubber (visible here due to the bad camera angle), you might even convince yourself that there are THREE layers in the Mark V topsheet.

I suspect it's a trick of the light or perhaps an artifact of how they slice the rubber to make the cross section. If Igor wants to "write a letter" to ITTF he'd better have better evidence than this. Better cross sections and a microscope, perhaps.

The tack does go away after 3-4 weeks, especially if you use a sponge or something abrasive like a towel to wipe off the water. It starts out pretty tacky, and then it gets less and less tacky over a period of time. Protector sheets help, but they don't stop the process.

By the way - that web site is a gold mine if you want to study pips profiles and thicknesses... :lol: I'll bet the Russian website that was hosting some of these earlier got theirs from here. It seems to be a Chinese importer of table tennis stuff. Wonder what the "table tennis balance of trade" is between China and Europe. Butterfly is on Page 20.

Iskandar

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