OOAK Table Tennis Forum

Getting caught up post (short version)

I played recreationally in high school and college, and like many others stopped playing - for about 15 years. Last year I started going to clubs and stuggled with how spinny the game is in clubs compared to my playing before. I tried medium pips, but after 5 months I felt frustrated and felt like I wasn’t getting any better so I decided to take some time off so that I could come back and start fresh.

I ended up taking 9 months off.

I have now been playing for 3.5 months. During this time I decided that I am going to create my own style based soley on my abilities and through trial and error, rather than trying to copy what I see other people doing. This has caused me to both raise my level of play and see that I have more room to improve and develop.

In this blog I will write about what I am learning about my game, and my results from playing tourneys and practice matches.

I’m currently playing LP Bomb Talent 0.6 on BH. I hit 90% of shots with my BH. I play an allround LP game.

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Nittaku Endless, Bomb Talent ox, Mark V 1.8

My Goals / My first 2 tourneys

I played competitive tennis for 20 years including in college and am trying to take the same approaches I learned from playing tennis. Based on what I’ve seen and where I’m currently at now, my initial goal is to get to a 1400 level of play by the end of 2012.

1st tourney rating 960, match record 0-4, played medium pips on BH.

My first tourney was last year and it felt like a disaster. I was blown out by 1100 to 1300 players.

2nd tourney rating 970 (+10), match record 2-6, Double RR, played Yasaka Anti Power 1.5 on BH on def blade.

In switching to YAP, I immediately began beating players in practice I was never able to beat before. I only had 4 sessions with YAP entering the tourney, but felt very confident with it. I had 2 wins against players under 1000 but the lowest rated players I played besides them was (2) 1310’s so I really didn’t have a good chance to move up much. Overall I felt good about how I was playing though. After playing for 3 hours, my right calf was starting to cramp while playing the 4th hour. I need to get into better shape and take more breaks between games if I'm going to play this many matches again.

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Nittaku Endless, Bomb Talent ox, Mark V 1.8

3rd Tourney - 3 weeks ago

3rd tourney end rating 1010 (+40), match record 6-2, played Bomb Talent 1.0 on BH on def blade

Under 1000
1st match vs rating 830 – struggled at first due to nerves but eventually won easily 3-0.

2nd match vs 11 year old rating 800 – his shots were very odd because everything was an overhead shot for him. Him hitting an overhead vs my chops was giving me lots of trouble. After getting down early 4-8 in the first game, I settled in a won the game 11-8 and won the next 2 games easily.

3rd match vs very underrated 800 (after this tourney he is now 1080) – This guy was very equal to my ability, but he struggled with my pips. My attacks were missing so I just played a pushing chopping blocking game and won 3-0.

Semi-Final
vs Rating 900 but very underrated – He was playing my pips perfectly and my attacks were again missing their mark. After going down 0-2 in games, I switched strategies and just played a pushing chopping blocking game and came back to win 3-2.

Final
I had to play the same guy as in my 3rd match. He played me tougher but I eventually got into a groove and beat him 3-1 to take down 1st place.

Under 1200
1st match vs 1170 who plays medium pips and that blew me away in my 1st tourney. This time we were more evenly matched. He beat me 3-1 but I was in every game and the worst score I lost by was 11-9. In the last game I felt like I was going to win but he got several points off the net and edge of the table.

2nd match vs 850 – I won 3-1 but should have been 3-0.

Quarterfinal vs rating 1050 (1340 by end of tourney and went on to win the under 1200)
Like the first match I was in every game but she had the edge on me overall beating me 3-1. The worst game score I lost by was 11-8.

Overall I was pleased with my results. I got my first trophy, was very competitive vs a 1300 level player, had 2 wins against a 1080 player (the highest rated player I’ve ever beat in a tourney), and continued my positive momentum on my rating. In all of my matches I had trouble attacking with Bomb Talent and also the sponge was too springy and sending the ball long too often on simple pushes. These are what I’m set out to fix in the 6 weeks before my next tourney.

Next I’ll post about the improvements in my game that I’ve made in the last 3 weeks since this tourney. I’m playing much better since this tourney and really look forward to the next one.

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Nittaku Endless, Bomb Talent ox, Mark V 1.8

Congrats on your first tourney win. From what I can understand of the US system players under that 1200-1300 level can be quite erratic not having really bedding down any consistency yet. So I imagine there will be days when they play much much better or worse than others. I think if you work at it seriously and get some consistency to your game reaching 1400 by the end of next year would be a piece of cake, except it depends on your opportunities to play tournaments in that time to do it. Of course if you can play against better players in practice a couple of times a week this will help a lot. I think it will also help you a lot if you settle down soon and play with the same equipment (of course you need to feel fairly comfortable with it first). Good luck and welcome to the world of TT blogging.

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I'm always in the dark, but the Dark sheds lights upon everything!! Beauty is only pimple deep! Beauty is in the eye of the pipholder!
S/U 1: Blade: Bty Gergely . FH Black Andro Rasant 2.1 . BH Red Tibhar Grass Dtecs
S/U 2: Blade: Bty Gergely . FH Black Hexer+ 2.1 . BH Red GD Talon
S/U 3: Blade: Bty Gergely . No rubbers...thinking of adding Red Dtecs and Black Rasant
Aussie Table Tennis Shop / Aussie Table Tennis Facebook Page / Equipment Review Index / Read my Reb Report Blog: click here.

Thanks Reborn.

I wanted to add this to my blog as well... over 50% of the field under 1400 are underrated up and comers, many under 16 years old. To give you some examples. Last year's April 2010 under 1000 finalists are now rated 1699 & 1762, and a semi finalist is now 1488. Yet last April they were all under 1000. Their ages now are 14, 13, 13. There seems to be an endless army of youngsters in my area like this, and they all receive excellent coaching and play several times a week. Plus there are many more who come from Canada and only play one tourney per year in the US, like the 16 year old girl who beat me in the under 1200 and ended the tourney with a rating of 1340 (+290 pts). With so many players improving so rapidly, playing tourneys so seldom, and all playing each other, it becomes hard for all of them to be accurately rated and move up in the ranks.

Just want to add that the above paragraph is only to add description to what tourneys are like at the lower levels in my area. And also, unless you drive 4 hours away, there are only 2 regular tourneys per year here.



I can play 5 or 6 tourneys per year, and I can practice twice per week totalling 4.5 hrs. I know many adults who have been playing here for years and are still under 1200. Personally I think 1200 should be a peice of cake for me though. If I can get better I can see myself beating some of the 1300 level players. 1400 level players is going to take some real improvement for me. I try to mix playing better players, and those that are near my level. Today I took an established 1500 level player to a 5th game. After this next tourney there are no tourneys for 3 months. During these 3 months, I'd like to try 1 or 2 more LPs because so far I've only played with this one. I already have Akkadi L1 so I'll at least be trying that.

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Nittaku Endless, Bomb Talent ox, Mark V 1.8

Thanks Speedplay. I can definitely understand your point. I could be wrong but this is my opinion for now. I have played 4 hours away and it was a totally different group of players at the lower end.

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Nittaku Endless, Bomb Talent ox, Mark V 1.8

Especially in the lower classes of USATT tournaments, almost all of the players are underrated. The rating system is designed to be very conservative and doesn't give away points easily. As ratings get higher, the progress gets slower in an almost exponential, asymptotic fashion.

There are two reasons for this.

First, as has been noted, a lot of the players are entering the tournament system for the first time. These players might have a club rating of, for example, 1300. The club ratings use the EXACT same rating system but the big difference is that the player has probably played hundreds of matches to get that rating. Then the first time they enter a tournament they go in with a rating of ZERO. That's why in most cases these unrated players are not allowed to advance out of their first-round brackets. But even if they win a few games, after the computer is done with its calculations and adjustments, they are not likely to receive a rating anywhere close to their club rating. They will have to play a LOT more games before the tournament rating catches up and that seems from my experience to be in the 1600-1800 range. If a player really wants to "up" their tournament rating they will need to enter a higher class and win a bunch of games at that level. The computer will get them caught up quickly in that case. But many players I've seen do just the opposite. That is, if they don't think they are going to win money, they resort to sandbagging (i.e., throwing matches) to intentionally keep their rating as low as possible for the next tournament.

Second, beginners--children especially--have a tremendous learning curve. At the lower levels the improvement from one tournament to the next can truly be 100-300 points or more. It's like the difference in watching your own kids grow up versus your friend's children who you only see once a year at Christmas. Those same kids who are "underrated" at the official tournament probably don't seem so underrated to their fellow club members who see them play all the time.

 

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Giant Dragon Kris Special : RITC 802 w/Dawei 2.2 35d fh : : Donic Blue Fire M3 2.0 black bh
Member of Charlotte Table Tennis Club, Charlotte, North Carolina, USA
Visit Charlotte Table Tennis Club on Facebook

Thanks for your comments Cyber. I agree with you and I learned this from watching others at this last tourney, that in order to get a bump up in ratings, you really need to play more events.

This next tourney is over 2 days. In day one I'm going to play the 1200, 1400, 1600 and each starts with a 4 person RR group. Day two is a double RR in groups of either 4 or 5. Overall I should be getting 15+ matches in. Hopefully I can last through that many matches.

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Nittaku Endless, Bomb Talent ox, Mark V 1.8

Recent Improvements / Local Tourney #1

Since my last tourney, I changed the sponge under my BT to a 0.6 HRS sponge, and I also bought another Waldner Senso V2 so I can do some side by side testing. Well, this new V2 is way lighter than my other one but has the same speed, and this combined with the new sponge has made all the difference in the world. So much so, that I am just playing with this combo and have not been testing any other rubbers. For the first time, I can now push, block, and chop with LP just like I’ve been reading about here on OOAK. My problem with pushes are for the most part gone, but attacking is still alluding me on medium high to high spinny pops ups.

Local Under 1150, match record 6-0
I played a local non-usatt tourney this last weekend. There were only 3 singles divisions so I played the lowest, under 1150. I won all my matches easily until I reached the final. This guy was dialed into my LP game immediately. He attacked pretty much every push I game him and he was hitting them deep right into my elbow consistently. He got off to a quick 8-2 lead and it was like I didn’t know what hit me. I then began backing off the table to give myself a chance to return his shots. He was not hitting extreme angles so I could at least have a chance to chop his loops back. I retreated to 3 meters as soon as I either served or returned serve and was able to get the game to 7-11, so at least I felt good about how the game ended.

I continued playing classic defense and every point was a long rally of loops and chops. I couldn’t believe he was able to loop some of my chops the way he did. I won the next two game 11-6, 11-7. In the 4th game he got dialed into my chops and I lost the game 8-11.

I then realized that I needed to go back to the table and give him some blocks, which carry a different spin than my chops. For game five, I served first. I got up 4-0, and then he got used to my blocks and took the next 2 points to make it 4-2. I then began to mix blocks at the table with chopping away from the table and this worked well and I got it to 9-5. At this point, the points were getting quite long with amazing shots and returns being made on both sides. He won the next two to make it 9-7. I than choked and missed a serve I didn’t attempt all match, 9-8. I need to remember not to go for crazy serves under pressure. He won the next two with some nice shots to make it 9-10. I’m not feeling so well at this point. Then a bystander begins to congratulate him for winning the match. I’m thinking that might be exactly what I needed, a bad omen for him. I won the next point by staying back and chopping, which is how I played the rest of the match. Well, I won the next two to make it 11-10. He hit a nice serve which I popped up and he slammed for 11-11. We then trade routine service points to make it 12-12. Then, the point of the match. After hitting a couple chops from 3M back, his loop clips the net but was only reduced in speed by about 10%. I had to dive forward with one arm holding myself up and the other chopping the ball to get the ball back, then pop back up to my feel asap. Somehow I hit a perfectly low chop which he proceeded to smash and clip the net again!! in the exact same way, so again I had to dive forward to return his shot and again I hit a nice low chop. Finally the next ball he put into the net. Now I’m up 13-12. The final point on his serve, after hitting 2 or 3 chops he finally misses and I pull out this nail biter 14-12. Whew!

This is the first match in a tourney that I’ve ever won playing primarily classic defense, and to do so under so much duress having to hit multiple chops to win each point makes me quite happy that if other strategies fail, I can give this one a try. I also found out that I may need to mix blocks and chops to keep giving my opponents different spins so they don’t get into a groove against me with either shot. Even though this doesn’t count for my ratings it was a good match experience and practice.



As for my attacking challenges, I’m going to keep trying different techniques until I can find one that is consistent. I have devised two more adjustments to my attack stroke to try this weekend. One thing that I have noticed though is that I can pretty much counter attack any topspin ball with BT, as long as I’m right at the table and take the ball on the rise. In practice when I’m loose and decide to just attack everything that comes over the net, I can hit some amazing shots pretty consistently, but in matches I’m too tight and hesitant to make these shots. And it’s hard mentally to counter attack when I’m so used to playing blocks or chops against loops. It’s something I’d like to keep working on in practice though, and this will take some time to get my brain used to mixing in these types of shots in a match situation.

Next rated tourney in 3 weeks.

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Nittaku Endless, Bomb Talent ox, Mark V 1.8

Nice win pulled out there Bogart! Good that you worked out to mix it up to take your opponent out of rhythm.

Your statement on being able to counter-attack ANY topspin ball, when you are playing a a classic defence game, confuses me. Counter-attacking topspin (certainly heavy topspin) with LP is a tough ask for most (if not all) LP players, even those who who have an attack-oriented game. Most would chop-block heavy or medium topspin. Did you mean to say underspin perhaps? At the level you describe yourself, even doing this is a great effort.

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I'm always in the dark, but the Dark sheds lights upon everything!! Beauty is only pimple deep! Beauty is in the eye of the pipholder!
S/U 1: Blade: Bty Gergely . FH Black Andro Rasant 2.1 . BH Red Tibhar Grass Dtecs
S/U 2: Blade: Bty Gergely . FH Black Hexer+ 2.1 . BH Red GD Talon
S/U 3: Blade: Bty Gergely . No rubbers...thinking of adding Red Dtecs and Black Rasant
Aussie Table Tennis Shop / Aussie Table Tennis Facebook Page / Equipment Review Index / Read my Reb Report Blog: click here.

I play an allround LP game, but had to stick to classic defense to win this particular match.

When I was talking about counter attacking topspins, I have been practicing this only just hitting around and can only do it when I decide to experiment and try to attack every shot with my LP regardless of what it is. Maybe some of these shots would be considered very aggressive blocks and also at my level my opponents aren't giving me super heavy topspin. The last time I tried this was after losing a practice match 0-3 twice in a row to the same opponent. I was pretty frustrated by the result and decided to attack everything while we were just hitting around afterwards. I got into a massive groove attacking all topspins with LP and asked to play another game and won it 11-4 by continueing this allout attacking LP game. We then got interrupted and I played someone else afterwards. I won the first 2 games easy and then started to miss some LP attacks and reverted back to defensive shots. Once I started hitting defensive shots, I lost my groove with these LP attack shots and I ended up abandoning these shots completely for the rest of the match. Right now, after playing a defensive shot I can't successfully hit an offensive shot with my LP on the very next shot. This is something I need to start practicing and it will take a while for me to get it down because my natural instincts are to play defense. Anyway, hope that makes more sense.

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Nittaku Endless, Bomb Talent ox, Mark V 1.8

A small vid of what you mean might say 1000 words

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I'm always in the dark, but the Dark sheds lights upon everything!! Beauty is only pimple deep! Beauty is in the eye of the pipholder!
S/U 1: Blade: Bty Gergely . FH Black Andro Rasant 2.1 . BH Red Tibhar Grass Dtecs
S/U 2: Blade: Bty Gergely . FH Black Hexer+ 2.1 . BH Red GD Talon
S/U 3: Blade: Bty Gergely . No rubbers...thinking of adding Red Dtecs and Black Rasant
Aussie Table Tennis Shop / Aussie Table Tennis Facebook Page / Equipment Review Index / Read my Reb Report Blog: click here.

I think I'll be able to borrow a camera for this next tourney. At some point I'll try to hit some of these shots between matches or something and record it. At the very least I'll record some with my newgy 540 afterwards.

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Nittaku Endless, Bomb Talent ox, Mark V 1.8

Actually, I just took this video with my regular camera. The red side is Bomb Talent. The newgy 540 is set to speed 9/10 and placed 3 feet behind the table. I mixed in a couple inverted attack, LP blocks and a chop so the viewer can see the difference in speed. Against a human and using 3 star balls the stroke is a little different, but you can get the general idea with this video. I got in a nice groove about half way through.

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Nittaku Endless, Bomb Talent ox, Mark V 1.8

Looks pretty impressive, nice stroke. How would the weight of the machines topspin compare to a person looping? Very hard to tell except I can't envisage carrying that shot out on the loopers I play.

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I'm always in the dark, but the Dark sheds lights upon everything!! Beauty is only pimple deep! Beauty is in the eye of the pipholder!
S/U 1: Blade: Bty Gergely . FH Black Andro Rasant 2.1 . BH Red Tibhar Grass Dtecs
S/U 2: Blade: Bty Gergely . FH Black Hexer+ 2.1 . BH Red GD Talon
S/U 3: Blade: Bty Gergely . No rubbers...thinking of adding Red Dtecs and Black Rasant
Aussie Table Tennis Shop / Aussie Table Tennis Facebook Page / Equipment Review Index / Read my Reb Report Blog: click here.