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PostPosted: 24 May 2011, 22:44 
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Strategies against Long Pimple Players

Long pimple players have been a real challenge since I started playing Table Tennis seriously since 1992 at Dandenong Table Tennis Centre. I am playing in A5 Senior grade on Mondays and lost the opportunity to play in Master pennant on Thursdays due to a mistake I made in paper work. Even though I said that LP players are a real challenge, I have overcome many difficulties which I faced several seasons back. So, I am quite capable of beating many LP players right now. However, there are many other players who are struggling with these playes. My intention of writing this is to learn about more strategies and impart my knowlege to other players who struggle with LP players.

Last Monday I had two great wins against two LP players even though I was sick. I had high temperature and my body was shaking.I could not move well. I had to take panadol before each match. However, I did well and beat these guys pretty convincingly. First, I played this lady who gave me a hard time last year, but at last three meetings, I beat her quite easily. First of all, you should have right equipment to do this. My Joola MC 1 is very fast,light and controllable. On my backhand I had Andro Roxon 450 max. It is an excellent back hand rubber and you could return shots coming from pimple side of you opponent at fast or slow speed. On my forehand, I had GEWO Stratos Sound max and this rubber is very fast and controllable. So, this is a very good combination against LP players. Another very good rubber against LP players is Andro Plasma 430.

The lady I mentioned before does not attack you and she expects you to make mistakes. She is very consistent and returns every shot you might throw at her. My plan was to serve long with back spin to the extreme right, extreme left and the middle of the table. Few serves went to her body and playing elbow too.My idea was to get high returns and attack to the right, left and the middle. However,she did not give these chanches easily so I had to have long rallies with her until I could launch the killer blow. So, You must be patient all the time. If you try to put a high degree of spin to your serves, it would work against you. Their rubbers are designed to put spin reversal and give you wobbling effect. Therefore, the best thing is to put a little spin to you serve or serve with no spin.

The next strategy is to make her move. So, you have to place your shots all over the table, specially to the extreme left, extreme right and the middle of the table. If you can do that, they will make errors and their frustration will grow. Even though, I beat her 3-0, my two team mates lost to her. One of my team mates is the leading player in this grade. Despite my constant warnnings, they did not have patience and tried to attact her too often.

I had beaten the other LP player before, but he beat me quite easily last time. I was determined to beat him this time even though I was not well. He recently changed his blade to thick balsa blade and started using Double Fish 1615 rubber which had longest pimples and more disturbing effects. So, My strategies against him were quite different to the ones I used last time. I used to serve and play my shots to the extreme right of the table expecting that he would return high balls using his non-pimple rubber. It did not work last time and he attacked to the extreme right of my side of the table. When he returned his shots to my backhand , I made a lot of errors because the disturbing and wobbling effetcs of his rubber were quite high.

My first strategy against this guy was to serve to the middle of the table specially aiming at his playing elbow, right and left side of his body. My idea was to make him return his shots to my forehand and launch fast attacts. I did not try to put much spin into my serves, but serve with a little spin or no spin. So, he had nothing to work on or reverse. Therefore, his shots were quite flat and came to my forehand and I could attack quite easily.

My second strategy was to hit flat and push his shots back to the middle and the extreme left area of the table. So, my opponent could not read well my shots which were a mixture of few different types of shots. Instead of trying to attack his pimple shots, I tried to return every shot back to him while being more patient.So,he started making more and more errors.

My third strategy was to use my forehand more often to attack him. So, I played in the left side of the table more often and launched forehand attacks to the right half of his side of the table. By doing this, I could reduce the number of errors I might have made and even curve the ball away from him making him more and more frustrated. The final result was 3-1 :^)

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Last edited by Najay on 25 May 2011, 22:40, edited 3 times in total.

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PostPosted: 24 May 2011, 23:29 
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Welcome to the world of TT blogging Najay my friend! I encourage you to blog more than just on playing against LP to make your blog about you rather than just LP opponents, but its a good place to start. As you go on, you might like to re-title the blog to something more general. I'm sure you will run out of strategies to talk about soon enough (at least until you discover how to beat me again, but let's hope that will never happen :lol: ).

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PostPosted: 24 May 2011, 23:41 
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We'd better ban him before he says too much. :lol: :lol: :lol:

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PostPosted: 24 May 2011, 23:49 
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mynamenotbob wrote:
We'd better ban him before he says too much. :lol: :lol: :lol:


:lol: :lol:

Don't worry mnnb, if he reveals too much I can always break his typing finger (by accident in a doubles friendly of course! :P ) 8)

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I'm always in the dark, but the Dark sheds lights upon everything!! :twisted: Beauty is only pimple deep! Beauty is in the eye of the pipholder!
S/U 1: Blade: Bty Gergely . FH Black Andro Rasant 2.1 . BH Red Tibhar Grass Dtecs
S/U 2: Blade: Bty Gergely . FH Black Hexer+ 2.1 . BH Red GD Talon
S/U 3: Blade: Bty Gergely . No rubbers...thinking of adding Red Dtecs and Black Rasant
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PostPosted: 25 May 2011, 00:00 
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RebornTTEvnglist wrote:
mynamenotbob wrote:
We'd better ban him before he says too much. :lol: :lol: :lol:


:lol: :lol:

Don't worry mnnb, if he reveals too much I can always break his typing finger (by accident in a doubles friendly of course! :P ) 8)


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PostPosted: 25 May 2011, 00:08 
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How many LP players are there in the top grade at your club (A1?) compared to the lower grades?


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PostPosted: 25 May 2011, 08:45 
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carbonman wrote:
How many LP players are there in the top grade at your club (A1?) compared to the lower grades?


Carbonman I could be wrong, but I don't think there is a single LP player in our A1. None come to mind anyway.

We have an SP player in our A2, who is a member of this forum called Jonnexus. Can't think of an LP player there either. In A3 there is one old guy who plays LP both sides and one LP combo player. Then in A4 there is me, 2 guys who plays combo-Anti and the rest are dual-inverted.

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S/U 1: Blade: Bty Gergely . FH Black Andro Rasant 2.1 . BH Red Tibhar Grass Dtecs
S/U 2: Blade: Bty Gergely . FH Black Hexer+ 2.1 . BH Red GD Talon
S/U 3: Blade: Bty Gergely . No rubbers...thinking of adding Red Dtecs and Black Rasant
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PostPosted: 25 May 2011, 08:59 
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I'm sure Najay will find that strategies that work in the lower grades, may not work at all against a LP player in the higher grades.

But hopefully we'll see your journey in this blog Najay, and see how you need to change strategy against tougher LP players...

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PostPosted: 25 May 2011, 12:20 
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haggisv wrote:
I'm sure Najay will find that strategies that work in the lower grades, may not work at all against a LP player in the higher grades.

But hopefully we'll see your journey in this blog Najay, and see how you need to change strategy against tougher LP players...


I think the strategies are also quite "player-dependent" too. The lady Najay refers to is the same lady blocker I referred to in my last few seasons in A5. Her style is quite unique and many people find her troubling. She never beat me, usually losing 3-0 to me, but she did take me to 5 sets once when I was tired and less focused. As Najay said, you have to treat her blocking abilities with respect and pick hit on her at the right opportunity. Given she attacks one ball in every 20 sets she plays, you can afford to be patient.

I do think giving LP opponents as little spin to work with as possible is a good rule of thumb at all levels though :up: (I can say this without caring of the consequence as Najay always tries to play me this way and still I beat him :lol: ).

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I'm always in the dark, but the Dark sheds lights upon everything!! :twisted: Beauty is only pimple deep! Beauty is in the eye of the pipholder!
S/U 1: Blade: Bty Gergely . FH Black Andro Rasant 2.1 . BH Red Tibhar Grass Dtecs
S/U 2: Blade: Bty Gergely . FH Black Hexer+ 2.1 . BH Red GD Talon
S/U 3: Blade: Bty Gergely . No rubbers...thinking of adding Red Dtecs and Black Rasant
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PostPosted: 25 May 2011, 15:31 
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Is the other guy "Gary"???

Thank you for posting Najay, and you are very welcomed to this forum...
Please continuing posting more on your experiences as it does interests me, and perhaps some others here.


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PostPosted: 25 May 2011, 23:30 
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I am glad to see the interest shown by few members of the forum regarding my blog. As Reb says using a general topic/title later on could be a good idea. However, I would like to discuss the strategies I have used and will use to tackle some other LP players. Reb, you are definitely one of them. I know that I have no opportunity to do so right now since you are playing in the next grade. Remember, my team is on the top of the laddder at the moment. If we can beat those young punks, we will be in A4 next season.

Carbonman ,I am sure there are LP players in the higher grades at Dandenong club. I am going to find out the exact number. I am also going to talk to non-LP players in these grades and find out how they deal with LP players.

Metal monkey has asked whether the guy I was talking about is Gary. No, this is the same Vietnamese gentleman who has been described by Reb in his blogs.

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PostPosted: 26 May 2011, 00:11 
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Najay, Metal Monkey came down from Sydney and visited us a couple of years back for a hit. He happened to meet the Gary you protested about playing at the beginning of the season, although he met him at another club.

If you guys manage to win A5 and come up to A4 (which I hope you do), I'd be more worried about all the higher standard double inverted players than the only LP player in the grade (assuming we don't work out how to beat the defenders and advance to A3 LOL). Although if things keep going the way they are in A3, one of the LP players there will be back down in A4 next season. Its funny, they are the team that won A4 prem last season and they are bottom and the team that lost to them is higher on the ladder. The team that beat us and went up with us to A4 is bottom of our ladder without a single win for the season and we have gravitated between 4th and 2nd. Its odd the way things work isn't it?

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I'm always in the dark, but the Dark sheds lights upon everything!! :twisted: Beauty is only pimple deep! Beauty is in the eye of the pipholder!
S/U 1: Blade: Bty Gergely . FH Black Andro Rasant 2.1 . BH Red Tibhar Grass Dtecs
S/U 2: Blade: Bty Gergely . FH Black Hexer+ 2.1 . BH Red GD Talon
S/U 3: Blade: Bty Gergely . No rubbers...thinking of adding Red Dtecs and Black Rasant
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PostPosted: 31 May 2011, 16:49 
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I am back to talk about the strategies against the LP players. First of all,I must say that I do not claim to be an expert on this subject. I am merely an enthusiastic TT player who would like to share ideas with my fellow TT players about vital matters. Since I could not give you a definition of my standard, I would explain where I am at the moment. As I said before, I started playing TT at the Dandenong Table Tennis Centre in 1993 and I started from the lowest level and gradually rose to A5 as my experience and skills developed. When I started playing at this club, there were many grades beginning from F grade to A grade and each grade was divided into sub-grades. Lately, these all grades were reduced to 10 grades, B5 to B1(Tuesday) and A5 to A1(Monday). My team won the final in each grade before I rose to the next grade. My policy was to go to the next grade as a team, not as an individual player. This has been the reason why I took a quite long time to advance to the A level. The Master Pennant(Thursday) was introduced few years back and it has five grades-A5 to A1. As far as this pennant is concerned, I become the leading player once in A4 and twice in A3. My team won the final twice in A3. I have gone as far as A2. However, my percentage was not good in A2,so I voluntarily relegated myself to A3.

As far as my TT career is concerned, one of my greatest achievements has been the championship in both Sigles and Doubles in Victorian Teachers' Games in 2010. This was held in Bendigo, I happened to beat some of very good players who had beaten me before. On this particular occasion, I was mentally and physically fit and possessed 'I can do it' attitude. My wife went with me to Bendigo too and she was watching me playing. Who wants to lose a match in front of your wife?

This information would no doubt help you understand my experience and the standard as a TT player.

Before I explain how I managed to beat the third LP player in A5, I will add some more information into my first report. The lady player I mentioned there can be described as a pusher/blocker who always plays near the table. She is not a great or quick mover or attacker, but has good reflexes. So, her main intentions of using pimples are using spin and speed variation provided by pips to force errors from the opponents and breaking timing and rhythm of these opponents,being patient and mentally strong.

To achieve these goals, she has selected Friendship 755-2. It has half long,dense and flexible pimples.This rubber is renowned for providing very good defence, especially against topspin attack.It has also good wobbling effect on service returns and other shots.I found out that this rubber also produces excellent float effect. It works best when blocking is done close to the bounce as possible. Now you can understand why she is playing close to the table and pushes every shot at you holding the bat at different angles. She will wears you down if you are not prepared for her game. So, to beat an opponent like this, you should be able to give him/her all back what they could have done to you.

The second player, the Vietnamese gentleman, can be described as a LP attacker.He seems to have resorted to LP because of some restrictions caused by physical injuries and his age. So, his idea is to use pips to get more time to move to the ball by slowing down the speed of the opponent.Pips will help him maintain his position close to the table absorbing power and spin of the opposition.Hitting flat and brushing the ball with pips in different directions(I wiil explain next week how you can create spin variation by doing so)he tries to create spin reversal and float effect.So, the opponent will make many errors or return high. He then attacks these high balls with both LP and smooth rubbers. When he hits your weak shots with his pips, he expects you to hit the ball into the net or give him a easy ball to smash using his FH.

To achieve his goals, this player uses Double Fish 1615 Ox rubber and it has super long pips.They are flexible and bouncy. So, pips bend easily and spring back quickly creating a great spin variation and spin reversal according to the way and direction of his strokes.As I have observed the behaviour of his rubber, I can certainly say that it creates quite noticeable wobbling/sink ball effect causing the opponent to hit into the net.It also helps him to push and block with good spin reversal causing you to loop or push long.When his rubber causes you to return float balls, he attacks you quite easily.

The strategies I used last time against this player were based on my study of the behaviour of LP rubbers and his intentions of using pips.So,to beat a strong opponent like this, you must prepared yourself mentally and physically and be willing to have a long battle. A short and easy win is almost impossible here.

Now I am going to explain how I managed to beat another tough LP player in few weeks back in round 5 in A5 tournament at the Dandenong TT Club. He is an Hungarian gentleman and can be described as a LP defender. He is not a good mover or attacker, but very patient and consistent and has good reflexes.So, his intentions are to break timing and rhythm of the opponent, use spin variation, spin reversal and float and wobbling effect provided by pips to force the opposition to make errors. If you let him play his game against you, he will win eventually by wearing you down and frustrating you.

I have beaten this player several times in A5 Monday tournament and in A4 and A3 Thursday tournament, but he beat me in both rounds in A5 last season in a very close encounter. However, two weeks ago I beat him 3-1 in the fifth round of the A5 tournament. This player changes his LP rubbers and blades often by creating some confusion amongst his opponents. He has used rubbers like TT Master, DR.N and CTT POGO before. He has two major blades, Joola Kool and Donic Cayman. Now he uses DHS Cloud & Fog 111 which has broad, long and easily bent pips.According to the description of the manufacturer, these pips are designed for all round game with high disturbing effect and spin reversal and variation. You cannot predict which bat he might go for until you actually see it just before the game.

My first strategy against this player was to observe his equipment and find out what blade and what LP he would use for the match against me.Then I could work on my plan according to his blade and rubber combination. I also tried to have a good knowledge of his game by having few friendy games with him especially on Sundays. This really helped me work on my game plan against him.I saw one of his team mates was warning him about the negative effect of these friendly games, but he understood that these friendly encounters would help both of us.

Secondly, I was determined to be patient and break his timing and rhythm by playing shots to the right, left and middle of the table. Many shots were directed at his body and playing elbow. When you did this , he became unbalanced and tended to make two major mistakes. He thus sent high ball to my FH which I smashed away with some side and topspin. He also sent high balls to my BH which I could returned to his extreme BH corner. He managed to send back few of these shots, but most of my shots were winners.

I had observed the way he moved his playing arm in a particular manner. He actually played his BH shots vertically and his arm moved from the edge of the table to the front of his face. So, there was some kind of slight brushing taking place. I decided to use this to my advantage by serving with little backspin. When he played his vertical shots, the ball came to me with little topspin which I like to send bak to every corner of the table. When I returned these shots with incresed speed to the extreme left side of the table, he missed them quite badly. His body language showed that he was very frustrated, so I kept on doing it.

Since this player was not a FH attacker, I tried to serve mostly to that hand with some backspin. He sometimes tried to use pips to return them, but he had to use his smooth rubber to return most of them. Whenever, he used pips to return my serves, I was careful not to play bad shots and kept rallying with him. When he used his smooth rubber to return my serves, I punished them with speedy attacks to the extreme right and the left of the table. He was not quick enough to get to these strokes, so my number of points increased as his frustration grew further and further.

As my report would suggest, you must plan your strategies according to the playing style of your opponent. Even though most of LP rubbers are designed for particular purposes, the degree of results will depend on the experience and skills of the individual player. So, these impending results will vary from the lowest grade to the highest grade.

As I promised, I found out the the number of LP players who play in each grade at the Dandenong TT Club. There are 3 LP players in A5. 2 LP players in A4. In A3, there are 4 LP players and it would be 5 soon. A2 has 3 LP players, while A1 has 2 LP players.

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S/U 1:Primorac Carbon Offensive- BH Joola Maxxx 40 Max, FH Andro Rasant Powersponge Max
S/U 2:Primorac Carbon Offensive- BH Joola Maxxx 40 Max, FH Andro Rasant Beat Max
S/U 3:TSP Hino-Carbon-BH Stiga Boost TX Max, FH Joola rhyzm 375 Max


Last edited by Najay on 07 Jun 2011, 22:28, edited 2 times in total.

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PostPosted: 31 May 2011, 19:43 
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Najay wrote:
As I promised, I found out the the number of LP players who play in each grade at the Dandenong TT Club. There are 3 LP players in A5. 2 LP players in A4. In A3, there are 4 LP players and it would be 5 soon. A2 has 3 LP players, while A1 has 2 LP players.


I must pay more attention to who is using LP. I can think of the 3 in A5 no worries. In A4 there is only me permanently, but there have been a couple of fill-ins. In A3 I thought of 3, but can't think of the 4th (and who is the 5th coming in?). A2 has 3? Are some fill-ins? I must check out the A1 LP players as I really haven't noticed :lol:

Didn't know the Lady Blocker had changed to Feint 3. She always used 755 when I played her.

The 1615 player seems to have become more deadly with that rubber than previous LP's, but now he tells me he wants something that chops better. He got some Pogo, but I told him to get some Talon. ;)

The 3rd LP player is kind of an easy beat in comparison, but not to be under-estimated as he can bite if you take him for granted. He has been trying to develop a FH attack and it can hurt you now and then.

You should aim to work your way back to A2 Masters and forget what your percentage is as it is a brilliant training ground for development and raising your game. Tougher opponents force you to play better. There have been many guys not be able to hang in there and slip back to A3 in the 4 seasons since you and I passed each other on the way up and down. However, a good partner is required to hang in there ;) :lol: Your game had been a step ahead of mine until this happened I think. Then slowly I have had to up my game to compete in the Masters, which is why I generally now edge you out when we play. Not to say your game is far off mine IMO. I always had more respect for your game than many others have had. Always a good challenge and in fact I recall you won the last competition match we played in the championships - the only one to beat me in the RR before I eventually won the trophy. I should NEVER play you before a competition...we had quite a few games prior to that RR that night IIRC :P :lol:

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I'm always in the dark, but the Dark sheds lights upon everything!! :twisted: Beauty is only pimple deep! Beauty is in the eye of the pipholder!
S/U 1: Blade: Bty Gergely . FH Black Andro Rasant 2.1 . BH Red Tibhar Grass Dtecs
S/U 2: Blade: Bty Gergely . FH Black Hexer+ 2.1 . BH Red GD Talon
S/U 3: Blade: Bty Gergely . No rubbers...thinking of adding Red Dtecs and Black Rasant
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PostPosted: 07 Jun 2011, 22:46 
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Joined: 08 Feb 2011, 20:50
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Location: Melbourne, Victoria, Australia
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Thanks for your comments, Reborn. As a matter of fact, the lady blocker is still using Friendship 755-2. I do not know why I made that mistake. I might have looked at the bat of her friend, Ann. They are hanging around together all the time and I am always playing doubles agaisnt them on Thursdays.

As you said I should have stayed in A2 and tried to improve my game playing against better players. My problem was that I did not have a committed team mate on both occasions and I was discouraged by that.

_________________
S/U 1:Primorac Carbon Offensive- BH Joola Maxxx 40 Max, FH Andro Rasant Powersponge Max
S/U 2:Primorac Carbon Offensive- BH Joola Maxxx 40 Max, FH Andro Rasant Beat Max
S/U 3:TSP Hino-Carbon-BH Stiga Boost TX Max, FH Joola rhyzm 375 Max


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