OOAK Table Tennis Forum

Nice vid,

...if you want to improve your footwork I would advise you to play more on the front of your foot. For example: in your vid you awaiting the oponent's serve with your foot flat on the ground, this will hamper you in your first movements. Try this: ad the moment the openent is tossing the ball for the serve, start standing on your toes/middle foot instead of the heel. This should give you much more speed in your movements.
Within the rally moving on your toes will give you the ability to do two small steps, which results in a better position. The sequence would be something like:
- hit the ball
- do one quick step to get back to your 'base' position
- at the moment you notice the next ball, you do another fast step to be in the best possible possition again.
- hit the ball, etcetc

Playing the ball itself is best with the foot flat on the floor (if possible) for better stability

just my 5c.

Thanks Gybe, good advice. I'm still "finding my feet" (ouch) in a few ways: I'm not sure how much my knee can cope with; I'm not very fit and I'm still learning how to move properly.

Your idea about being on the tips of my toes when receiving serve is certainly something I've trying to do recently but not often enough.

I have a league game tonight against some guys I know so I might try to record it - and give your footwork tips a go.

_________________
My blog: "Learning to play: as a modern defender": http://ooakforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=58&t=22254
My YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCtazeX ... oICGS9bqNg
Join the OOAK Discord!: https://discord.gg/Yw2hYUdz3g

[Other gear I've used]
Blades: Butterfly Defence 3, Butterfly Defence Pro, Butterfly Innerforce ZLC, Butterfly Innershield, DHS Power G7, Stiga Offensive Classic Carbon
SPs: Friendship 802 (1.5), TSP Spectol (1.3, 1.8, 2.1), TSP Spectol Speed (1.3), TSP Super Spinpips Chop Sponge 2 (0.5, 1.3)
LPs: Butterfly Feint Long II (1), Butterfly Feint Long III (0.5, 1.3), Tibhar Grass D.TecS (OX), TSP Curl P1-R (0.5, 1, 1.3), TSP Curl P4 (1.3)

Tonight's games didn't go too well. Few issues:

In league games, I'm finding the T80 hard to control. In practice I love it - I stand a little away from the table and really lace through the ball. In matches, especially against similar level players, I never get a chance to move away from table and I missed shot after shot by hitting off then over-adjusting and netting.

Secondly, against 'lesser' (hate that word but not sure how else to describe them), I need to seriously find the right gear from the beginning of the game. I went 2-0 down in two matches tonight and took both to 5 but only managed to win 1 of the matches. I'd beaten both players quite comfortably two months ago but everyone commented on 'how they couldn't play against my slow loop'. Although that's true, I think it's more to do with the fact that I missed many more forehand than usual.

Finally, and I guess a lot of people struggle with this, I find that I'm very tunnel-visioned during league games. My serves become less varied and my strokes change. Ugly stuff.

Oh well! 2 matches is better than 0, eh?

_________________
My blog: "Learning to play: as a modern defender": http://ooakforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=58&t=22254
My YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCtazeX ... oICGS9bqNg
Join the OOAK Discord!: https://discord.gg/Yw2hYUdz3g

[Other gear I've used]
Blades: Butterfly Defence 3, Butterfly Defence Pro, Butterfly Innerforce ZLC, Butterfly Innershield, DHS Power G7, Stiga Offensive Classic Carbon
SPs: Friendship 802 (1.5), TSP Spectol (1.3, 1.8, 2.1), TSP Spectol Speed (1.3), TSP Super Spinpips Chop Sponge 2 (0.5, 1.3)
LPs: Butterfly Feint Long II (1), Butterfly Feint Long III (0.5, 1.3), Tibhar Grass D.TecS (OX), TSP Curl P1-R (0.5, 1, 1.3), TSP Curl P4 (1.3)

What nerves can do to you, eh? If you struggle to get away from the table, because they don't play that kind of game, then you're still competing against really low level players. In that case use your pips as an attacking weapon to their weakest side: that's something they don't like. Now you also understand why I've advised you to go with a 0,5mm sponge. That thin sponge gives more passive disruption than a 1,5 sponge, more LP effect. Develop a blocking game. Wanna bet they'll hate your guts for it?

The rest of your problems are caused by nerves, inexperience with your new style. You're still at the beginning of your evolution, so those things will work out. Just have trust in your style, even when you lose (badly). Think, think, think and enjoy.

I think you've hit the nail on the head there: using the pimples as a weapon. It's something I haven't practised enough so I spent some time working on it today with my apprentice and I can see how it'd be useful and effective against that level of player. I've got Neubauer's pimple technique DVD so I'll try to learn some strokes from that. I'm getting quite effective at hitting against backspin, but I need to learn how to do it against heavier backspin.

The nerves were partially borne of the environment, too. It's an intimate village hall with low, bright lighting - the very opposite of my club. I can't use that as an excuse though, I need to adapt. Even if that means throwing my serves lower to avoid being blinded

_________________
My blog: "Learning to play: as a modern defender": http://ooakforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=58&t=22254
My YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCtazeX ... oICGS9bqNg
Join the OOAK Discord!: https://discord.gg/Yw2hYUdz3g

[Other gear I've used]
Blades: Butterfly Defence 3, Butterfly Defence Pro, Butterfly Innerforce ZLC, Butterfly Innershield, DHS Power G7, Stiga Offensive Classic Carbon
SPs: Friendship 802 (1.5), TSP Spectol (1.3, 1.8, 2.1), TSP Spectol Speed (1.3), TSP Super Spinpips Chop Sponge 2 (0.5, 1.3)
LPs: Butterfly Feint Long II (1), Butterfly Feint Long III (0.5, 1.3), Tibhar Grass D.TecS (OX), TSP Curl P1-R (0.5, 1, 1.3), TSP Curl P4 (1.3)

Finally got internet on Thursday and this video has been uploading ever since! Will write more tomorrow but here's a full coaching session from last week.

_________________
My blog: "Learning to play: as a modern defender": http://ooakforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=58&t=22254
My YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCtazeX ... oICGS9bqNg
Join the OOAK Discord!: https://discord.gg/Yw2hYUdz3g

[Other gear I've used]
Blades: Butterfly Defence 3, Butterfly Defence Pro, Butterfly Innerforce ZLC, Butterfly Innershield, DHS Power G7, Stiga Offensive Classic Carbon
SPs: Friendship 802 (1.5), TSP Spectol (1.3, 1.8, 2.1), TSP Spectol Speed (1.3), TSP Super Spinpips Chop Sponge 2 (0.5, 1.3)
LPs: Butterfly Feint Long II (1), Butterfly Feint Long III (0.5, 1.3), Tibhar Grass D.TecS (OX), TSP Curl P1-R (0.5, 1, 1.3), TSP Curl P4 (1.3)

Still waiting for your writing.

Ahah, indeed! It has been "all go" in the past couple of weeks so I've barely spent any time on my home computer. For some reason this particular thread is now blocked on my work machine too (it auto-blocks pages on certain categories, this has been blocked under a "Gaming" category. Doh!) so I can't post from there.

The last time I posted I mentioned that I'd lost one of my league matches. Won two, but lost one. Shortly after the game I posted here and blamed my forehand. Although that certainly had something to do with it, in retrospect, it was my pimples serve-receive that lost me a great number of points. My opponent did basically nothing other than long and short no-spin serves and I netted a massive number of them, trying to push them back.

Since then I've worked on my pimple short game in general, especially receiving serves. I'm still not great at it but I'm really starting to get the hang of it. I'm attacking light backspin (not hard or fast but well placed) and pushing other backspin serves but more importantly I'm using the pimples fairly flat and hard against no-spin serves and placing it well. It has made a big difference to my game, especially in the league. You may be able to see some of that learning process from my last video but it has greatly improved even since then.

Following Gybe's suggestions, I started concentrating more on my footwork. Especially in practice, I find that moving a little bit before receiving serve helps me to get "in the zone" and actually play the game. Being cemented to the floor was having an adverse effect on my movement but also my ability to "get into gear" against "lesser" (urgh) opponents. Last week I was having a few problems with my chopping too, and I found that moving my feet and bringing both arms back to the ready position after every shot helped me to chop much more fluently and consistently.

The other thing I've been working on more than anything is my mental attitude. Going 2-0 down in both games the previous week and then only managing to win one of the games made me realise that I need to get on top of my nerves. I can't be a "practice player", I need to take a strong mental attitude into games too. I bought the book that haggisv suggested, Get Your Game Face On and it has some simple but effective ideas.

The main thing I've been trying to do is slow down. I took time between points and concentrated on what I was intending to do with each point. Now the latter is something I need to move forward with as I'm not doing it particularly effectively, but the former helped me a lot. For the first time in a while I came away from the games being able to remember some of the points I'd played!

Sadly, although there was a positive improvement over my game at Matfen, my final match last week turned out to be a complete bottle. I went 1-0 down, then fought back well to go 2-1 in games, including an 11-2. I took a bit of a lead in the fourth and was aiming to end the game succinctly. I took a little time just before I served, and when I looked at my opponent before I served, he'd backed away from the table and looked quite annoyed at me taking time to serve. Only talking a couple of seconds here, but suddenly I got a bit rattled (not wanting to anger my opponent by "cheating") and sped up my whole game. One thing led to the next and I lost that game 12-10. I took a decent lead in the final game then completely bottled it and lost 11-8. I've never been more annoyed at myself, even though my opponent was good. I had him on the rocks and he had no idea what the pimples were doing so I was in the right place and nothing other than my mental attitude lost me the game. Need to get tougher!

My league results can be seen here. TableTennis365 has had a bit of an overhaul and they've added some cool stat features and filters which I like. I'm quite proud of my results in truth - I'm the fifth highest match-winner in my division (although nowhere near the best % ratio) and this is effectively a two division jump for me. Some of the teams are winter season Division 3 standard but three of the teams are solid winter season Division 2 standard. Charles Mouzon, who gave me an absolute hiding with his excellent LP blocking technique, is a talented winter season Division 1 player.

I've missed a few sessions this week - frustratingly, including my coaching session - for two reasons. Firstly, I played cricket on Tuesday for the first time since I was 17, and it appeared to awaken some muscles which I haven't used in years. The associated DOMS was mega painful. Secondly, I'd been having repeated awful nights' sleep, waking up 10 or 15 times every night. As a result I was sore and low on energy for most of the week. Thursday and Friday were better so I made the most of those sessions and played well.

Any suggestions as to what I should focus on for my next coaching session?

_________________
My blog: "Learning to play: as a modern defender": http://ooakforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=58&t=22254
My YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCtazeX ... oICGS9bqNg
Join the OOAK Discord!: https://discord.gg/Yw2hYUdz3g

[Other gear I've used]
Blades: Butterfly Defence 3, Butterfly Defence Pro, Butterfly Innerforce ZLC, Butterfly Innershield, DHS Power G7, Stiga Offensive Classic Carbon
SPs: Friendship 802 (1.5), TSP Spectol (1.3, 1.8, 2.1), TSP Spectol Speed (1.3), TSP Super Spinpips Chop Sponge 2 (0.5, 1.3)
LPs: Butterfly Feint Long II (1), Butterfly Feint Long III (0.5, 1.3), Tibhar Grass D.TecS (OX), TSP Curl P1-R (0.5, 1, 1.3), TSP Curl P4 (1.3)

Oh, and also, I had a few hours practice with SP chopping again on Thursday. It really helped me to see that I need to brush the ball more when I chop. When I didn't, I couldn't control the chops with my SPs. When I did, the backspin was massive - just like my LPs. My opponent seemed to have more difficulty lifting the spin from my SSCS2 chops than my usual LP chops, but I guess that's because I was brushing the ball better.

I think I will eventually go back to SPs but at this stage I'm simply not a good enough chopper to consider it. That few hours practice brushing with SPs has helped me with my LP chops fairly immensely too though I think - more brush = more backspin!

_________________
My blog: "Learning to play: as a modern defender": http://ooakforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=58&t=22254
My YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCtazeX ... oICGS9bqNg
Join the OOAK Discord!: https://discord.gg/Yw2hYUdz3g

[Other gear I've used]
Blades: Butterfly Defence 3, Butterfly Defence Pro, Butterfly Innerforce ZLC, Butterfly Innershield, DHS Power G7, Stiga Offensive Classic Carbon
SPs: Friendship 802 (1.5), TSP Spectol (1.3, 1.8, 2.1), TSP Spectol Speed (1.3), TSP Super Spinpips Chop Sponge 2 (0.5, 1.3)
LPs: Butterfly Feint Long II (1), Butterfly Feint Long III (0.5, 1.3), Tibhar Grass D.TecS (OX), TSP Curl P1-R (0.5, 1, 1.3), TSP Curl P4 (1.3)

I'd concentrate on the points you've mentioned in the previous post. Those are hard enough already.

I've seen your results. Not bad at all, although I can't put a level (e.g. a USATT rating) on the division you're playing in. It's also weird you can't compare individual winning percentages with each other (I didn't find that). This were my results last season:

http://competitie.vttl.be/index.php?menu=6&sel=15352&result=1&category=1

Our league (it's our national league btw) count a lot more clubs than yours and uses an ELO system, together with a letter/number rating. The latter counts. I played third provincial league, although at the moment I'm more than enough to play second provincial league.

This is other league I'm playing in:

http://tafeltennis.sporcrea.be/competitie/index.php?menu=6&sel=3079&result=1&category=1

Those letter/number combinations need to be read like this: the further the letter in the alphabet, the lower the level of the player. The lower the number, the better the player. So, in ascending order you've got NG/NC, E6, E4, E2, E0, D6, D4, D2, D0,... until A. In our national league you have A24, A23,...until A1. In the second league you have F between NG/NC and E6. The higher the ranking, the tougher it gets to get even higher.

That's something I've been wondering myself. We have a grading system but it's nothing like the USATT ratings. I just watched a U1800 tournament final on YouTube and although I don't think I'm that good, I don't think I'd be completely outclassed.

I suspect that our lower teams are around 1500 and our best team around 1700 (in this division). Judging by the few games in that last video I posted, would you agree I'm around ~1600 USATT? Or is that too arrogant?!

I'll do my best to get a league game recorded but I'm always apprehensive about asking my opponents. This is the second part of the season now though so at least I know my opponents well enough to ask this time.

_________________
My blog: "Learning to play: as a modern defender": http://ooakforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=58&t=22254
My YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCtazeX ... oICGS9bqNg
Join the OOAK Discord!: https://discord.gg/Yw2hYUdz3g

[Other gear I've used]
Blades: Butterfly Defence 3, Butterfly Defence Pro, Butterfly Innerforce ZLC, Butterfly Innershield, DHS Power G7, Stiga Offensive Classic Carbon
SPs: Friendship 802 (1.5), TSP Spectol (1.3, 1.8, 2.1), TSP Spectol Speed (1.3), TSP Super Spinpips Chop Sponge 2 (0.5, 1.3)
LPs: Butterfly Feint Long II (1), Butterfly Feint Long III (0.5, 1.3), Tibhar Grass D.TecS (OX), TSP Curl P1-R (0.5, 1, 1.3), TSP Curl P4 (1.3)

Hi,

good to hear that the footwork did improve the game. In general this might be underestimated by many trainers: image how simple the game could be if you are on the perfect spot -each- stroke. For this I really like the youtube clips off Waldner, for some reason he always at the spot where the ball's coming.

One thing my trainer did try out was 'differential training'. He did point to some clips on youtube. They are in german but you might get the idea, for example this one: (search for 'differenzielles training tischtennis')
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DB01CkDOxEw
The idea of this training method is to play balls 'on purpose' with an incorrect techniek/material etc. This youtube clip for example shows an exercise in which you play forehand topspin with your right leg closest to the table. Other ideas are using different bats
Training this should improve your 'interpolation' skills of each stroke. Your training session with the SP is more less a similar idea although a piece of carpet on it would be even better

It's a common idea which is being used in many different sports so you should be able to find something in English as well.

One other thing which might help you to slow down the game is only provide the ball to the oponent for serving once you reached the table. I see many players collecting a ball and immediately returning it to the oponent, often they need to rush to be in time for the next server

grtz,

Gybe

That's a really interesting idea, Gybe. I understand what you're suggesting, but can you explain a bit further as to how it might help?


That's definitely something I'm going to work on. Such an easy thing to do, too. Not sure why I didn't think of it - I quite often pick the ball up and hit it back to my opponent from range.

_________________
My blog: "Learning to play: as a modern defender": http://ooakforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=58&t=22254
My YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCtazeX ... oICGS9bqNg
Join the OOAK Discord!: https://discord.gg/Yw2hYUdz3g

[Other gear I've used]
Blades: Butterfly Defence 3, Butterfly Defence Pro, Butterfly Innerforce ZLC, Butterfly Innershield, DHS Power G7, Stiga Offensive Classic Carbon
SPs: Friendship 802 (1.5), TSP Spectol (1.3, 1.8, 2.1), TSP Spectol Speed (1.3), TSP Super Spinpips Chop Sponge 2 (0.5, 1.3)
LPs: Butterfly Feint Long II (1), Butterfly Feint Long III (0.5, 1.3), Tibhar Grass D.TecS (OX), TSP Curl P1-R (0.5, 1, 1.3), TSP Curl P4 (1.3)

Sure, there is a presentation on youtube as well: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3RbJ7dto ... e=youtu.be
Again this one is in German so it might give you a hard time to understand the speaker.

....if you could measure how good you're executing a specific stroke/movement, you would see some variations in time while you're progressing. The idea is that when you take one of the suboptimal measurements, so when the stroke is not executed well, you were still learning a lot. Differential training will force you in playing a sub-optimal stroke. The purpose is not to improve you're optimal stroke but to reduce the training effort needed and learn quicker.

An example: if you're learning forehand topspin with a robot, you can do this for 15 minutes with exact the same stroke/postion etc each time. In this situation you would learn more if you play a couple of minutes with your right foot closest to the table, a couple of minutes with your right foot extremely to the back and of course some time in the 'normal' position. (see example post yesterday)
So instead of executing the training with the 'automatic pilot on' you become more aware on what is needed to play the ball from any position (so within the extremes just mentioned) correctly and your touch will improve significantly.

grtz,

G

That's really interesting, Gybe. Your explanation makes a lot of sense. I'd never thought about doing something like that, and I'm due to get a robot any day now, so I think I'll give it a go.

Thanks!

_________________
My blog: "Learning to play: as a modern defender": http://ooakforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=58&t=22254
My YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCtazeX ... oICGS9bqNg
Join the OOAK Discord!: https://discord.gg/Yw2hYUdz3g

[Other gear I've used]
Blades: Butterfly Defence 3, Butterfly Defence Pro, Butterfly Innerforce ZLC, Butterfly Innershield, DHS Power G7, Stiga Offensive Classic Carbon
SPs: Friendship 802 (1.5), TSP Spectol (1.3, 1.8, 2.1), TSP Spectol Speed (1.3), TSP Super Spinpips Chop Sponge 2 (0.5, 1.3)
LPs: Butterfly Feint Long II (1), Butterfly Feint Long III (0.5, 1.3), Tibhar Grass D.TecS (OX), TSP Curl P1-R (0.5, 1, 1.3), TSP Curl P4 (1.3)