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PostPosted: 04 Jan 2014, 02:12 
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LordCope wrote:
I know it's obvious, and we all say: 'anyone can have a bad session', and of course in your case it was worsened by obvious factors, but I just want to say how reassuring it is to hear other people report having had a crap session at which they were trounced. It's just good to not feel alone.


Haha, I'm glad I could help!

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PostPosted: 05 Jan 2014, 00:20 
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So I had another session this morning and today the body felt a lot better, I still had a lot of control poblems with the LP though. Since switching to the 1mm version I have felt a distinct lack of grip compared to the two 0.5mm sheets that I have, all in the same color. This is just not when chopping but in pushing and attacking as well. In the frst sessions I thought that it as my technique that just made it feel this way but I have played table tennis for 11 years and at least 5 of those on a somewhat high level and I now how to utilize a sponge. Today I decided to really look into this and first dompared it side to side with spare bat which is a Joo Se Hyuk blade with 0.5mm P1r on BH and Rakza on FH. I immediately felt a lot more grip in all strokes and it was much more linear (and this sheet is very old as well). I then proceeded to to some simple bouncing tests and it was clear that the new 1mm sheet had less grip and even gave some pure reversal at some angles, whereas the 0.5mm wasn't even close to doing the same thing. I thought that it might be the blade, weight and/or different FH rubbers that made the difference so I removed the 1mm sheet and put on the newer 0.5mm sheet that I have (just a few weeks old), this sheet provided a lot more grip as well compared to the 1mm version on the same blade.

Since a thicker sponge should provide more grip and dwell I must have gotten a bad and/or old sheet. Since I needed to order some more products as well I didn't order the LP from Japsko as I usually do but ordered it from another shop here in Sweden. I think that they don't sell a lot of LP at all since all the dark side players here order from Japsko. Sweden isn't really known for having a lot of LP players as well. A side note is that both the 0.5mm sheets is from Japsko and both performs a lot better.

I will talk to the shop I ordered from and probably send the sheet back, hopefully they can just refund me and let me order from Japsko but otherwise I hope they can provide me with a new sheet.

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PostPosted: 07 Jan 2014, 17:08 
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I've been struggling a lot the past week or so and I really feel that now is the moment when it's just for me to buckle up and keep my eyes on the goal, because I have som tough months ahead of me. It's also very tough to play against players that are in, or on the verge, of the top 100's in Sweden and have practiced with and played in the same team as a defender their whole lives. Really takes the spirit out of you sometimes when you get battered all the time. Players in the club that I used to beat I still seem to beat but not as easily as before, but that was expected, there's no being lazy with this style and setup.

What I feel I need to improve is the first chop/push. At the moment I allow my opponent to loop too hard and wide and against the good players in the club the point is often over after their first attack. If I manage to keep the first chop low and on the table though I usually have a 50%+ win ratio on those points, even against the better players. I will look at some matches of the top defenders to see how they set up the point but if you guys have any tips and pointers I will gladly hear them.

Next weekend I have five league-matches and it'll be interesting to find out where I really stand.

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PostPosted: 07 Jan 2014, 20:14 
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auzcar wrote:
I've been struggling a lot the past week or so and I really feel that now is the moment when it's just for me to buckle up and keep my eyes on the goal, because I have som tough months ahead of me. It's also very tough to play against players that are in, or on the verge, of the top 100's in Sweden and have practiced with and played in the same team as a defender their whole lives. Really takes the spirit out of you sometimes when you get battered all the time. Players in the club that I used to beat I still seem to beat but not as easily as before, but that was expected, there's no being lazy with this style and setup.

What I feel I need to improve is the first chop/push. At the moment I allow my opponent to loop too hard and wide and against the good players in the club the point is often over after their first attack. If I manage to keep the first chop low and on the table though I usually have a 50%+ win ratio on those points, even against the better players. I will look at some matches of the top defenders to see how they set up the point but if you guys have any tips and pointers I will gladly hear them.

Next weekend I have five league-matches and it'll be interesting to find out where I really stand.


Stay true to your long term goal!
About serveice returns to generate a "nice" first attack from your opponent variation is the key I think. Push with LP, push with inverted, place the different. Punch with lp fast and hard if service is a little too high (look at Bogeyhunters video with Chen W for this). To make your opponent unsure what to expect is important. And if you use a lot of spin normally in your own serve or in your oushes with inverted, do so for the first set. Then try to do tha same motion but sometimes use a stiff wrist so there will be much less spin. This is especially good to do with pushes with inverted on BH - sometimes lots of backspin and then the same motion but not nearly as much back spin. You can be as deceptive with inverted as with LP, most of us just kind of forget about this.
Be on your toes, be very fast away from the table when you decide to chop. But sometimes you need to stay at the table. Try to chop or push to elbow and make sure opponent will go for a loop like you would back away and chop. Then stay at the table and block with inverted on BH. If you are used to block with inverted on BH then this is a very good way to mess up your opponents game. Just when he thought he knew what was going on you change. And then do it again :devil: . Most oppnnets do not expect you to do odd things twice in a row, so do that :-)

Also, you might loose to people you normally win against. But you will also be able to win agasint those who you never beaten before. You do not know before the match if they are good against YOUR type of defensive game! Good luck!

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PostPosted: 07 Jan 2014, 21:13 
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I know I'm nowhere near your level, but I'm starting to realise that against strong players, I just need to be patient. I simply don't have the footwork, anticipation, tactics, or sheer amount of spin to trouble a strong player. From their perspective, they see me retrieving a few shots, bide their time, wait for me to fail to land a chop, or wait for a weak return and kill it. Easy peasy for them. However, I'm improving, and consistently. I'm getting consistently 7 or 8 points, when I used to get fewer than four. I'm harder to play than before, and as long as I concentrate on improving technique, and not mind getting beaten all the time, eventually those 7 or 8 will become games in my favour.

Hope that's a useful perspective for you.

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PostPosted: 07 Jan 2014, 21:21 
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Iron Pips
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Also have a look at Chtchetinine, he focuses on those points he can win. Some balls he doesn't even try to catch, he is so experienced that he knows he can't win that point and he knows he need to save his breath :) .
If you have problems with your opponets serving and third ball attack, try to be satisfyed if you win one of of four points when he is serving. And decide strategy according to that goal. If you do that you can take more chances, start your movement a little earlier because you konow that at least one of his two serves will be a long that you can attack (or whatever you need to do to win a point from him).

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PostPosted: 08 Jan 2014, 06:17 
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You need to make sure that the shot that the opponent plays before your 1st chop is the one that you want them to play. That is you determine the shot that they play. For example, if their backhand loop is not nearly as strong as their forehand loop, make sure that your 1st chop is off their backhand loop.

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PostPosted: 08 Jan 2014, 17:13 
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Thanks for the advices guys! After reading and reflecting upon them I realise I need to focus more on placement than on spin, atm I've just tried to put as much spin as possible on the first chop/push to prevent a strong attack. I have another session tonight, I'll definitely try to focus more on placement and see how it goes.

Otherwise I think that the variation aspect has been going pretty well, my serves have always been pretty good and the twiddle to BH-block shot is still in my back bone since the pushblocking day, I could utilize it a bit more though. Now in the beginning I've put all of my focus on the defensive game though and I haven't attacked as much as I should to win as much as possible, but that has been an active choice since I want to get the defensive part down as fast as possible.

On another note, the day before yesterday I talked to the shop that sold me the bad sheet of P1r and they said I could just send it back and don't pay the invoice, which was nice of them. I ordered from Japsko instead and received the new sheet yesterday (ridiculously fast as usual), there is a very clear difference between this sheet and the one I'm sending back. First of all you can actually see on the surface that one from Japsko is a lot more fresh and when you rub a ball against the tops there's a lot more grip on the new one. When bouncing and spinning a ball on it the difference is more than noticeable since the bad sheet even gave off some reversal when holding the bat at a slight angle. So tonight will be the first real test with a 1mm sheet.

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PostPosted: 09 Jan 2014, 05:57 
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Quick update from tonights session: Only got 4 hours of sleep this night and the night before that so my body was like overcooked spaghetti, did mostly sparring against the younger players in my club as we usually dl in wednesdays. Didn't play enough matches to really test the strategy but I think the ones I played went pretty well under the circumstances. Will test it further tomorrow.

The new 1mm sheet from Japsko felt much much better than the bad sheet I got from TTEX (swedish shop) and it felt nice to have a thicker sponge again, I definitely like the feel a lot more compared to the 0.5mm. It's easier to push and to keep the chops low with the thicker sponge imo.

Over and pips out!

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PostPosted: 09 Jan 2014, 17:44 
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Interesting about the bad sheet... TSP sheets are usually very consistant. I wonder if it was a storage problem, or just a really old sheet that had been on the shelves for a long time. Good on them for giving you refund though :up:

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PostPosted: 09 Jan 2014, 18:20 
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haggisv wrote:
Interesting about the bad sheet... TSP sheets are usually very consistant. I wonder if it was a storage problem, or just a really old sheet that had been on the shelves for a long time. Good on them for giving you refund though :up:


It most certainly was a storage or aging problem, I've had a lot of problems with this shop during the years but they are the biggest in Sweden and sometimes I need to order from them since there isn't another shop that stocks the product. My guess is that they don't sell much LPs since we have Japsko and all dark side players I know orders from there due to price, outstanding service and extremely fast delivery. Since they don't sell much LPs the ones they have is probably a bit old, that paired with a sub-par storage would really make a difference.

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PostPosted: 09 Jan 2014, 19:12 
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haggisv wrote:
Interesting about the bad sheet... TSP sheets are usually very consistant. I wonder if it was a storage problem, or just a really old sheet that had been on the shelves for a long time. Good on them for giving you refund though :up:


I have a sheet of curl p1 and it doesn't really do anything well, no reversal, no spin, no nothing. I think this was an old sheet when I bought it already and it doesn't play like a p1 should at all.

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PostPosted: 09 Jan 2014, 19:36 
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auzcar wrote:
haggisv wrote:
Interesting about the bad sheet... TSP sheets are usually very consistant. I wonder if it was a storage problem, or just a really old sheet that had been on the shelves for a long time. Good on them for giving you refund though :up:


It most certainly was a storage or aging problem, I've had a lot of problems with this shop during the years but they are the biggest in Sweden and sometimes I need to order from them since there isn't another shop that stocks the product. My guess is that they don't sell much LPs since we have Japsko and all dark side players I know orders from there due to price, outstanding service and extremely fast delivery. Since they don't sell much LPs the ones they have is probably a bit old, that paired with a sub-par storage would really make a difference.



If you ordered the first one from the shop I think you did, then they got P1r into their shop for the first time in september 2010 (I ordered my first sheet then). Your sheet has probably been stored since then.

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PostPosted: 09 Jan 2014, 19:43 
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Def-attack wrote:
auzcar wrote:
haggisv wrote:
Interesting about the bad sheet... TSP sheets are usually very consistant. I wonder if it was a storage problem, or just a really old sheet that had been on the shelves for a long time. Good on them for giving you refund though :up:


It most certainly was a storage or aging problem, I've had a lot of problems with this shop during the years but they are the biggest in Sweden and sometimes I need to order from them since there isn't another shop that stocks the product. My guess is that they don't sell much LPs since we have Japsko and all dark side players I know orders from there due to price, outstanding service and extremely fast delivery. Since they don't sell much LPs the ones they have is probably a bit old, that paired with a sub-par storage would really make a difference.



If you ordered the first one from the shop I think you did, then they got P1r into their shop for the first time in september 2010 (I ordered my first sheet then). Your sheet has probably been stored since then.


It sounds very likely that it's been lying around for that long, pretty shitty of them to send a sheet that's over 2 years old though. Oh well, it turned out good in the end though so I guess it's fine.

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PostPosted: 10 Jan 2014, 06:42 
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I would be very interested to get a detailed comparison between P1R 0.5mm and 1mm on the same blade :up: . I have both thicknesses here and I'm not sure which thickness fits best to which blade (VKM or Joo)...

auzcar wrote:
Quick update from tonights session: Only got 4 hours of sleep this night and the night before that so my body was like overcooked spaghetti, did mostly sparring against the younger players in my club as we usually dl in wednesdays. Didn't play enough matches to really test the strategy but I think the ones I played went pretty well under the circumstances. Will test it further tomorrow.

The new 1mm sheet from Japsko felt much much better than the bad sheet I got from TTEX (swedish shop) and it felt nice to have a thicker sponge again, I definitely like the feel a lot more compared to the 0.5mm. It's easier to push and to keep the chops low with the thicker sponge imo.

Over and pips out!

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