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 Post subject: Re: Holy Chtchet!
PostPosted: 20 Jan 2018, 01:51 
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Ninja of the Holy Chtchet
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For the SP forehand? I think I need a demo of how the stroke should look first, but agree.

What do you think overall about that style for me?

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 Post subject: Re: Holy Chtchet!
PostPosted: 28 Jan 2018, 05:49 
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Ninja of the Holy Chtchet
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Things to work on for my next session:

Opening against fast heavy side under to my BH.
Counter looping in general, but especially against slow spinny topspins, and high.
Creating heavier short underspin with backhand served.
Looping/hitting balls that are flat hit against underspin (opponent hits underspin, does not loop to lift it)

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 Post subject: Re: Holy Chtchet!
PostPosted: 18 Feb 2018, 23:41 
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Ninja of the Holy Chtchet
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I am strapped for time, so I will make this quick and wont check it for grammar, or continuity, so forgive me if this is all over the place:

I am currently going down the craziest style/EJ path I've had in a while. My annual skin-shedding that I tend to do at the beginning/end of the year. Every time this happens, I tend to play Jpen or attack, with mixed results. But I always learn a lot.

The lessons I've been taking have been as a double inverted attacker. I did try SPs on the backhand and the forehand but I don't think that fits my personality in the end. I did like chopping with SPs...but very slow SPs, and being able to attack on the BH without twiddling was nice. I also played my usual chopper setup again at league and did very well, naturally, but felt very hamstrung in terms of attacking possibilities. My forehand has improved so I think all of this experimentation has definitely been worth it.

Playing with OX, however, I experienced having difficulties with much lower players who are spinless. I shifted to attacking more and that solved that issue, but there are always issue with OX chopping which gives people I can easily beat with double inverted a chance.

Because of playing JPEN, I also now have a FH crossover which I lacked before! Now if I can only get back into position from the crossover...gotta work on that. More of a lack of habit...I watch my ball instead of moving my feet.

I also revisited the double inverted chopper style with Reflectoid. I think this is the best current compromise between attacking and defending. I can keep a lot of my ingrained habits from defense, but apply all of new attacking strategies. I've been down this road before and didn't' stick with it, but I think I will give this a solid couple of months or so. The urge to go back to grippy LPs is always there, and I have that setup for matches that count. The difference in level between LP chopping and double inverted chopping, out of all the styles I've tried, is the smallest.

Current state, my LP chopping level is about 1630...maybe a little more. Comparatively, here are what I estimate my level to be with all of the recent wacky style experimentation I have tried:

Double inverted attacker: 1400-1500
Jpen Attacker: 1200 (haha)
Sp attacker: 1300-1400
SP defender 1500 ish
Double inverted Modern D/allround style 1500-1600

So, in terms of level playing a double inverted chopping/allround style is the closest in terms of competitive results. And the good news is I can continue applying the double inverted attacking techniques and strategy that I am currently learning during my lessons. Kind of a win/win. The backhand is a little different with thin reflectoid, but I am very whippy on that side with loops, so I can compensate. Will I stick with it? We'll see. I don't think it would take too long to get over 1600 and match my current level.

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 Post subject: Re: Holy Chtchet!
PostPosted: 19 Feb 2018, 00:06 
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Perhaps not surprising that LP chopping and double inverted (especially with Reflectoid) are reasonably close - the way you win points are probably quite similar. Too bad I did not get to see your matches (or play you) at the Teams in November - one of the things I'm still not too sure is whether you do play as a 'chopper'.

I was about to play another chopper in the club yesterday and spectators were saying things like "ooh, two-chopper match, this will take a while! :) ". To which my opponent quickly responded:"he's not a chopper!". I kind of agree with her - she does chop on both sides and would only attack a high ball, so definitely a chopper. Me, on the other hand, I now tend to be more aggressive on FH - may be not trying to loop/hit everything, but not pushing a lot either and only occasionally chopping there. And on BH: sure, I will chop when a good shot comes my way, but I am also very likely to hit/bump against backspin. I won 3:0, mostly by attacking her backspin with LP - she tried to chop these balls, but they did not really have much topspin on them and so promptly went into the net.

I guess the gist is that if you want to be more aggressive, you can, even without double inverted. If you want to mostly loop on BH, OK, that's different. Probably possible with twiddling, but adds extra complication. In the end you play the way you enjoy the most (I like the 'skin shedding' metaphor).

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 Post subject: Re: Holy Chtchet!
PostPosted: 19 Feb 2018, 03:58 
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Ninja of the Holy Chtchet
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pgpg wrote:
Perhaps not surprising that LP chopping and double inverted (especially with Reflectoid) are reasonably close - the way you win points are probably quite similar. Too bad I did not get to see your matches (or play you) at the Teams in November - one of the things I'm still not too sure is whether you do play as a 'chopper'.

I was about to play another chopper in the club yesterday and spectators were saying things like "ooh, two-chopper match, this will take a while! :) ". To which my opponent quickly responded:"he's not a chopper!". I kind of agree with her - she does chop on both sides and would only attack a high ball, so definitely a chopper. Me, on the other hand, I now tend to be more aggressive on FH - may be not trying to loop/hit everything, but not pushing a lot either and only occasionally chopping there. And on BH: sure, I will chop when a good shot comes my way, but I am also very likely to hit/bump against backspin. I won 3:0, mostly by attacking her backspin with LP - she tried to chop these balls, but they did not really have much topspin on them and so promptly went into the net.

I guess the gist is that if you want to be more aggressive, you can, even without double inverted. If you want to mostly loop on BH, OK, that's different. Probably possible with twiddling, but adds extra complication. In the end you play the way you enjoy the most (I like the 'skin shedding' metaphor).


Yeah, I definitely play as a chopper. The one game you watched, my opponent was giving me too many opportunities to attack, so I took them. But against most folks, I am definitely a chopper. However, when I play against other classic choppers, I definitely tend to have less patience, and as such I often have trouble.

My forehand attack is my week point, I can loop fine against underspin and to open, but my in rally foreahand against top is either block or chop. I have a counter forehand chop as people tell me, and a good one. But I have ZERO counter loop. Also, I tend to flat hit more in the rally on that side. On my backhand, however, I am very spinny and loopy, with lots of whip, so my best attack option is to twiddle and backhand loop if I am playing with pips. I twiddle a lot. By best shots are my forehand chop, and my backhand loop, kind of reverse modern defender. Now, if I get underspin, i have a pretty good loop on the FH...but honestly I prefer to chop all day if the opponent lets me.

I can handle no-spin far better with backhand inverted strokes.

When I play with my DG/Defplay combo, I do the Jian Li bump, and it's very good for me. But the player must give me under. If i play a guy that does a lot of no spin, I don't often bump with the LPs.
Being more agressive with the LPs is exactly what I've been trying to do lately. And if I go back to LPs (probablly will, who knows) I will continue infusing offense in my attack.

My best performance in recent memory was at or Last Team league when I played a penhold push blocker..I ran around and FH looped everything and won a close match. But that style is usually the death of me.

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