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 Post subject: Re: Holy Chtchet!
PostPosted: 03 May 2017, 01:30 
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Ninja of the Holy Chtchet
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pgpg wrote:
Japsican wrote:


..
Less anti-spin predjuce, means you will get more practice because everyone is willing to play you.
More practice partners.
...


Is this really a problem for you? If anything, I got the impression that people are looking to practice against my chop in particular, and against me in general lately. As one of clubmates told me :I'm going to play in the Senior Games this summer - and 30+% of them will use pips, so I better be ready".

Yes, less so now that my level is higher and I have a regular practice partner who knows the merits of practicing vs. the LPs. The reasons range from it's "not fun" to "I don't want your LPs to throw off my timing for the other (conventional) opponents."

I have a few other higher rated guys from 1900-2300 who are willing to hit with me at least once, because they aren't as bothered by it and they even enjoy playing against it. But against them, i get trampled. People rated 1500 to 1800, you get a mixed bag of attitudes toward pips. This one guy, "Ralph" flat out tells my practice partner to stop practicing against me because he thinks he's stunting his growth as a player by doing so. This guy is an idiot, and my practice partner knows that, but still, I was quite pissed at his comment... I have had many run-ins with this dude.

Still, this is perhaps the least important reason on that list, in fact not one I care about, I just mentioned it because it may matter to other people.

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 Post subject: Re: Holy Chtchet!
PostPosted: 03 May 2017, 01:36 
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Hell, just the other day I played a guy who was a 2 wing classic chopper...OX LP BH and OX SP Forehand from Iran. We finished a match that I won 3-0 and he stated that I "cut too much." I was like..."What?" He chops 99% of the time, I'm more like 80%. His reason? "It makes me too tired." :^) |(

I just threw my hands up.

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 Post subject: Re: Holy Chtchet!
PostPosted: 03 May 2017, 01:39 
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Looks like you have a lot of 'characters' in your club/area, or may be I just got used to the ones I run into here.
:^)

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 Post subject: Re: Holy Chtchet!
PostPosted: 03 May 2017, 02:37 
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pgpg wrote:
Looks like you have a lot of 'characters' in your club/area, or may be I just got used to the ones I run into here.
:^)


Definitley. Lots of characters....some assholes...but lots of decent people. I find TT people to be the strangest of any sport I've participated in...and I've partipated in hockey and MMA. :D

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 Post subject: Re: Holy Chtchet!
PostPosted: 04 May 2017, 00:23 
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Japsican wrote:
pgpg wrote:
Looks like you have a lot of 'characters' in your club/area, or may be I just got used to the ones I run into here.
:^)


Definitley. Lots of characters....some assholes...but lots of decent people. I find TT people to be the strangest of any sport I've participated in...and I've partipated in hockey and MMA. :D

Wow. Racism, sexism, etc, etc.... And now, rubber-ism?! :lol: :P

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 Post subject: Re: Holy Chtchet!
PostPosted: 04 May 2017, 00:48 
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Danthespearton wrote:
Wow. Racism, sexism, etc, etc.... And now, rubber-ism?! :lol: :P

Yep, it exists!

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 Post subject: Re: Holy Chtchet!
PostPosted: 18 Jun 2017, 12:02 
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[quote="Japsican]
Coach EmRatThich Controversial take on training
...
However, I dislike his intimation that abusing children breeds success. He very controversially showed footage of a chinese coach beating a child with a stick as a method of coaching. Waldner never needed a beating. Jerry Rice never needed a beating.
...
[/quote]

Then again though... Did Ma Long?

Iskandar


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 Post subject: Re: Holy Chtchet!
PostPosted: 18 Jun 2017, 17:43 
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iskandar taib wrote:
[quote="Japsican]
Coach EmRatThich Controversial take on training
...
However, I dislike his intimation that abusing children breeds success. He very controversially showed footage of a chinese coach beating a child with a stick as a method of coaching. Waldner never needed a beating. Jerry Rice never needed a beating.
...
[/quote]

Then again though... Did Ma Long?

Iskandar[/quote]


I heard somewhere that Ma Long and China team get sent to MILITARY BOOT CAMP!!! I think sometime in Nov+Dec+Jan ? I think every year they get put through the wringer ?

So I doubt that CNT members get much easy time what with hitting the ball 8+ hours everyday.


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 Post subject: Re: Holy Chtchet!
PostPosted: 18 Jun 2017, 23:24 
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iskandar taib wrote:
[quote="Japsican]
Coach EmRatThich Controversial take on training
...
However, I dislike his intimation that abusing children breeds success. He very controversially showed footage of a chinese coach beating a child with a stick as a method of coaching. Waldner never needed a beating. Jerry Rice never needed a beating.
...
[/quote]

Then again though... Did Ma Long?

Iskandar[/quote][/quote][/quote][/quote][/quote]

The answer to that is no. It's a misguided cultural paradigm in china that this abuse is a necessity. (I understand that this is my opinion and it's shaped by my own relative culture). There are other ways to motivate and breed success.

And...even if it was somehow more effective, it's morally corrupt. Abuse is always deplorable.

That being said, if one need evidence that this philosophy isn't necessarily the guaranteed to bread success, just look at China's success in other sports. Taking into account the population and resources, they should be far better at other sports. They aren't.

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 Post subject: Re: Holy Chtchet!
PostPosted: 19 Jun 2017, 21:36 
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iskandar taib wrote:
Then again though... Did Ma Long?
Iskandar


Idk if Ma Long got his ass whooped too but I read a long time ago that Ma Long lived in the outskirts of the city and had to ride his bike to and back just to practice.

I think his ass would hurt enough just from having to ride a few hours a day in addition to the running and training...


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 Post subject: Re: Holy Chtchet!
PostPosted: 06 Jul 2017, 00:24 
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Just an update...

Had great success with a blade change and a bit of a style change. Recently I've stuck with DG and have incorporated a poor man's Jian Li bump vs. underspin that has really helped my game. Even against experienced players who are decent vs. LPs. So, I've explored that. My game has been more mixed than straight chopper. The defplay is not the best for blocking and bumping as it is flexy and dampening, although I've had good results with it. Wanted to try a slightly stiffer all blade, and I had the Stiga Allround Carbon laying around from my days of emulating Gustaf Ericson's style (he has since changed to a Clipper himself).

Going back to a standard sized blade I instantly fell back into the Ericson style of Chopping on the BH and Fishing/Guiding/Looping on the forehand. Topspin defense on the FH is VERY tricky for some guys. I have been reluctant to do this consistently because my FH chop is arguably my best stroke. What I find hard as all hell to do is to chop an ultra spinny loop from a 1900+ level player...also some folks are just not bothered by underspin at all. What I find is that the change from my backhand chop to forehand topspin (whether a defensive topspin or a strong loop) is far more difficult for most people. I was told by several players that I was harder to play, not because my game was better, but because having to identify between top and under causes delay and that gives people trouble.
Which makes sense. If you are always chopping, whether with pips or inverted it's easier for the opponent to know how to set their feet, angle their blade, and chose the stroke. It's just a matter of reading the amount of under. But with the defensive topspin (guide stroke or fish) your opponent now has an additional variable. It's weird because it seems like fishing is a sitting duck waiting to be killed against anyone over 1700, but that's not the case as long as you do it right. What in the past I've failed at this because I didn't vary the stroke as much. I still chop, but less so. I also attack more but that's (as always) a work in progress.

Gusaf Ericson Match

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E2m3ItEtmKU[/youtube]

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 Post subject: Re: Holy Chtchet!
PostPosted: 06 Jul 2017, 00:43 
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Japsican wrote:
Just an update...

Had great success with a blade change and a bit of a style change. Recently I've stuck with DG and have incorporated a poor man's Jian Li bump vs. underspin that has really helped my game. Even against experienced players who are decent vs. LPs. So, I've explored that. My game has been more mixed than straight chopper. The defplay is not the best for blocking and bumping as it is flexy and dampening, although I've had good results with it. Wanted to try a slightly stiffer all blade, and I had the Stiga Allround Carbon laying around from my days of emulating Gustaf Ericson's style (he has since changed to a Clipper himself).

Going back to a standard sized blade I instantly fell back into the Ericson style of Chopping on the BH and Fishing/Guiding/Looping on the forehand. Topspin defense on the FH is VERY tricky for some guys. I have been reluctant to do this consistently because my FH chop is arguably my best stroke. What I find hard as all hell to do is to chop an ultra spinny loop from a 1900+ level player...also some folks are just not bothered by underspin at all. What I find is that the change from my backhand chop to forehand topspin (whether a defensive topspin or a strong loop) is far more difficult for most people. I was told by several players that I was harder to play, not because my game was better, but because having to identify between top and under causes delay and that gives people trouble.
Which makes sense. If you are always chopping, whether with pips or inverted it's easier for the opponent to know how to set their feet, angle their blade, and chose the stroke. It's just a matter of reading the amount of under. But with the defensive topspin (guide stroke or fish) your opponent now has an additional variable. It's weird because it seems like fishing is a sitting duck waiting to be killed against anyone over 1700, but that's not the case as long as you do it right. What in the past I've failed at this because I didn't vary the stroke as much. I still chop, but less so. I also attack more but that's (as always) a work in progress.

Gusaf Ericson Match



Fixed the embedded video (https -> http). You are evolving more towards Jian Li play style :), he does not chop much on FH either.

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 Post subject: Re: Holy Chtchet!
PostPosted: 06 Jul 2017, 02:26 
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As always variability and unpredictability is the key. Some guys don't like topspin defense, some don't like underspin defense. Being able to do both is the key.


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 Post subject: Re: Holy Chtchet!
PostPosted: 06 Jul 2017, 03:58 
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Right. I theorize that the in addition to the added variable of a different kind of spin (not just variation) the reason why topspin defense tends to be difficult for most people is that they are compelled to topspin it back, rather than push it short.

If I'm chopping on the FH, at my level half of those are pushed short or "dumped" short. This means, you MUST run to the table and either push it (usually) or attack it (short pushes are hard to attack). On the other hand, topspin allows the chopper to remain at distance because 99% of the time you are going to get a topspin back...they won't (can't) drop those short usually.

So what happened in most of my games vs FH topspin defense is:
-They returned it topspin to which I defended it (either wing)
-They missed it because I put side on the ball and the ball changed angle off the bounce
-They put it in the net (due to less spin)
-They sent it off the table if I looped it (not expecting as much pace or spin).

I am personally better able to counter loop a week or reluctant topspin far better than I'm able to loop vs. a dumped ball pushed short. So therefore I've more opportunities to attack, which is not my forte, but I'm trying to do this more.

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 Post subject: Re: Holy Chtchet!
PostPosted: 06 Jul 2017, 04:35 
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Jan Ove Waldner breaks his Bat. His reaction is priceless...


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