OOAK Table Tennis Forum :: Zen of chopping

peterpong wrote:

pgpg wrote:

Put a newly arrived Nittaku Best ANti (1.8mm) onto a spare Defplay and played for a bit at the club.

Weird. Played it as an OX LP, which I'm most familiar with, and it was not behaving like one. Slower, not that much reversal close to the table, did not get good feel for chops yet. Lost a match to someone 200+ points below me.

Obviosly a work in progress, but does not look too good at the moment.

Sword combo still feels awesome, however, especially forehand. Somehow it clicks - good balance and speed. Perhaps EJing does have a point...

I just found this comment re best anti.the anti is good against serves and heavy topspin but it doesnt do much along the lines of deception.its hard work chopping etc but im very used to it.im trying ox dtecs and loving them-i find them easy to play with on the slow defplay.im near the end of the season so im not going to use the pips yet in a match with good players.i will later and ill see how it goes.the anti has amazing control but good players soon read it.its got me up the league ladder so to speak but the ox pips may get me futher

Apparently slick antis are where it's at right now for deception, so cool kids play with Diabolic and such. Tempted to try at some point - watch this, especially how ball bounces on some of anti returns (dealing with chops apparently is a breeze, especially if they have some sidespin

Did play with Sword #2 a couple of times: first it was League last night, where I pulled it out of the bag when it was my time to play 2100 guy, figuring that there is not much harm in trying it out in this specific match.

First impression was that arc was higher on the FH shots, but they still landed. I actually managed to take a game off him (he usually plays his A- game against lower opponents, the only difference being the serves). This time he actually pulled out his main serves, which took me a game+ to adjust. T05FX obviously played different from Palio AK47, but did have a quite pleasant feel. Used in in two more matches which I also lost, but played quite well.

Played for ~2 more hours tonight in the club - I think I'm starting to understand why people like Tenergy

- there were these moments where I was just swinging and ball was landing almost effortlessly with good speed and spin. Must be an illusion.

pgpg wrote:

...

Played for ~2 more hours tonight in the club - I think I'm starting to understand why people like Tenergy

- there were these moments where I was just swinging and ball was landing almost effortlessly with good speed and spin. Must be an illusion.

No, it's not an illusion, the spring sponge is special and addictive. For some people (read: myself), it has linearity issues, but for others (read: many better players than myself), they find it perfectly intuitive and can't play without it.

NextLevel wrote:

pgpg wrote:

...

Played for ~2 more hours tonight in the club - I think I'm starting to understand why people like Tenergy

- there were these moments where I was just swinging and ball was landing almost effortlessly with good speed and spin. Must be an illusion.

So, I guess the 'spring' sponge is unique to Tenergy then, and is still not matched by ESN offerings? I did not spend much time inspecting it, did not look that different

New Diabolic toy arrived (kudos to tabletennis11 for great service, as usual

). The whole setup (Matador Texa +Diabolic 1.6 +Rasant Beat 1.9) weighed in at ~160g, but somehow feels heavier, just from waving it around a bit. Balance is more towards the head, I suppose. Came assembled with very good looking blue Victas side tape - which I liked, even though none of components are Victas/TSP-related.

Diabolic is quite frictionless

and slow. Club trial will have to wait till Wednesday - substantial snowstorm is coming in tomorrow, and Tuesday league has been cancelled already.

Latest experience was mostly with Sword #2 (which is likely to be promoted to #1) - T05fx+DG. DG feels softer and slower relative to Scylla. My excitement for T05fx somewhat died down - perhaps simply adjusted and got used to it as novelty wore off somewhat. Still, folks commented that my error rate came down (not sure if FH rubber should get credit though), and I get more of "hey, where you are going, let's play one more match"

.

Occasionally feel an urge to change the title of the blog - not that much chopping going on lately (some, but not a lot in matches). Especially when playing people who defend I'm now much more to basically hit/bump back their backspin - it's not easy to push/chop back.

I too struggle a lot with frictionless anti, especially against hard loops. My natural instinct is to close the bat a little, but that's just the wrong thing to so, as the ball just drops into the net. After a few sessions, I still could not overcome this, so I went back to LPs, despite the faft that some things work really well for the Anti.

Author:	peterpong [ 27 Feb 2018, 08:54 ]
Post subject:	Re: Zen of chopping
pgpg wrote: peterpong wrote: pgpg wrote: Put a newly arrived Nittaku Best ANti (1.8mm) onto a spare Defplay and played for a bit at the club. Weird. Played it as an OX LP, which I'm most familiar with, and it was not behaving like one. Slower, not that much reversal close to the table, did not get good feel for chops yet. Lost a match to someone 200+ points below me. Obviosly a work in progress, but does not look too good at the moment. Sword combo still feels awesome, however, especially forehand. Somehow it clicks - good balance and speed. Perhaps EJing does have a point... I just found this comment re best anti.the anti is good against serves and heavy topspin but it doesnt do much along the lines of deception.its hard work chopping etc but im very used to it.im trying ox dtecs and loving them-i find them easy to play with on the slow defplay.im near the end of the season so im not going to use the pips yet in a match with good players.i will later and ill see how it goes.the anti has amazing control but good players soon read it.its got me up the league ladder so to speak but the ox pips may get me futher Apparently slick antis are where it's at right now for deception, so cool kids play with Diabolic and such. Tempted to try at some point - watch this, especially how ball bounces on some of anti returns (dealing with chops apparently is a breeze, especially if they have some sidespin ): i saw this match somewhere else-i love the way he uses the diabolic.

Author:	pgpg [ 06 Mar 2018, 12:28 ]
Post subject:	Re: Zen of chopping
Semi-important milestone - finally got a sheet of Tenergy (05FX in 1.9mm) and put it onto my Sword #2 with Dornenglanz on BH. Just want to see what it's like... If it does not work out, it will go onto Matsushita Pro, I guess, for a BTY-only setup (already has Feint Long II on BH there). Overheard a funny exchange at the club last weekend: Dude #1 borrows a paddle from Dude #2 to try out (some standard blade with Tenergies on both sides), since first guy's rubbers are getting a bit old. While Dude #1 hits a few practice shots and observes how awesome it is compared to his current setup, Dude #2 meanwhile chuckles while sitting on a bench and mentions in a low voice to me how he got his black Tenergy in China for 10$ or so, and it's most likely a fake ... Anyway, they are both 2000+, may be close to 2100, so whatever it was, it still works for them pretty well.

Author:	pgpg [ 08 Mar 2018, 13:28 ]
Post subject:	Re: Zen of chopping
Did play with Sword #2 a couple of times: first it was League last night, where I pulled it out of the bag when it was my time to play 2100 guy, figuring that there is not much harm in trying it out in this specific match. First impression was that arc was higher on the FH shots, but they still landed. I actually managed to take a game off him (he usually plays his A- game against lower opponents, the only difference being the serves). This time he actually pulled out his main serves, which took me a game+ to adjust. T05FX obviously played different from Palio AK47, but did have a quite pleasant feel. Used in in two more matches which I also lost, but played quite well. Played for ~2 more hours tonight in the club - I think I'm starting to understand why people like Tenergy - there were these moments where I was just swinging and ball was landing almost effortlessly with good speed and spin. Must be an illusion.

Author:	pgpg [ 09 Mar 2018, 23:12 ]
Post subject:	Re: Zen of chopping
From 'why not' department: ordered myself a frictionless anti setup: Diabolic 1.6 on Dr. Neubauer Matador Texa, with Rasant Beat on FH. Just for fun, really - to see how different it is.

Author:	NextLevel [ 09 Mar 2018, 23:13 ]
Post subject:	Re: Zen of chopping
pgpg wrote: Did play with Sword #2 a couple of times: first it was League last night, where I pulled it out of the bag when it was my time to play 2100 guy, figuring that there is not much harm in trying it out in this specific match. First impression was that arc was higher on the FH shots, but they still landed. I actually managed to take a game off him (he usually plays his A- game against lower opponents, the only difference being the serves). This time he actually pulled out his main serves, which took me a game+ to adjust. T05FX obviously played different from Palio AK47, but did have a quite pleasant feel. Used in in two more matches which I also lost, but played quite well. Played for ~2 more hours tonight in the club - I think I'm starting to understand why people like Tenergy - there were these moments where I was just swinging and ball was landing almost effortlessly with good speed and spin. Must be an illusion. No, it's not an illusion, the spring sponge is special and addictive. For some people (read: myself), it has linearity issues, but for others (read: many better players than myself), they find it perfectly intuitive and can't play without it.

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Zen of chopping https://ooakforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=58&t=27372	Page 49 of 70

Author:	kaesees [ 09 Mar 2018, 23:19 ]
Post subject:	Re: Zen of chopping
I've been wondering for a while NextLevel, what does the "Lumberjack table tennis" mentioned in your sig consist of?

Author:	Retriever [ 10 Mar 2018, 07:32 ]
Post subject:	Re: Zen of chopping
re "Lumberjack table tennis" <not NextLevel but can't resist for the lulz> I could make a case for it meaning: Chopping, except NL is not one Playing the game and axing questions later. Being OK Monty Python fan Take your axe, er I mean pick.

Author:	pgpg [ 13 Mar 2018, 10:23 ]
Post subject:	Re: Zen of chopping
New Diabolic toy arrived (kudos to tabletennis11 for great service, as usual ). The whole setup (Matador Texa +Diabolic 1.6 +Rasant Beat 1.9) weighed in at ~160g, but somehow feels heavier, just from waving it around a bit. Balance is more towards the head, I suppose. Came assembled with very good looking blue Victas side tape - which I liked, even though none of components are Victas/TSP-related. Diabolic is quite frictionless and slow. Club trial will have to wait till Wednesday - substantial snowstorm is coming in tomorrow, and Tuesday league has been cancelled already. Latest experience was mostly with Sword #2 (which is likely to be promoted to #1) - T05fx+DG. DG feels softer and slower relative to Scylla. My excitement for T05fx somewhat died down - perhaps simply adjusted and got used to it as novelty wore off somewhat. Still, folks commented that my error rate came down (not sure if FH rubber should get credit though), and I get more of "hey, where you are going, let's play one more match" . Occasionally feel an urge to change the title of the blog - not that much chopping going on lately (some, but not a lot in matches). Especially when playing people who defend I'm now much more likely to basically hit/bump back their backspin - it's not easy for them to push/chop it back.

Author:	pgpg [ 13 Mar 2018, 10:27 ]
Post subject:	Re: Zen of chopping
NextLevel wrote: pgpg wrote: ... Played for ~2 more hours tonight in the club - I think I'm starting to understand why people like Tenergy - there were these moments where I was just swinging and ball was landing almost effortlessly with good speed and spin. Must be an illusion. No, it's not an illusion, the spring sponge is special and addictive. For some people (read: myself), it has linearity issues, but for others (read: many better players than myself), they find it perfectly intuitive and can't play without it. So, I guess the 'spring' sponge is unique to Tenergy then, and is still not matched by ESN offerings? I did not spend much time inspecting it, did not look that different .

Author:	Japsican [ 14 Mar 2018, 03:28 ]
Post subject:	Re: Zen of chopping
pgpg wrote: NextLevel wrote: pgpg wrote: ... Played for ~2 more hours tonight in the club - I think I'm starting to understand why people like Tenergy - there were these moments where I was just swinging and ball was landing almost effortlessly with good speed and spin. Must be an illusion. No, it's not an illusion, the spring sponge is special and addictive. For some people (read: myself), it has linearity issues, but for others (read: many better players than myself), they find it perfectly intuitive and can't play without it. So, I guess the 'spring' sponge is unique to Tenergy then, and is still not matched by ESN offerings? I did not spend much time inspecting it, did not look that different . haha, careful...you might be out some $ soon. Is this T05FX on the Sword? I played with T05 on the defplay for a short time, and then on the VKM. The throw in the Defplay was soo damn high, it was unmanageable. At least for my level at the time.

Author:	Japsican [ 14 Mar 2018, 03:56 ]
Post subject:	Re: Zen of chopping
pgpg wrote: New Diabolic toy arrived (kudos to tabletennis11 for great service, as usual ). The whole setup (Matador Texa +Diabolic 1.6 +Rasant Beat 1.9) weighed in at ~160g, but somehow feels heavier, just from waving it around a bit. Balance is more towards the head, I suppose. Came assembled with very good looking blue Victas side tape - which I liked, even though none of components are Victas/TSP-related. Diabolic is quite frictionless and slow. Club trial will have to wait till Wednesday - substantial snowstorm is coming in tomorrow, and Tuesday league has been cancelled already. Latest experience was mostly with Sword #2 (which is likely to be promoted to #1) - T05fx+DG. DG feels softer and slower relative to Scylla. My excitement for T05fx somewhat died down - perhaps simply adjusted and got used to it as novelty wore off somewhat. Still, folks commented that my error rate came down (not sure if FH rubber should get credit though), and I get more of "hey, where you are going, let's play one more match" . Occasionally feel an urge to change the title of the blog - not that much chopping going on lately (some, but not a lot in matches). Especially when playing people who defend I'm now much more to basically hit/bump back their backspin - it's not easy to push/chop back. Guess I should have read through the rest of the posts.... I see it's on the sword. I can see how that would feel pretty nice. As for changing the title...why not? Hell, I changed it 3 times! Haha. And even had a separate one. How about, the Zen of TT? The Meta-Physicist of Table Tennis? (you see what I did there?)

Author:	pgpg [ 16 Mar 2018, 11:19 ]
Post subject:	Re: Zen of chopping
Used Diabolic combo for one match last night - lost respectably in 3, by blocking most of the balls into the net Different from LP (duh!) - very slow and requires stroke adjustment. Occasionally had few very nasty blocks, which means I need to watch a few anti videos a bit more closer for strokes and tactics. Later in the night had a spontaneous mini-lesson with a coach - he's imploring me to go more forward in FH stroke and to 'cover the ball' more. Again, for ~15 minutes it felt perfect and everything landed. It stopped after it became more of a combo drill: block/push with BH, loop return. Which tells me that recovery and having a proper backswing matters a lot - much easier to do if you are simply practicing FH 'loop' against the block.

Author:	haggisv [ 16 Mar 2018, 12:59 ]
Post subject:	Re: Zen of chopping
I too struggle a lot with frictionless anti, especially against hard loops. My natural instinct is to close the bat a little, but that's just the wrong thing to so, as the ball just drops into the net. After a few sessions, I still could not overcome this, so I went back to LPs, despite the faft that some things work really well for the Anti.

Author:	Der_Echte [ 17 Mar 2018, 16:36 ]
Post subject:	Re: Zen of chopping
There were a couple of evil USATT 2000 level anti players in the Sac area, but one of them went back to Russia. You try to play safe, you play right into their hands. You loop and forget what you put on it, then its a comin' a back to ya... and ya gotta cope with what you forgot.

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Author:	pgpg [ 17 Mar 2018, 23:05 ]
Post subject:	Re: Zen of chopping
haggisv wrote: I too struggle a lot with frictionless anti, especially against hard loops. My natural instinct is to close the bat a little, but that's just the wrong thing to so, as the ball just drops into the net. After a few sessions, I still could not overcome this, so I went back to LPs, despite the faft that some things work really well for the Anti. Yes, blade angle is an issue - looking at some anti videos it's obvious that blade is pretty much perpendicular to the table, plus the stroke is much more active going forward, presumably because the damn thing is so slow. Played another match with it yesterday, and it was pretty much the same, perhaps fewer mistakes, but not by much. Still intrigued by it - I think it requires a very good touch, so perhaps might be helpful to experiment with. The rest of the night was spent playing a couple of ~2200 players with rather predictable results. Did get close in a couple of games, though, for what it's worth (not much).