OOAK Table Tennis Forum

A brief note to add some kudos for TTNPP.com as I have placed two orders recently, and they have been delivered from asia to the UK in 6 and 8 days respectively, including weekends and a bank holiday. Could of course just mean that the postal service is improving, but good anyway.

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Timo Boll ALC ST
FH Tibhar Evolution MX-P Max
BH Tibhar Evolution FX-S 1.8
185g

I was surprised that the court seems so small. It seemed small for singles and several times there was not room to play defense. Why did you not use all that gym space it looks like you have?

(Thank you for posting this match. I found it very interesting. I a not trying to be critical about the court size, it just seemed odd to me).

Hi Vanjr, yes a perfectly reasonable observation. What has happened is that there were 10 courts set up for the tournament, but this final is last thing in the weekend and all other courts have been broken down. You can see lots of folded tables in the background. We simply haven't adjusted the court for the new found space, probably because none of us are out-and-out defence. I don't recall feeling cramped for space, although as we've played together for a few years now we don't tend to get in each other's way.

Venues generally are a problem at local level, often they are far from ideal but you have to use what you can. In this case it was a hired School hall and the tables brought in by van.

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Timo Boll ALC ST
FH Tibhar Evolution MX-P Max
BH Tibhar Evolution FX-S 1.8
185g

Today, just a casual hit with one of the university students, he has some good shots but is a little inconsistent and a lot weaker than I am. I decided to glue one of the 802-40s on and have a feel of that. I chose the 2mm. First impressions are very good; Compared to Spectol 1.7-1.9mm.....

- heavier (and I liked the feel of the bat with a few extra grams)
- a little faster
- a lot spinnier
- nicer for hitting, punching, blocking (especially fast blocks)
- less "effect"
- nearer to inverted than Spectol
- Seems to chop pretty well
- not forgetting, far cheaper than Spectol!


I can understand why reviews say that this is the easiest transition from inverted to SP. Early days but I liked my first impressions and will give it a try against more testing opposition.

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Timo Boll ALC ST
FH Tibhar Evolution MX-P Max
BH Tibhar Evolution FX-S 1.8
185g

A couple of weeks since my last update, nothing hugely exciting (but please read on!).

First ever league match with the poly ball, albeit a friendly 2 man team summer league format. Won as expected, but it did emphasise the need to be positive. Anything touched short but too high hung about and got killed.

Equipment wise I have been alternating between 1.8mm spectol and 802-40. 802 a harder feel and probably LESS spinny in my opinion.....802-40 easier to play with so still evaluating.

On FH have given Rakza X a go. I'm neither impressed or disappointed. I find it a bit quicker than 9 and so suited to the poly ball, but some spin is lost. I will review in due course but still making my mind up......

I am pleased to have been offered a sheet of Victas V15 extra to review via this forum...... looking forward to testing. ChrisBuers father uses Victas on FH and in is very spinny.......

Finally I have entered a VETTS (UK veterans' body) tournament in mid-July. Basically it is a one-day round robin in groups of 8 with your nearest ranked competitors. Should lead to some good games. One day tourney, better half coming with me and we'll go for a stroll around Bosworth Castle and battlefields on the second day.

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Timo Boll ALC ST
FH Tibhar Evolution MX-P Max
BH Tibhar Evolution FX-S 1.8
185g

Practice has hotted up somewhat after a slightly barren spell; 4 consecutive days now. Today was a session that virtually brought me to my knees - 2+ hours of practice and practice matches (vs LP (initials, not rubber!)) the student in my early video. Now his exams have finished he has more time to play and we are discovering that we are very evenly matched. Today we had a lot of extreme points where I wished the video was running. I [finally] prevailed 3-2 in five best of fives, 13-11 in the 5th including saving a match point !! Unfortunately he will be returning home to France next week so we will have a last game on Friday, likely followed by a beer or two. He will study elsewhere next year.

I am also reaching conclusions about the equipment I will use next year. Having tried a sheet of Rakza X I have concluded that I prefer 9. X is faster, 9 is spinnier, other than that they are very similar, and 9 is sufficiently fast. I will keep X on a spare blade. On the pimple front, I am gravitating back to standard Spectol. 802/40 is nice, but hard with less feel and effect (despite the SuperSoft sponge descriptive). Spectol speed also nice but I don't feel as in-control as with standard. 563 is funky and fun, I will keep it on a spare but am not really ready for the world of medium (or longer) pimples yet.

Technique wise I have noticed a tendency to drop my wrist on backhand, if that makes sense, so the tip of the bat points downwards before I roll a ball. This limits power at the very least. I worked hard today to keep my forearm, wrist, hand and bat parallel to the table with better results. Something to watch for!

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Timo Boll ALC ST
FH Tibhar Evolution MX-P Max
BH Tibhar Evolution FX-S 1.8
185g

I see you're using TSP Spectol 21 Offensive sponge which I've used on FH in 2.1mm. What I find to be better is TSP Super Spinpips 21.

The Spectol 21 I find a little quick for the type of game I am currently playing, which isn't all out offence. For my purposes and style I am finding standard Spectol better in that the extra control and short-game spin more than compensates for any loss of pace. This is on my backhand, if I wanted pips for forehand I'd likely agree with you. SuperSpinPips appeals to me too, but I'd likely try the 'normal' version for the same reasons.

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Timo Boll ALC ST
FH Tibhar Evolution MX-P Max
BH Tibhar Evolution FX-S 1.8
185g

First update for a couple of weeks. Must do better.

So what has happened? Firstly happy / sad times as my regular work practice partner finished his studies and has now headed back to France. We had an extended final session where he played out of his skin and beat me in every practice game for the first time ever. Being competitive to the last I hope we get a chance to rematch but should we not, it has been a pleasure.

Much as it is great to see the students come and go, it does leave me for the first time in a number of years with facilities at work but no practice partners . Maybe it is time to bring in a few boxes of balls and spend a few lunchtimes developing some killer serves. Several lunchtimes a week are now occupied however, as I have joined the new "state of the art" gym that we have in the Uni and am working hard on fitness.

I have played alongside and against a few forum members in the last few weeks; alongside andrewh13 in a 2-man summer league match and then with another teammate against ChrisBuer and his father. We won 5-0 but Chris and I had our usual tough, 5-setter with me going 2-1 down (11-3 in 3rd) before recovering. Style wise I haven't worked out how to play him yet and should have lost really!

Equipment wise my summer experiments are coming to an end. I shall retain my Xiom blades (that was never in doubt) and the pimples of choice will be regular Spectol. I have been using the 1.7-1.9 sheets, but have an itch to try the 1.4-1.7 variant. I shall do a Spectol review shortly, now that I have a greater understanding of SP. On forehand I am relatively happy with Rakza (either 9 or X) but the test sheet of Victas V>15 extra is also a tempting proposition that I will continue to test.

[short/med] Pimples tried since March and on the reject list....
563 1.8mm
DHS 652 1.8mm
802-40 1.8mm and 2.0 mm
Spectol speed sponge
Dr Neubauer Killer 1.5mm

Focus now is on a UK VETTS tournament 11-July, a roundrobin vs the 7 players nationally ranked nearest to you from the entrants. Should be good.

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Timo Boll ALC ST
FH Tibhar Evolution MX-P Max
BH Tibhar Evolution FX-S 1.8
185g

Very interesting. Looks like we're developing a very similar style.


Yep, as the weeks have passed I've found myself into attacking with SP FH, but confusing by twiddling, to invite a weak return that I can attack.



Very similar, although my blade is pretty fast, it has lovely control and a huge sweet spot. I get plenty of reversal.

Thanks for the video!

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Yasaka Sweden Classic | 802 OX | C8 OX
Check out my blog - LordCope's Latest Learning Log - 10+ years of accumulate mistakes!

A bumper update today!

Firstly on the equipment front I have decided that I really like the Victas V15>extra max that I have reviewed for this forum, and will continue to use it. There is a lesson in it for me, as when I first hit with it I found it a bit, well, average. Personally I think I needed to allow a little time to adjust to the qualities of the sheet and to make sure it is 'broken-in' properly. Although in my experience this is more a factor with chinese rubbers, it does affect others and I put this one in that category.

Using the Victas caused me a minor problem as I had no black s.pips that I liked, having tried DHS 652 and Dr Neubauer Killer. Both I found lacking in spin when chopping among other properties I didn't like. The Dr N impression was reinforced when I played a defender using it at the weekend; more about that shortly. I am not saying that these are 'bad' pips, just not for me, probably because I am transitioning from inverted. I ordered some regular black spectol (in a thinner, 1.4-1.7 sponge) to complete the setup. Ordered from TTNPP at midnight on Thursday (1st July), arrived on Tuesday (6th) to me in the UK. Overseas postal times seem to have improved exponentially of late!.

After a casual knock on Tuesday I played a summer league match on the Thursday. We are one of the two teams in contention for the top spot, so our opponents had their strongest team out. We lost 5-4, I won one of my two singles and one of my two doubles. My loss in 5 was against a player who I have seen ranked as high as 85 in the country, an offensive player with good serves and strong loops on both wings. I win maybe 30% of my matches with him so a loss in 5 isn't the worst, but I started the 5th too poorly...... probably being too passive. My win (in 3) against D was somewhat of a surprise as I had never beaten him in many attempts, despite going close. He is a modern defender just turned veteran and after a great season and several local titles last year has quickly risen to about 170 in the national veteran rankings. He will go higher. In fairness to him it was only his 2nd time with the poly ball and the venue was a bit smaller than he would choose (although it is a home venue and he has beaten me there before). The victas gave really goodbcontrol for the loop 1,2 push game required.

This win gave me a lot of confidence going in to the weekend tournament, which I will write up later today.

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Timo Boll ALC ST
FH Tibhar Evolution MX-P Max
BH Tibhar Evolution FX-S 1.8
185g

What's the name of the defender, devo?

Do you think you were tense in the 5th because of the equipment change? Even slight variations cause me problems when I'm not relaxed, which in turn can increase my nervousness.

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My blog: "Learning to play: as a modern defender": http://ooakforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=58&t=22254
My YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCtazeX ... oICGS9bqNg
Join the OOAK Discord!: https://discord.gg/Yw2hYUdz3g

[Other gear I've used]
Blades: Butterfly Defence 3, Butterfly Defence Pro, Butterfly Innerforce ZLC, Butterfly Innershield, DHS Power G7, Stiga Offensive Classic Carbon
SPs: Friendship 802 (1.5), TSP Spectol (1.3, 1.8, 2.1), TSP Spectol Speed (1.3), TSP Super Spinpips Chop Sponge 2 (0.5, 1.3)
LPs: Butterfly Feint Long II (1), Butterfly Feint Long III (0.5, 1.3), Tibhar Grass D.TecS (OX), TSP Curl P1-R (0.5, 1, 1.3), TSP Curl P4 (1.3)

I'll pm you the name Dunc, I don't believe it is fair to name directly on open forum (although of course those close to the league could probably work it out).

You may have a point about the equipment change, although I would say more that I didn't quite have the feel of the kit rather than suffered nerves. I tend to play a little more defensively when games are tight. Sometimes it works, and sometimes........not.

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Timo Boll ALC ST
FH Tibhar Evolution MX-P Max
BH Tibhar Evolution FX-S 1.8
185g

So, onto the weekend and the annual VETTS (www.vetts.org.uk) ratings tournament. VETTS is the body for veteran (O-40) table tennis in the UK. The theory of the ratings tournament is not one that has an overall winner, rather you are put into a 7/8 man/woman roundrobin with the players nearest to you in the national rankings. For the men this meant 14 groups. I was rated 6th in group 5 of 14 (275 rank) in an 8 man group with rankings ranging from best 225 to lowest 283. In theory therefore I was expected to lose 5 games and win 2.

 

The venue was a large Leisure centre hall in Hinckley, Leicestershire. about 20 tables, venue excellent apart from being very hot and no natural ventilation. XSF balls were in use, which was great for me having decided these were the best available and been using them solidly for over a month. For some players they were a new brand, and others had little poly experience. These are transitional times!

 

My group was varied, which is a great feature of veteran's table tennis. We had [at least] two 'superveterans', one of which a chopper (tenergy FH/Feint BH) and the other a defender who would also hit, especially BH (Dr Neubauer Killer FH/Tenergy BH). There was a SP/LP player (Blowfish FH and LKT 'something' BH) who was primarily a hitter. Two x 2-winged loopers (unsurprisingly the youngest players in the group!). There was a very unconventional player (inverted/sp) with some wicked under the table lob spins as a party piece! Finally there was a left handed attacker with a lethal forehand (Focus snipe on FH).

 

As a group we has to play 28 games I believe. We started at 9am and finished at 6.30, using two tables in the latter stages. All in all a tiring day, both physically and mentally, as you play 7 and umpire 7, whilst inbetween sitting in a hot hall. I got through 4 shirts and an unbelievable amount of water.

 

First up I had to play the left hander. Scores etc. escape me, but I won 3-1. I learned very quickly not to allow him to get comfortable on his forehand, as the ball he could generate was absolutely unreturnable. Fortunately his serves were quite straightforward and I was able to pin him in his weak corner and then attack any loose balls. This worked well and also he struggled with some of my serves. As the day progressed he seemed to improve immensely and I was glad to have played him first - luck of the tournament draw, I guess.

 

Second was the double-pip player. Having seen the first round of matches by now, this was the game I had most concerns about, especially as I am never comfortable against SP hitters and he had won comfortably against one of the 2-wing loopers. The game was a real 'swings and roundabouts' affair. I won a very close first end, then lost the second after going hugely behind (9-3?), getting back to 9-10 and missing a 'gimme' hit. Aargh! The 3rd proved decisive,as from 9-5 up we were 9-9 on his serve. First I caught him out him with a float from my pips that he over-hit and then with the luxury of 10-9 ran around his long, down the line service to my backhand and hit a serve return winner. I found some serves and strategies to close the game out easily. We had very big runs of points in the game, which in part was due to his unconventional style and me trying different tactics to beat him and then him adapting to them!

 

Game 3 was against the top-ranked group player, who was the chopper (tenergy FH/Feint BH). Having seen him play I didn't understand his (relatively) high ranking, as that game was defender vs defender and a bit scrappy. I didn't have a great deal of difficulty and won in 3, as his was a style I am very comfortable with (as he drops off the table and didn't attack, I can cover the table with my FH and pick shots). Very noticeable how the slightly lesser spin of the poly makes a difference in these games too, as I rarely had to push anything once I got looping, and anything up was killed.

Game 4 was vs a 2 winger, 2nd ranked in the group. This was surprisingly scrappy with lots of mistakes on both sides. I found it difficult to get my timing as I was being 'slow looped' a lot. I decided to sit back a little and let him come at me. This worked and out of all my opponents he was the one who struggled against my Spectol blocks, netting them more often than not!

So at this stage I am 4-0 and the only undefeated player in my group, having played the top 3 seeds. I still feel pretty fresh having only dropped 2 ends, and thoughts of winning the group cross my mind. Now there are several things I have been working on of late. Fitness is one and this is working well and those somewhat boring gym sessions are paying off. Technique is another and apart from a tendency to 'revert to type' (ie defend the backhand side) this is going well. The final thing is concentration / complacency. So I have made a big effort to start games well, play one point at a time and take nothing/nobody for granted. I keep telling myself to stay focussed....

Game 5 was vs the unconventional player. Another 3 end win and no great difficulties, although I have to admit that a couple of his spinny lobs had me swinging at fresh air and laughing somewhat!.

Game 6 was vs the other defender, a very mature if nimble chap who I suspected would not trouble me too much if I kept him away from the table, and my suspicions were confirmed with a 3 end win.

Finally I played the other conventional 2 winged looper, ranked 7 in the group. He gave me what I would describe as a tough but comfortable 3 end win, if that makes sense? I.e. never too many points between you but always feeling you were going to win, especially with the confidence of 6 straight wins in the lead up.

Tournament over, and from an initial target of 50% wins vs peers I have gone into a group as underdog and won 7/7 dropping only 2 ends. This will boost both my rating and my confidence, especially as the defender I beat on Thursday won the group above me!

The gym has helped my fitness, and my setup is working well, both the spectol and the Victas. Things feel good at the moment.

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Timo Boll ALC ST
FH Tibhar Evolution MX-P Max
BH Tibhar Evolution FX-S 1.8
185g

Was the SP/LP player from Nd by any chance, initials of JW? He's one of my regular opponents in our local league. Good player, awkward! I'm on a 2:2 ratio with him.

Also, was the unorthodox "wiggly shot" player an older guy with glasses? If so I've seen him playing in VETTS doubles. He's awesome to watch lol, he can spin the ball either way off the wiggly. Shame he doesn't have quite the same finesse in other strokes though...

_________________
My blog: "Learning to play: as a modern defender": http://ooakforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=58&t=22254
My YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCtazeX ... oICGS9bqNg
Join the OOAK Discord!: https://discord.gg/Yw2hYUdz3g

[Other gear I've used]
Blades: Butterfly Defence 3, Butterfly Defence Pro, Butterfly Innerforce ZLC, Butterfly Innershield, DHS Power G7, Stiga Offensive Classic Carbon
SPs: Friendship 802 (1.5), TSP Spectol (1.3, 1.8, 2.1), TSP Spectol Speed (1.3), TSP Super Spinpips Chop Sponge 2 (0.5, 1.3)
LPs: Butterfly Feint Long II (1), Butterfly Feint Long III (0.5, 1.3), Tibhar Grass D.TecS (OX), TSP Curl P1-R (0.5, 1, 1.3), TSP Curl P4 (1.3)