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PostPosted: 19 Dec 2018, 01:41 
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FruitLoop wrote:
BRS wrote:
There is a lot of variation between individual blades of the same model, and the data would be a lot more accurate with many more readings, or the year of the blade. But it's useful as a general guide to classes of blade. I won't be buying a Schlager Carbon any time soon. Or any zlc blade. Likewise I don't need to try any more five-ply woods. Or an inner carbon construction, tempting as that sounds, it isn't doing anything more than all wood.


What about 7 ply? It's interesting that Harimoto and Ma Long at least, use inner carbon type blades.

Brett, you say the hardness of the outer ply is the key factor, what about the flex/stiffness of the blade? Is this not as important?


The ball is too light to flex the wood.

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PostPosted: 19 Dec 2018, 02:13 
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Brett is the voice of reason about all of this EJ stuff! The ESN Slippage does happen to me sometimes on my backhand. I had someone tell me it was slipping off the rubber before. I think going a bit softer helps and the R47 generation (5th? 6th?) tends to do it less.

I personally like the Timo Boll line of blades for the handle. It just fits my hand in a way that I like. I would be very happy to find a cheaper blade with the same handle. For $8 bucks I am going to see what the handle is like on that blade, at worst case I'll donate it to work :D


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PostPosted: 19 Dec 2018, 02:16 
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fastmover wrote:
There are some mysteries about H3 I can't explain. For example, several times I tried the regular 20$ H3 and it felt like a total piece of junk, too slow no matter how much I boosted it. Then a friend of mine gave me something like this: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/DHS-Ori ... 34108.html. This rubber feels like a gun when boosted, the speed is definitely on par with T05 and ESN stuff. With regards to brushing, I feel like I have to brush everything: backspin, regular topspin, heavy topspin, even fishing shots (which I hate). If I don't brush, the ball flies off randomly. I don't know how it works, but the balls flies off fast when the contact is right. Blocking with it sucks, there is no feeling for the ball whatsoever. But this is my 1500-level impression, so don't take it too seriously, it is likely irrelevant as I am pretty sure I am doing something wrong :D


It's perfectly fine to state your opinion and talk about personal experience. Doing so may lead to you learning something new or perhaps enlightening others. Your rating or whatever isn't that relevant and I'm taking your comments seriously.

A couple of nights ago, I told a 2500 player to stop using H3. I told him his forehand is completely wrong for the rubber. It took about 2 minutes before he pulled out a racket with T05 on the forehand and started challenging friends. I doubt he'll ever use the H3 rubber again because he told me that he had already worked this out. I just pushed him over the edge.

About a year ago, I advised a 12 year old to use H3 and he is still using it.

So what's my deal? I'm telling one player not to use H3, whilst I'm telling others to use it. Do I like the rubber or not?

The 2500 player is backhand oriented and struggles to find the time and position to use his body correctly on the forehand. He tends to block a bit and he makes thick contacts when he loops against block. The 12 year old is forehand oriented and he uses a straight arm loop with excellent body work. He is fast enough to counterspin all forehands, so he rarely blocks.

The 2500 plays more like a European and the 12 year old plays more like a Chinese.

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PostPosted: 19 Dec 2018, 02:24 
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wilkinru wrote:
Brett is the voice of reason about all of this EJ stuff! The ESN Slippage does happen to me sometimes on my backhand. I had someone tell me it was slipping off the rubber before. I think going a bit softer helps and the R47 generation (5th? 6th?) tends to do it less.

I personally like the Timo Boll line of blades for the handle. It just fits my hand in a way that I like. I would be very happy to find a cheaper blade with the same handle. For $8 bucks I am going to see what the handle is like on that blade, at worst case I'll donate it to work :D


It's not $8 bucks..it's $7.69!

You can put the 31 cents saving towards this one, whilst you have your credit card out https://revspin.net/blade/huaruite-clipper.html

I actually used this one for a while until someone demanded I give it to them. It is a "correct blade".

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PostPosted: 19 Dec 2018, 02:37 
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FruitLoop wrote:
BRS wrote:
There is a lot of variation between individual blades of the same model, and the data would be a lot more accurate with many more readings, or the year of the blade. But it's useful as a general guide to classes of blade. I won't be buying a Schlager Carbon any time soon. Or any zlc blade. Likewise I don't need to try any more five-ply woods. Or an inner carbon construction, tempting as that sounds, it isn't doing anything more than all wood.


What about 7 ply? It's interesting that Harimoto and Ma Long at least, use inner carbon type blades.

Brett, you say the hardness of the outer ply is the key factor, what about the flex/stiffness of the blade? Is this not as important?


My P700s are 7-ply, and I'm quite happy with them. If the sheer Mima Ito-ness of the Acoustic Carbon doesn't blow me away I'll go back to them when I resell it.

ML and Harimoto do many things I would be wise not to attempt. Using inner carbon blades is the least of it.

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PostPosted: 19 Dec 2018, 02:42 
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BRS wrote:
fastmover wrote:
... H3 requires a very thin brushing contact to execute a loop.


I always read this about H3, that you have to brush. But then I also read that it requires a very powerful swing to engage the hard sponge.

How does the ball dig into the sponge if the contact is so brushy? Is the brush for looping backspin, and the other for counterlooping?

It didn't take many hits with borrowed H3 for me to realize the only thing it would do for me is end ny career with a shoulder injury. But I'm curious about the apparent contradiction in how it's meant to be used. The youngish Chinese guys I mostly see with H3 don't seem to be doing much brushing to me. From what I can tell as their fhs rocket past me, they are knocking the hell out of the ball, no matter if it comes to them with backspin or topspin.


Watching Ma Long execute one of those fast "loops", he doesn't seem to brush much either. In fact he contacts the ball pretty hard, and seems to be more interested in the speed rather than the spin.

Iskandar


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PostPosted: 19 Dec 2018, 02:47 
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I love how EJing has made this thread the most busy it's ever been in it's life time.


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PostPosted: 19 Dec 2018, 02:53 
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BRS wrote:
FruitLoop wrote:
BRS wrote:
There is a lot of variation between individual blades of the same model, and the data would be a lot more accurate with many more readings, or the year of the blade. But it's useful as a general guide to classes of blade. I won't be buying a Schlager Carbon any time soon. Or any zlc blade. Likewise I don't need to try any more five-ply woods. Or an inner carbon construction, tempting as that sounds, it isn't doing anything more than all wood.


What about 7 ply? It's interesting that Harimoto and Ma Long at least, use inner carbon type blades.

Brett, you say the hardness of the outer ply is the key factor, what about the flex/stiffness of the blade? Is this not as important?


My P700s are 7-ply, and I'm quite happy with them. If the sheer Mima Ito-ness of the Acoustic Carbon doesn't blow me away I'll go back to them when I resell it.

ML and Harimoto do many things I would be wise not to attempt. Using inner carbon blades is the least of it.


I'll just add this - I don't know what the all the top players use and neither does anyone else on forums. I know a few things because I attend tournaments and I've coached against highly rated players. I also hear a lot of stuff from friends who play internationally. This is clearly not the place for me to be telling stories.

Okay, Henzell used a microwave to remove the handles from a Boll Spirit and put on other handles for obvious reasons. That wasn't even the start of it for him. Now use your imagination to think about what really happens out there.

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PostPosted: 19 Dec 2018, 03:05 
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wilkinru wrote:
I love how EJing has made this thread the most busy it's ever been in it's life time.


Let's face it this is an EJ forum not a table tennis forum :D

I have enjoyed Brett's candidness here. Not something we get too often.

I seem to remember reading William was going to switch to Xiom Vega Pro rubbers but eventually he decided to stick with tenergy due to the slippage problems mentioned. The Boll Spirit with Yasaka Ma Lin Carbon handles? :lol: Fan zhendong uses a Viscaria with Stiga handles, this is basically fact at this point.

I don't understand why it's such a thing in table tennis to hide everything about pros equipment. It's not the case in golf.


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PostPosted: 19 Dec 2018, 03:05 
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Brett Clarke wrote:
This is clearly not the place for me to be telling stories.

But... please, Brett, please! ;)


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PostPosted: 19 Dec 2018, 03:16 
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Brett Clarke wrote:
It's not $8 bucks..it's $7.69!

You can put the 31 cents saving towards this one, whilst you have your credit card out https://revspin.net/blade/huaruite-clipper.html

I actually used this one for a while until someone demanded I give it to them. It is a "correct blade".


I HAD one of those, I gave it away. Can't remember exactly why, maybe it was too heavy. And now Eacheng's quit selling a lot of HRT blades including this one.

Looking at that list of blades on ttbla.de, I find the Stiga Allround Classic is 1092 and the Sanwei M8 (which I use) is 1287. Hmmm... But then the HRT Clipper is 1412, and the Viscaria is 1452. The LKT Toxic 3 (which is supposed to be dead slow) is 1094 (the same as the Stiga Allround Classic). Hmmm..

Iskandar


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PostPosted: 19 Dec 2018, 03:23 
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wilkinru wrote:
I love how EJing has made this thread the most busy it's ever been in it's life time.


This thread is approaching 400K views. I feel that if I mention just one more blade, I can get a quick 8K to get us there by sunset in the US. If I mention a top player who doesn't use what you think he uses, I can get us to half a million.

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PostPosted: 19 Dec 2018, 03:27 
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iskandar taib wrote:
Brett Clarke wrote:
It's not $8 bucks..it's $7.69!

You can put the 31 cents saving towards this one, whilst you have your credit card out https://revspin.net/blade/huaruite-clipper.html

I actually used this one for a while until someone demanded I give it to them. It is a "correct blade".


I HAD one of those, I gave it away. Can't remember exactly why, maybe it was too heavy. And now Eacheng's quit selling a lot of HRT blades including this one.

Looking at that list of blades on ttbla.de, I find the Stiga Allround Classic is 1092 and the Sanwei M8 (which I use) is 1287. Hmmm... But then the HRT Clipper is 1412, and the Viscaria is 1452. The LKT Toxic 3 (which is supposed to be dead slow) is 1094 (the same as the Stiga Allround Classic). Hmmm..

Iskandar


I'm sure it's a competitive field, but my money's on Iskandar for biggest EJ on OOAk :clap: :clap: :clap:

I've actually met Iskandar in Thailand and he's a super nice guy too!

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PostPosted: 19 Dec 2018, 11:17 
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Brett Clarke wrote:
fastmover wrote:
There are some mysteries about H3 I can't explain. For example, several times I tried the regular 20$ H3 and it felt like a total piece of junk, too slow no matter how much I boosted it. Then a friend of mine gave me something like this: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/DHS-Ori ... 34108.html. This rubber feels like a gun when boosted, the speed is definitely on par with T05 and ESN stuff. With regards to brushing, I feel like I have to brush everything: backspin, regular topspin, heavy topspin, even fishing shots (which I hate). If I don't brush, the ball flies off randomly. I don't know how it works, but the balls flies off fast when the contact is right. Blocking with it sucks, there is no feeling for the ball whatsoever. But this is my 1500-level impression, so don't take it too seriously, it is likely irrelevant as I am pretty sure I am doing something wrong :D


It's perfectly fine to state your opinion and talk about personal experience. Doing so may lead to you learning something new or perhaps enlightening others. Your rating or whatever isn't that relevant and I'm taking your comments seriously.

A couple of nights ago, I told a 2500 player to stop using H3. I told him his forehand is completely wrong for the rubber. It took about 2 minutes before he pulled out a racket with T05 on the forehand and started challenging friends. I doubt he'll ever use the H3 rubber again because he told me that he had already worked this out. I just pushed him over the edge.

About a year ago, I advised a 12 year old to use H3 and he is still using it.

So what's my deal? I'm telling one player not to use H3, whilst I'm telling others to use it. Do I like the rubber or not?

The 2500 player is backhand oriented and struggles to find the time and position to use his body correctly on the forehand. He tends to block a bit and he makes thick contacts when he loops against block. The 12 year old is forehand oriented and he uses a straight arm loop with excellent body work. He is fast enough to counterspin all forehands, so he rarely blocks.

The 2500 plays more like a European and the 12 year old plays more like a Chinese.


I see. But why is it so awkward against higher balls? It was the first thing I noticed about the rubber: in the very first practice match I made a lot of mistakes against fishing shots and lobs that I normally did not do.

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PostPosted: 19 Dec 2018, 11:24 
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fastmover wrote:
I see. But why is it so awkward against higher balls? It was the first thing I noticed about the rubber: in the very first practice match I made a lot of mistakes against fishing shots and lobs that I normally did not do.


I do notice the Chinese tend to flip the bat around when attacking lobs.. There's usually Tenergy on the other side. People say it's because you get more energy out of the Tenergy, but maybe it's not? :lol:

Iskandar


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