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PostPosted: 21 Aug 2017, 22:48 
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Brett Clarke wrote:
LTT79 and DTT13 are now avialable on ttEDGE.com

LTT79 is my most significant video. If you try the move and aren't sure, Platinum Members can send me a quick video and I'll let them know. There will be lots of videos about all the different shots and the relevance of the hips.

DTT13 is a good drill for improving your backhand play in a match.


LTT79 is another great video, although imo your LTT45/60 are = or > because lots of people have decent fhs with poor technique, but almost nobody has very spinny serves with bad technique.

At the camp I just went to one coach told me I had good hip rotation except I was driving my arm forward from the chest/shoulder and my hips were trailing, so they added nothing to the shot. I don't know if anyone else is dumb enough to make that mistake.

I only time the hip rotation correctly when I do the small steps on every fh, like William's TE34-36. But I haven't integrated that into matchplay, only drills. I've only been working on it for one year, so maybe it will show up later.

I ordered one of the spinny ball things. Do you set it up on the side of the table with no net just to make the video angle easier? Is there any reason for us not to clamp it to an end of the table like a real ball would be played? Stupid question I guess but I see you've done that twice now.


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PostPosted: 22 Aug 2017, 00:01 
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BRS wrote:
Brett Clarke wrote:
LTT79 and DTT13 are now avialable on ttEDGE.com

LTT79 is my most significant video. If you try the move and aren't sure, Platinum Members can send me a quick video and I'll let them know. There will be lots of videos about all the different shots and the relevance of the hips.

DTT13 is a good drill for improving your backhand play in a match.


LTT79 is another great video, although imo your LTT45/60 are = or > because lots of people have decent fhs with poor technique, but almost nobody has very spinny serves with bad technique.

At the camp I just went to one coach told me I had good hip rotation except I was driving my arm forward from the chest/shoulder and my hips were trailing, so they added nothing to the shot. I don't know if anyone else is dumb enough to make that mistake.

I only time the hip rotation correctly when I do the small steps on every fh, like William's TE34-36. But I haven't integrated that into matchplay, only drills. I've only been working on it for one year, so maybe it will show up later.

I ordered one of the spinny ball things. Do you set it up on the side of the table with no net just to make the video angle easier? Is there any reason for us not to clamp it to an end of the table like a real ball would be played? Stupid question I guess but I see you've done that twice now.


The spin device only fits where the net goes on most tables. It just doesn't open very wide unfortunately. I use the device a lot when trying to teach people shots as it's somewhere between shadow play and training on the table. I've seen instant results with numerous players.

LTT79 is the start of a lot of interesting videos.

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PostPosted: 22 Aug 2017, 00:25 
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LTT79 definitely pinpoints the hip as what you need to focus on to achieve the whip on the forehand consistently. However, I'm not convinced this approach is always applicable to the forehand in a match situation and I'll try to explain why.

When you move to reach a ball, you are already engaging your hips because you need to turn them in order to move your legs. Let's say you're moving to a ball on your forehand using semi-cross footwork. You should start your swing as your left foot moves across, and you should complete your stroke as your right foot hits the ground. The problem is, you can't load your right foot in order to engage the hip while it is in the air. You need to wait for your right foot to hit the ground, but you should have already completed the stroke by this stage. I guess you could engage the hip as your shoulder turns but this will probably impede your movement.

My gut feeling is that generally speaking, engaging the lower body in order to generate fast racket head speed isn't viable in table tennis because the game is far too fast. I will persevere with it for a while though because Brett is convinced this is the way to go as far as having good forehand mechanics goes.


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PostPosted: 22 Aug 2017, 02:08 
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goodtechnique wrote:

My gut feeling is that generally speaking, engaging the lower body in order to generate fast racket head speed isn't viable in table tennis because the game is far too fast. I will persevere with it for a while though because Brett is convinced this is the way to go as far as having good forehand mechanics goes.



When a loop is blocked and comes back to you...yeah speed is the key then. I'm too slow and need to find a faster second shot myself. For many many shots this loop will be fantastic and I think it's possible to do it very quickly as you get stronger. I predict some sore legs coming for many TTedge members.


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PostPosted: 22 Aug 2017, 02:56 
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goodtechnique wrote:
LTT79 definitely pinpoints the hip as what you need to focus on to achieve the whip on the forehand consistently. However, I'm not convinced this approach is always applicable to the forehand in a match situation and I'll try to explain why.

When you move to reach a ball, you are already engaging your hips because you need to turn them in order to move your legs. Let's say you're moving to a ball on your forehand using semi-cross footwork. You should start your swing as your left foot moves across, and you should complete your stroke as your right foot hits the ground. The problem is, you can't load your right foot in order to engage the hip while it is in the air. You need to wait for your right foot to hit the ground, but you should have already completed the stroke by this stage. I guess you could engage the hip as your shoulder turns but this will probably impede your movement.

My gut feeling is that generally speaking, engaging the lower body in order to generate fast racket head speed isn't viable in table tennis because the game is far too fast. I will persevere with it for a while though because Brett is convinced this is the way to go as far as having good forehand mechanics goes.


I guess it is a "form follows function" situation. If you have no time, play whatever possible. If there is time, then why not create more power when it is available.


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PostPosted: 22 Aug 2017, 07:14 
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goodtechnique wrote:
LTT79 definitely pinpoints the hip as what you need to focus on to achieve the whip on the forehand consistently. However, I'm not convinced this approach is always applicable to the forehand in a match situation and I'll try to explain why.

When you move to reach a ball, you are already engaging your hips because you need to turn them in order to move your legs. Let's say you're moving to a ball on your forehand using semi-cross footwork. You should start your swing as your left foot moves across, and you should complete your stroke as your right foot hits the ground. The problem is, you can't load your right foot in order to engage the hip while it is in the air. You need to wait for your right foot to hit the ground, but you should have already completed the stroke by this stage. I guess you could engage the hip as your shoulder turns but this will probably impede your movement.

My gut feeling is that generally speaking, engaging the lower body in order to generate fast racket head speed isn't viable in table tennis because the game is far too fast. I will persevere with it for a while though because Brett is convinced this is the way to go as far as having good forehand mechanics goes.


I strongly suggest you try for a few weeks and then send me a video of what you are doing.

When using semi cross footwork, you load everything from your right leg as you are initially pushing off.

Watch LTT79 and then watch the entire video below. Stop watching the arm...there is no arm!!!


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PostPosted: 22 Aug 2017, 07:19 
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fastmover wrote:
goodtechnique wrote:
LTT79 definitely pinpoints the hip as what you need to focus on to achieve the whip on the forehand consistently. However, I'm not convinced this approach is always applicable to the forehand in a match situation and I'll try to explain why.

When you move to reach a ball, you are already engaging your hips because you need to turn them in order to move your legs. Let's say you're moving to a ball on your forehand using semi-cross footwork. You should start your swing as your left foot moves across, and you should complete your stroke as your right foot hits the ground. The problem is, you can't load your right foot in order to engage the hip while it is in the air. You need to wait for your right foot to hit the ground, but you should have already completed the stroke by this stage. I guess you could engage the hip as your shoulder turns but this will probably impede your movement.

My gut feeling is that generally speaking, engaging the lower body in order to generate fast racket head speed isn't viable in table tennis because the game is far too fast. I will persevere with it for a while though because Brett is convinced this is the way to go as far as having good forehand mechanics goes.


I guess it is a "form follows function" situation. If you have no time, play whatever possible. If there is time, then why not create more power when it is available.


It's normally possible for your hip to move 1/4 of an inch in the right direction and it's especially good when it moves ultra fast. Imagine what you can't see with the naked eye. It's not good when your hip moves the wrong way though. Form follows function.

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PostPosted: 22 Aug 2017, 08:05 
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Could you comment a little on where our weight should be during the leg work practice? Does it transfer much? I tend to rely on my right leg a ton and would like to balance things out a little.

I can't believe I'm going to start breaking down my forehand again.


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PostPosted: 22 Aug 2017, 08:16 
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wilkinru wrote:
Could you comment a little on where our weight should be during the leg work practice? Does it transfer much? I tend to rely on my right leg a ton and would like to balance things out a little.

I can't believe I'm going to start breaking down my forehand again.


There is a lot of weight on the right leg during the backswing, then push hard to spin your hip forward. Nothing else matters much. Send me a quick video if you want. Your backhand is correct, so there's a good chance your forehand is too. If it's a good shot, it will be correct.

Learning is what makes the game fun. When I stop learning, I get really bored.

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PostPosted: 22 Aug 2017, 09:00 
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Don't worry. I wouldn't play this game if it was easy. I'm accepting that it's all about hard work and practice.


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PostPosted: 22 Aug 2017, 09:07 
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BRS wrote:

I ordered one of the spinny ball things. Do you set it up on the side of the table with no net just to make the video angle easier? Is there any reason for us not to clamp it to an end of the table like a real ball would be played? Stupid question I guess but I see you've done that twice now.


Found this one...

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Huieson ... 5294&tpp=1

Seems to be a wider clamp. I'm on the fence for this product. I might buy one for when I do start coaching.


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PostPosted: 22 Aug 2017, 09:22 
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wilkinru wrote:
BRS wrote:

I ordered one of the spinny ball things. Do you set it up on the side of the table with no net just to make the video angle easier? Is there any reason for us not to clamp it to an end of the table like a real ball would be played? Stupid question I guess but I see you've done that twice now.


Found this one...

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Huieson ... 5294&tpp=1

Seems to be a wider clamp. I'm on the fence for this product. I might buy one for when I do start coaching.


I bought 6 of them. I'm probably not on the fence.

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PostPosted: 22 Aug 2017, 13:13 
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Brett Clarke wrote:
wilkinru wrote:
BRS wrote:

I ordered one of the spinny ball things. Do you set it up on the side of the table with no net just to make the video angle easier? Is there any reason for us not to clamp it to an end of the table like a real ball would be played? Stupid question I guess but I see you've done that twice now.


Found this one...

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Huieson ... 5294&tpp=1

Seems to be a wider clamp. I'm on the fence for this product. I might buy one for when I do start coaching.


I bought 6 of them. I'm probably not on the fence.



I was on a fence until I saw Brett's post/video. Ordered a couple (pretty sure one will break at some point...)

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PostPosted: 22 Aug 2017, 16:41 
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Yeah, hip extensions (as my friend Matt likes to call them) are the key to high level table tennis. For some reason I find them far more natural on my backhand than on my forehand. IT sucks that my damaged knees limit my ability to use them flexibly.

The spin device is a good thing - even if you just build a bad facsimile yourself like I did years ago buy putting a wire through a ball, it can help. I have seen people mock it, but there is more than one way to skin a cat. The players I know with the spinniest strokes at my club used something like it at on time or another.

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Last edited by NextLevel on 22 Aug 2017, 17:09, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: 22 Aug 2017, 17:07 
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pgpg wrote:
NextLevel wrote:
A premature but expected congrats to Big D who should be breaking 2000 at some point this week after some spectacular performances at the NJTTC giant round robin today. Big D had heavy spin saying "who below 2000 plays a shot like that?!?!" Forum members who know Big D and have played him as well as those who have seen me lose to him for the better part of 2 years know that Big D was just procrastinating as usual.

Congrats again. And if this is truly premature, there is always September... lol.


Jinxed it ;( There is always next tournament, though.


Fixed.

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