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 Post subject: Doubles rules
PostPosted: 29 Oct 2018, 19:53 
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Hello! This looks like a great community, and on my behalf, welcome. We have a little club and are having problems finding the rules on doubles. Doesn’t seem to be specific info on the net like one would think. Here are some questions:

1) when a team gets the serve, do they have to announce the server first? I know they can let the other team pick serve if they want, and then the receiving team picks who will receive first? We squabble around and it takes forever to get started on this note.
2) server serves to receiver, and then receiver becomes the server after two serves: the previous seeving team switches and the former server’s partner is the receiver.
3) Here is a big one: in game 2, the receiving team becomes the serving team, but which of them serves? If a and b play c and d, and a serves to c in game one, does c serve to a automatically in game 2? Seems like it is very confusing. Also, how does the rotation to start serving go if there are games 3,4 and 5.

It is a real mess, and it needs to be corrected.
If anyone can help, we would really appreciate it! Excelsior! Lou


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 Post subject: Doubles rules
PostPosted: 29 Oct 2018, 21:58 
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In my experience:

Game 1: servers decide who will serve. Receivers decide who will receive.
Game 2: Game 1 starting receivers now serve and decide who will serve. Receiver must be opposite to game 1.

And so it goes until the last possible game when a team reaches 5 points players swap ends and receivers also swap over.

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 Post subject: Re: Doubles rules
PostPosted: 29 Oct 2018, 22:15 
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ITTF site was never well structured for locating specific reference info. You can search, if you know the exact name of the item you want...

ITTF Handbook 2018

1) Rule 2.13.4 does not indicate whether the receiving pair has the right to know server before deciding receiver. However, it dictates rotation of who receives from whom, set by set and in the middle of a deciding set. The rule only requires that both pairs make a choice before play commences. My interpretation is that each pair must decide who will start, independently of knowledge of the other pair's decision. Making a fuss about this is just silly, but then again, some people are...
2) Not a question. You just quoted rule 2.13.5.
3) In each set, the serving pair decides who will serve first. The order of receiving should be reversed compared to preceding set. Rule 2.13.4 again.

IOW, exactly like Dusty054 describes.


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 Post subject: Re: Doubles rules
PostPosted: 30 Oct 2018, 06:36 
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That helps a ton, thank you! That is much more clear than anything I’ve found on the Net. Let’s say, a and b start off playing x and y (I just want to make sure I’m clear on this). A decides to serve to y in game one. In game two, x decides to serve, so he must serve to b to start the game. If y had decided to serve first, then b would start receiving at the start of the second game. Sorry if this is incorrect, just want to make sure we have this right.


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 Post subject: Re: Doubles rules
PostPosted: 30 Oct 2018, 07:26 
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Johnwaynejr wrote:
Let’s say, a and b start off playing x and y (I just want to make sure I’m clear on this). A decides to serve to y in game one. In game two, x decides to serve, so he must serve to b to start the game.


a doesn't get to decide who he serves to when starting game 1, but nevertheless the game 2 combination is correct.

Johnwaynejr wrote:
If y had decided to serve first, then b would start receiving at the start of the second game. Sorry if this is incorrect, just want to make sure we have this right.


No if y had decided to serve first (and lets say he served to a) then a or b start serving in the second game. a to y or b to x.

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 Post subject: Re: Doubles rules
PostPosted: 31 Oct 2018, 01:58 
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Dusty054 wrote:
In my experience:

Game 1: servers decide who will serve. Receivers decide who will receive.
Game 2: Game 1 starting receivers now serve and decide who will serve. Receiver must be opposite to game 1.

And so it goes until the last possible game when a team reaches 5 points players swap ends and receivers also swap over.


So, the player that served first in game 1, will not be the reciever in game 2, his/her partner will be? Or, does the first person that served become the automatic reciever in game 2?


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 Post subject: Re: Doubles rules
PostPosted: 31 Oct 2018, 02:22 
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Dusty054 wrote:
Johnwaynejr wrote:
Let’s say, a and b start off playing x and y (I just want to make sure I’m clear on this). A decides to serve to y in game one. In game two, x decides to serve, so he must serve to b to start the game.


a doesn't get to decide who he serves to when starting game 1, but nevertheless the game 2 combination is correct.

Johnwaynejr wrote:
If y had decided to serve first, then b would start receiving at the start of the second game. Sorry if this is incorrect, just want to make sure we have this right.


No if y had decided to serve first (and lets say he served to a) then a or b start serving in the second game. a to y or b to x.


*So, if Y decided to serve in game 3, he would serve to A.


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 Post subject: Re: Doubles rules
PostPosted: 31 Oct 2018, 05:11 
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Let me run through an example to see if I have this:
X and Y are playing A and B in doubles.
Game 1) X and Y get the serve. X decides to serve first, and B decides to receive first.
Game 2) Y decides to serve first, so he will serve to A.
Game 3) A decides to serve first, so he will serve to Y.
Game 4) X decides to serve first, so he will serve to B.
Game 5) A decides to serve first, so he will serve to Y. B is serving to X, and the team A/B score 5 points-the teams switch sides, and then Y serves to A (change in servers).

Thanks again for all your help. We have playing incorrectly, with house rules. Excelsior! Lou


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 Post subject: Re: Doubles rules
PostPosted: 31 Oct 2018, 06:46 
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Let me run through an example to see if I have this:
X and Y are playing A and B in doubles.
Game 1) X and Y get the serve. X decides to serve first, and B decides to receive first.
X decides to serve first then B decides to receive first.

Game 2) Y decides to serve first, so he will serve to A.
Y cannot serve first. A or B will serve first, then Y or X respectively will receive first.

Game 3) A decides to serve first, so he will serve to Y.
X or Y will serve first. B or A respectively will receive first.

Game 4) X decides to serve first, so he will serve to B.
A or B will serve first. Then Y or X respectively will receive first

Game 5) A decides to serve first, so he will serve to Y. B is serving to X, and the team A/B score 5 points-the teams switch sides, and then Y serves to A (change in servers).
X or Y will serve first. B or A respectively will receive first. When either team gets to 5 points the teams switch sides and whoever was to originally serve next will serve next and the partner of whoever was to originally receive next will receive next.

HTH.

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 Post subject: Re: Doubles rules
PostPosted: 31 Oct 2018, 06:47 
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Johnwaynejr wrote:
Dusty054 wrote:
In my experience:

Game 1: servers decide who will serve. Receivers decide who will receive.
Game 2: Game 1 starting receivers now serve and decide who will serve. Receiver must be opposite to game 1.

And so it goes until the last possible game when a team reaches 5 points players swap ends and receivers also swap over.


So, the player that served first in game 1, will not be the reciever in game 2, his/her partner will be? Or, does the first person that served become the automatic reciever in game 2?


He may or may not be the receiver. The team that is serving decides which player will serve. The receiver must be the reverse/opposite of the previous game.

That's really all you need to remember.

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 Post subject: Re: Doubles rules
PostPosted: 31 Oct 2018, 12:42 
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Dusty054 wrote:
Johnwaynejr wrote:
Dusty054 wrote:
In my experience:

Game 1: servers decide who will serve. Receivers decide who will receive.
Game 2: Game 1 starting receivers now serve and decide who will serve. Receiver must be opposite to game 1.

And so it goes until the last possible game when a team reaches 5 points players swap ends and receivers also swap over.


So, the player that served first in game 1, will not be the reciever in game 2, his/her partner will be? Or, does the first person that served become the automatic reciever in game 2?


He may or may not be the receiver. The team that is serving decides which player will serve. The receiver must be the reverse/opposite of the previous game.

That's really all you need to remember.


I think I get it, sorry, I’m a little dyslexic with stuff like this. So, if the same player that received first in game 1 decides to to serve first in game 2, then he cannot serve to the player who served first to him in game 1, he must serve first to his partner (whom would be the receiver now in the first rally of game 2).


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 Post subject: Re: Doubles rules
PostPosted: 31 Oct 2018, 13:31 
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Johnwaynejr wrote:
I think I get it, sorry, I’m a little dyslexic with stuff like this. So, if the same player that received first in game 1 decides to to serve first in game 2, then he cannot serve to the player who served first to him in game 1, he must serve first to his partner (whom would be the receiver now in the first rally of game 2).


lol...you're doing my head in mate!

If y was receiving from a in game 1, that means he was serving to b. So he must serve to a in game 2.

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 Post subject: Re: Doubles rules
PostPosted: 31 Oct 2018, 14:04 
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Maybe this will help?


Attachments:
serve.jpg
serve.jpg [ 47.08 KiB | Viewed 261 times ]

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 Post subject: Re: Doubles rules
PostPosted: 31 Oct 2018, 22:16 
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Dusty054 wrote:
Maybe this will help?


That helps a lot, thanks again for your patience. We have been told wrong by some folks over the last few weeks, which hasn't helped :(
So, based on this, if x and y had started the serve in the first game, and x decided to serve first (y chooses to receive for the other team)...then in game 2, Y chooses to serve first, so X would have to receive. If I have this down, I get it.


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 Post subject: Re: Doubles rules
PostPosted: 01 Nov 2018, 07:31 
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Johnwaynejr wrote:
Dusty054 wrote:
Maybe this will help?


That helps a lot, thanks again for your patience. We have been told wrong by some folks over the last few weeks, which hasn't helped :(
So, based on this, if x and y had started the serve in the first game, and x decided to serve first (y chooses to receive for the other team)...then in game 2, Y chooses to serve first, so X would have to receive. If I have this down, I get it.


Would you mind asking that question again but keep x and y on the same team as in my example.

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