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PostPosted: 21 May 2019, 23:34 
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I switched from inverted (used to loop on both FH and BH) sometime in March. I mainly chop from long to mid distance using Dtecs 0.5mm with the occasional FH loop (maybe 3-4 points per set).

One thing that I've got a hard time to get out of my system is to counter loops with my BH (LP) side when I'm a bit too close to the table. Most goes long but when it actually lands it's most of the time a winner as it seems to create a hell of a lot of back spin. I'm a bit unsure what I'm doing as it happens automatically using muscle memory but I guess that it's something in between a BH loop and a BH topspin drive.

I know that this stroke is completely possible as we have a younger defender in our club who does this quite often with Metal TT Death. He's level is way above mine (he recently made it to R16 of the Swedish U13 nationals) but it would be great to be able to pull this off in a more controlled manner.

Does anyone have any pointers when it comes to bat angle and when to time the stroke (top of the bounce?)? Any videos demonstrating this would be amazing.


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PostPosted: 22 May 2019, 03:39 
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I suspect one thing that would help would be to use a very slow sponge (or one of those absorber sheets) under the LP. The shot has a lot of backspin on it, backspin causes the ball to rise (or at least, float) and if you hit it back too fast it's going to float off the end of the table. Maybe using a slower stroke, or a loose grip might help? I thought this was the basis behind those frictionless LP blocking techniques.

Iskandar


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PostPosted: 22 May 2019, 04:53 
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I know absolutely nothing about push blocking techniques but a slow LP is a no go for me. I've tried FL3 and the attacks are so slow that the ball almost stops in the air.

The kid I mentioned does this stroke (which basically is a counter loop) with OX LP.


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PostPosted: 22 May 2019, 14:12 
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There is no reason why an LP -- even an OX LP -- can't do a BH topspin drive. I do them all the time. The required stroke is flatter than with inverted rubber, with a bit of blade closure at the very end. And it requires a grippy LP so your Grass Dtecs probably isn't a good choice. But grippy LPs like 755, Talon, and Troublemaker can do this stroke with ease.. it just takes practice. And believing that it's possible!


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PostPosted: 22 May 2019, 14:21 
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I don’t know how he does it. If I’m caught in that position with a high incoming top spin and can’t move quick enough to attack it with my FH I will chop block with an almost vertical stroke hoping to return it just above net height with a fair amount of back spin. If I tried to drive it, it would likely float back high and long.

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PostPosted: 22 May 2019, 22:53 
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nathanso wrote:
There is no reason why an LP -- even an OX LP -- can't do a BH topspin drive. I do them all the time. The required stroke is flatter than with inverted rubber, with a bit of blade closure at the very end. And it requires a grippy LP so your Grass Dtecs probably isn't a good choice. But grippy LPs like 755, Talon, and Troublemaker can do this stroke with ease.. it just takes practice. And believing that it's possible!


When you use this stroke against topspin with a grippy LP are you returning with no spin/light top spin or are you still getting a bit of reversal and thus back spin like with DTecs. I am experimenting with transitioning to LP from MP so as to be able to chop when on the back foot, but still want to use attacking MP strokes when possible. I am currently using Dtecs red 1.2mm but wonder if I should be using a grippier but still fast LP.


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PostPosted: 22 May 2019, 23:44 
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ChasFox wrote:
nathanso wrote:
There is no reason why an LP -- even an OX LP -- can't do a BH topspin drive. I do them all the time. The required stroke is flatter than with inverted rubber, with a bit of blade closure at the very end. And it requires a grippy LP so your Grass Dtecs probably isn't a good choice. But grippy LPs like 755, Talon, and Troublemaker can do this stroke with ease.. it just takes practice. And believing that it's possible!


When you use this stroke against topspin with a grippy LP are you returning with no spin/light top spin or are you still getting a bit of reversal and thus back spin like with DTecs. I am experimenting with transitioning to LP from MP so as to be able to chop when on the back foot, but still want to use attacking MP strokes when possible. I am currently using Dtecs red 1.2mm but wonder if I should be using a grippier but still fast LP.


Just out of curiosity: What is an MP stroke? Flat hit/punch like you would do with SP?

Slightly out of topic but I think that I will try Metal TT Death after the last tournament which is this coming weekend. The kid in our club uses it and most people in the thread here on the forum seem quite positive about it.


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PostPosted: 22 May 2019, 23:59 
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@mart1nandersson
Carl Prean used to punch with long pips pretty effectively (Juic Leggy and one of the Feint Long's earlier too).
Ai Fukuhara used Mid Pips (one of the Armstrong Attack variations) before switching to Spectol, and she punched even harder with some knuckle effect left too.
What is the kid's name you mention? Curious if we can see his shots on Youtube.


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PostPosted: 23 May 2019, 00:29 
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univesse wrote:
@mart1nandersson
Carl Prean used to punch with long pips pretty effectively (Juic Leggy and one of the Feint Long's earlier too).
Ai Fukuhara used Mid Pips (one of the Armstrong Attack variations) before switching to Spectol, and she punched even harder with some knuckle effect left too.
What is the kid's name you mention? Curious if we can see his shots on Youtube.


Thanks. Punching is completely doable with Dtecs.

I don't believe that there's any footage on Youtube as we're quite strict on what we post without permission in this country. I'll PM his name so you can do your own digging.


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PostPosted: 23 May 2019, 00:30 
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ChasFox wrote:
nathanso wrote:
There is no reason why an LP -- even an OX LP -- can't do a BH topspin drive. I do them all the time. The required stroke is flatter than with inverted rubber, with a bit of blade closure at the very end. And it requires a grippy LP so your Grass Dtecs probably isn't a good choice. But grippy LPs like 755, Talon, and Troublemaker can do this stroke with ease.. it just takes practice. And believing that it's possible!


When you use this stroke against topspin with a grippy LP are you returning with no spin/light top spin or are you still getting a bit of reversal and thus back spin like with DTecs. I am experimenting with transitioning to LP from MP so as to be able to chop when on the back foot, but still want to use attacking MP strokes when possible. I am currently using Dtecs red 1.2mm but wonder if I should be using a grippier but still fast LP.
I get very light topspin. Lesser-skilled opponents typically put the ball right into the net, thinking that the ball has stronger topspin. By flattening my stroke even more and deleting the late stroke closure, I can vary the spin to produce a near-dead ball. Opponents who were having no problem returning my light topspin then net the near-dead ball unless they're paying very close attention.


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PostPosted: 23 May 2019, 02:05 
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Thanks Nathanso. Sounds like what you can get with an MP rubber but perhaps slower and more controlled.

Is that with troublemaker? Ox or sponge?


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PostPosted: 24 May 2019, 03:49 
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ChasFox wrote:
Thanks Nathanso. Sounds like what you can get with an MP rubber but perhaps slower and more controlled.

Is that with troublemaker? Ox or sponge?
I'm currently using Troublemaker OX but the BH topspin drive stroke works with most grippy LPs, OX or sponge. In fact, it's easier with sponged LPs but I prefer OX for the greater versatility it provides.


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PostPosted: 27 May 2019, 05:53 
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Watch this GeblockTT video to see the BH topspin stroke using OX LP: https://youtu.be/SOxdFkKrwVQ


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