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PostPosted: 22 Jul 2016, 07:48 
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Just switched to LP on bh and I'm having trouble countering drives with hits. What is stroke for hitting with LPs? I've been keeping my paddle open and doing a short forward stroke. Usually goes over and closing more just drops into the net if the ball I'm countering has only light top spin.

Any thoughts?

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PostPosted: 22 Jul 2016, 08:57 
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This is the weakness of lp. You can't hit with power against your opponents power.

If they loop against you and it is a high quality loop (long low and skinny) block it off the bounce while turning your wrist forward (similar to how you would hit the ball just slower and more forward). It won't be a fast ball but it will be off rythym allowing you to turn and use your forehand or get back into the rally.

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PostPosted: 22 Jul 2016, 10:17 
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Ironically I'm having more problems with lower level player who just hit and don't loop. With consistent loopers as do as you say.

When someone hits a hard low ball (little to no spin) to my LPs can I just try to return like I would with inverted and just try to adjust angle or should I be doing a different stroke altogether?

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PostPosted: 22 Jul 2016, 11:54 
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You are right, if the shot is too low to attack back the shot should be a block (not a chop block) and you should just adjust the angle and worry more about your return being consistent as opposed to it being a kill. Also try to make sure the ball you are giving them is long enough so that they can't make this shot often and they must play with spin. It is hard with long pips no matter your level.


....or you could back up and chop.

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PostPosted: 24 Jul 2016, 14:46 
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In my very non expert opinion I think there are a couple things happening. 1, blade / rubber combo. 2, getting used to a new style and rubber.

In regard to 1. 755 is a pretty fast pip. Straight forward but fast. The stiga clipper is fast blade (for pips, especially in ox). Maybe .5 sponge might help, or a slower pip, or a both... Maybe a cheap all speed blade to test LP pushblock on easier than the clipper. I would be careful, do some research of what will be best. Some people are very good with faster pips and fast blades (TTEvangelist and his set up). To me they don't allow much leeway. Correct strokes at the right time and angle, no allowance for anything slightly off. this makes it hard as you are learning shake hand and LP.

Which brings us to number two. I've only been using LP about 3 years. But it takes time to learn the limitations and abilities (I still am), and not only the basic strokes and variations, but the feel of the ball on the pips. Be patient. Realize SH needs a different angle than PH and that LP and inverted do too. That's why I think many people were amazed at your trying to change both.

As a non pro goof that has only played with LP three years, these are some thoughts of what you might want to do. These are things I do that I've gathered from the forum and watching players some might be right some not. Who knows.

Low top spin/ low height- do what leatherback says. Off the bounce. Allow the ball to touch the open blade and curl the wrist forward, the top of the blade coming forward, the ball should roll off the end/top of the blade. This is where a slower pip might help, it allows you to tell the ball is touching the rubber and gives that millisecond more to react and feel how to stroke the ball. This is how I perform this shot, if I'm teaching it wrong feel free to correct. Or do a passive block.

On low topspin/ moderate to high height. Any ball, roughly around between my chin and chest in hieght, I like to punch, probably to my detriment. Key to punching in said situation was described in another thread is a one inch punch. Load up your power, have a solid stance behind the ball, adjust paddle angle according to height and distance from the net and pop the ball. It's not a smack, or slam. Try to eliminate follow through, make it count in that one inch. You may have to pull back once the contact is made to stop the follow through. This probably goes against what you are used to, But it's effective (like most LP strokes are best most times as opposite to what your opponent hit to you. I.e. Chop block top spin, rolling backspin etc.). P

Low backspin / low hieght - rolls and punches are good but I like to side swipe. I think I play the same people too many times, they know what to do against those shots and want a low topspin back to attack. Side swipes still confuse them. On really low ones I'll open the paddle a bit and lift it a little. As for how I do a sideswipe, I start the motion typically opposite of their sidespin, if any, and once I feel th ball touch I continue the motion with the same speed and moderate follow through, and sometimes I yank or speed up the side swipe motion once I feel the ball touch depending on how I feel.

Low backspin/ high hieght - a good slam is nice. I saw this from coach macafee's drills on YouTube. I highly recommend. Similar to a punch, but with a slight forward and upper motion with some follow through. I think with a slightly more closed bat.

Most of this is pretty much second nature, though I'm sure I included something that isn't right or bad terminology and welcome anyone to correct or clarify anything, it can only help me.

You can also passively block stuff, but it seemed like you wanted to hit with the LP.
I recommend looking at coach macafee's LP drills on YouTube. They are gold.

Big things to take home:

Limit or even eliminate follow through depending on stroke. (Not a hard, fast rule)

Most LP on wood, except balsa, is pretty linear, use that to your advantage when hitting... (And knowing how open or closed the paddle needs be).

Use opposite strokes to your opponents spin. (Though changing it up and also twiddling will keep them guessing)

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PostPosted: 24 Jul 2016, 15:20 
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Wow thanks so much for the advice. I am having to do a lot of adjusting switching from penhold and to LPs on bh. I just think in the long run it'll pay off. I know two different high level coaches that teach this style. One was ok with me staying ph but personally I just felt it was too exotic and would require twiddling all the time. Now I'm adjusting to shake hand forehand but feel like I'm making some progress.

Fast blade/ fast rubber dilemma: I don't want to start EJing already. I feel my set up is doable as I am using 0.6 sponge on my LPs. Side swipe shots are working well for any underspin ball. Getting the hang of returning looped balls. I saw a Greg Letts video on chop blocking (? not sure if you call it that) hard drives. I'm going to practice this week and update the board.

Thanks again for all your help.

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PostPosted: 25 Jul 2016, 01:38 
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gus_goose wrote:
Ironically I'm having more problems with lower level player who just hit and don't loop. With consistent loopers as do as you say.

When someone hits a hard low ball (little to no spin) to my LPs can I just try to return like I would with inverted and just try to adjust angle or should I be doing a different stroke altogether?


LB always has great advice on what techniques and strategies you have available. I just add another option while stressing his main point.

If you are at the table and you get an incoming fast drive little spin, you could also loosen your grip pressure at impact. The better players do this almost without thought - they just think what ball they want to give back and adjust accordingly. Players do not see grip pressure, it is an invisible force.

Loosen it enough to give the ball back as far and as low as you can keep it on the table with consistency. You lose the point right away if you go for too much and miss then it wasn't worth it, so as LB clearly articulated, priority number one is survival in the point. Stay in the point is above all number one right there.

IF you can manage to slow down the pace, change the spin, keep it low, keep it deep, place it well, that's great. Priority number two is to give it back so they do not have an easy chance to finish the point with high percentage.

Another evil option is to give back a ball that looks easy and tempt the opponent into going for a low percentage shot. Slowing it down suddenly with grip pressure, placing it well, but a little high (maybe deep at his body or to high and deep to his BH corner) can make their eyes get big and go for the wrong ball.

Whatever you decide to do, staying alive is priority number one, the rest is gravy. The quality of your return and the options you can effectively use will get better as your level gets better.

Just that one shot of loosening up grip and keeping it on table (but the you slowed the ball down and warped time - even if it isn't short, just slowing it down suddenly and low is great) just that one shot has saved the bacon of a number of players in tight spots like you described.

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PostPosted: 25 Jul 2016, 07:37 
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Thanks everyone. I guess I'm just going for too much here in the beginning and should just stick to the basic. Since I never played against a long pips player, I guess I didn't realize how even a weak ball is deadly when coming from long pips.

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