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 Post subject: Loops going long
PostPosted: 27 May 2014, 10:38 
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003 Style Master
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This is a similar thread to another here but thought I'd start fresh.

When I do higher slow loops I can land them but when going for a bit more power they often go long or ones that do land, they are a lot more flatter, not clearing the net by a lot. What I'm trying to achieve is a higher faster loop that clears the net by say 20-30cm then lands. Seems that when I really try to loop hard its quick enough but not much margin for error due to flatness, when I relax and don't try hit it hard, the loop is there along with the height but really slow which for better players is easy to attack.

Could it be that my 2.2mm Jupiter is too fast which is part of the problem, maybe a slower rubber or thinner sponge might help. Or is it purely technique ie slow arm speed by incorrect weight transfer along with wrong racket angle.

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 Post subject: Re: Loops going long
PostPosted: 28 May 2014, 09:32 
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High loops tends to be slower. I do experience this but instead of looping, I would impart side spin on the ball which is faster and has a curving effect. Is it a hard chop you are trying to loop?

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 Post subject: Re: Loops going long
PostPosted: 28 May 2014, 10:08 
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I find one thing that works well for me is to start your backswing lower. When you do that you force yourself to have to brush more and not hit flat.

I think equipment does make a difference, but it's usually 95% technique.

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 Post subject: Re: Loops going long
PostPosted: 28 May 2014, 12:37 
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It's hard to pinpoint the exact cause without any visual aid. From your descriptions, it's possible your impact is not right. You need a rather thick grazing contact for a fast loop.

One way to gauge if your contact is right is, for those shots that didn't clear the net, did the ball roll up against the net? Like the one below.


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 Post subject: Re: Loops going long
PostPosted: 28 May 2014, 13:08 
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I'll try get a video at some stage.

I'm not confident at looping hard chop, may be a little backspin but not lots.

Starting lower sounds like something to try.

I'm not sure about the rolling into the net, more often long than into the net.

Pity about not being an equipment thing, the EJ inside of my was hoping for a response like " I think you'd do a lot better with a .....er sponge in x.xxmm, something like ......." :?:

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 Post subject: Re: Loops going long
PostPosted: 29 May 2014, 07:33 
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Rambo Looper Spin First Ask Questions Later
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Take a vid and see at what height you are impacting the ball.

If you want to make a heavy, slow loop, you can get away with hitting the ball as it falls, even below table height.

Making a fast loop from such a low position is asking for trouble. One should make the impact of the ball while it is higher, at LEAST table height, the higher, the better, Shoot for between table and net height minimum. If you impact the ball in position, on balance, and in your strike zone at such a height, you should see an immediate increase in your landing percentages for the fast or medium loop.

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 Post subject: Re: Loops going long
PostPosted: 29 May 2014, 11:51 
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Last night I'd lost all confidence. I didnt' notice at the time but looking back, although I thought I didn't do much wrong in my defeats, and the opponent was on fire, I now realise that I played too safe. Should have initiated the attack more rather than just chopping back a lot of forehands. My games were close all the way so I guess I didn't want to risk missing at the time. Oh well, back to the practice table.

Really changes the game when you are in control and making the play, so its something I definately want to work on.

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 Post subject: Re: Loops going long
PostPosted: 29 May 2014, 12:42 
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Cobalt. You just noticed something great. You can't work out a loop if you don't loop. If you want to work on a shot and you are at the club play so to bring out that shot as many times as possible. Who cares if you win or lose. Eventually that shot will start to work and people will think of you as the guy who can't miss a loop.

Yes take a video for you to see what you are doing. Yes if the loop is going long the timing you took the loop at is important as well as you probably need to close the face.

There is also a distinction between brush looping and a powerful loop drive. The loop drive engages the sponge more. At that point the softness of the sponge will affect the ball. A super soft sponge that is too thin will allow the ball to hit the wood and bottom out the loop resulting in nets.

Lots to think about but point is go for that loop. Make it your best shot. Put fear in the opponents heart and make him or her think "will this guy miss?"

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 Post subject: Re: Loops going long
PostPosted: 29 May 2014, 15:12 
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For me, weight transfer and going forward from right to left foot -- as opposed to leaning slightly back or even too much side to side is the key difference on whether a loop lands on the table or goes long. I have a habit of leaning back just a slight bit.

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 Post subject: Re: Loops going long
PostPosted: 30 May 2014, 08:18 
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josesiem wrote:
For me, weight transfer and going forward from right to left foot -- as opposed to leaning slightly back or even too much side to side is the key difference on whether a loop lands on the table or goes long. I have a habit of leaning back just a slight bit.


Very good point. I often have the bad habit of falling back when I loop. The result is that consistency suffers and it also makes the loop slower.
When you get a good brushing action AND you use your body to hit the ball with weight transfer, you can generate a tight arc with good speed.

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 Post subject: Re: Loops going long
PostPosted: 31 May 2014, 18:46 
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I've been trying to brush loop every forehand which I think this low margin for error is losing me confidence and also making me have a bad stroke as I'm too worried about missing the ball. For tomorrow's practice I'm going to try a bit more of a flatter hit with a little more ball contact,. Is this still a loop? What is a loop drive?

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 Post subject: Re: Loops going long
PostPosted: 02 Jun 2014, 07:13 
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Loopdrive is a fast loop where the swing is forward and there is solid contact with the ball. The shot has a lot of pace and more spin than a drive.

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 Post subject: Re: Loops going long
PostPosted: 13 Jun 2014, 12:01 
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I've posted videos in the video section if you would like to provide feedback I'd appreciate it.

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 Post subject: Re: Loops going long
PostPosted: 13 Jun 2014, 12:31 
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I commented on the other thread re your FH counterhit. In relation to your loop I would suggest that you are actually not looping at all. Really all you do is roll your arm over the ball and follow through well under your eyes. Without wishing to be mean, the technique you use is nothing like a loop technique. Closely study the clips below and then do shadow swings in front of a mirror until you have grooved the technique reasonably well.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BpVAPPzj3ZI

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4hMn3JdmesA

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fS6Z0I-A3dw

In particular focus on:

- following through somewhere around above your right eye. NEVER under your eyes!
- get in position very early so that you can swing upwards and forwards through the shot: transferring your weight from left leg to right as you do so, and turning your torso and shoulders.
- dont let the ball go behind you and drop. For now at least hit the ball at the top of the bounce.


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 Post subject: Re: Loops going long
PostPosted: 13 Jun 2014, 13:12 
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Cobalt, very difficult to learn a loop in that garage you play in - hardly any space to move, or even transfer your weight. Can the table be moved so at least one side has more space?

I agree with carbonman - what you are doing is not a loop - it is a roll/ low lob. Need to be more agressive, more "driving" in the shot...

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