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Serves
https://ooakforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=79&t=24039		 Page 1 of 2
Author:  hookshot [ 11 Aug 2007, 13:59 ]
Post subject:  Serves
1) How many different serves do most of you have???
2) How many of these serves can you do top, side and chop with the same stroke??? (combined with side to some degree)
3) How many of you only think of the serve you are doing???
4) How many think the two serves are related??? (first affects the second serve results)
5) How many spend serious time on serve practice???
:D :D :D
Author:  Hobbes [ 11 Aug 2007, 14:13 ]
Post subject: 
1. Counting my new one (see my Globe 889 review), seven that I'll use with any regularity
2. I have one group of four and a second group two that use nearly identical motions until the last second. The last one is independent of the rest.
3. Huh?
4. I almost always use two different serves in the same group consecutively and the second tends to be more effective than the first. Literally 99% of the time, I won't do the same serve twice in a row.
5. I practice for a good 15 to 20 minutes each session on only my serves and another 40 minutes on serve followed by third ball attack.
Author:  hookshot [ 11 Aug 2007, 14:47 ]
Post subject: 
Sorry Hobbes,
On #3, I meant "how many just think about the serve they are doing and don't link it in any way to the first or visa versa. :D
My second serve is always influenced by what he did with the first serve.
Author:  Silver [ 11 Aug 2007, 16:48 ]
Post subject:  Re: Serves
1) How many different serves do most of you have?

5, not counting the angle variations of the blade

2) How many of these serves can you do top, side and chop with the same stroke??? (combined with side to some degree)

3

3) How many of you only think of the serve you are doing???

My serve depends on what happened the last time I did it.

4) How many think the two serves are related??? (first affects the second serve results)

Yep, especially vs lower class players.

5) How many spend serious time on serve practice???

I used to do maybe 1 hr a week. Now a lot less.
Author:  haggisv [ 11 Aug 2007, 19:53 ]
Post subject: 
1) 6 - I'd rather focus on developing further variations to a small number of serves, than having a wide variety. Seems to work for me as my serve is the strongest part of my game.

2) 4 - the others are flat serves, trying to vary spin on them defeats the purpuse.

3/4) Serves always depend on previous returns... when my brain is working

5) not enough.... used to do it a few hours a week... not more like 1/2 hour if I think of it....
Author:  priior [ 11 Aug 2007, 21:52 ]
Post subject: 
1/2)
pendulum: chop, side, top, flat, corkscrew (and variation in between)
backhand: chop, side, top, flat, corkscrew
rev.pendulum: chop, side,flat, slight corkscrew (working on topspin!)

i don't bother with tomahawks. i try and put those serves mostly short or even better "almost long" anywhere on the table (but i have most trouble with regular pendulum parallel to the forehand serves - especially the flat bomb.. it's not fast enough - yet!)

i also dont bother serving from FH side... except sometimes for a BH topspin serve.. but ive been burnt too many times!

3/4)
i try to serve both serve using the same "family" (backhand or forehand) the first serve's response always influences the second serve. (like if it gets killed;)) (or more realistically, if the person loops the chop and doesnt go thru and is making himself little gestures on how to loop a little higher, the next serve could possibly be a flat or top)

5) not enough
Author:  hookshot [ 11 Aug 2007, 23:01 ]
Post subject: 
Priior,
Interesting that you are the only one to mention about people making little practice moves after missing a serve. I watch for that also. Most of my serves I can do more than one spin and if someone makes the first, I will give him the other. (same stroke)
One serve the Seemiller grip lends itself to is the windshield serve, starting below the table for more deception. I can do all side, top, chop or twiddle for no spin on that one. Some of my serves I do change the grip but only on slow type so I have time to change back.
I am heading for the mountains for a few days. When I get back, I will check this thread again. I have lots of serves and will try to describe my favorites. :D
Author:  haggisv [ 11 Aug 2007, 23:54 ]
Post subject: 
Cool, I look forward to that! Always good to learn a new serve.... and you never know, might become your own new weapon...
Author:  Jasper [ 12 Aug 2007, 00:24 ]
Post subject: 
1) Two basically: forehand pendulum and backhand (tomahawk rarely, when all else fails...) Of course these vary in speed, spin (kind of spin + amount of spin) and placement. And I consider reverse pendulum to be only a variation of pendulum, so it's included in the above statement.

2) All, but never with the EXACT same stroke (this would produce the exact same serve...) But I manage to fool my opponent (sometimes)

3) I remember every serve and return during the match and store this information for use during the match and for matches in the future (I wish... :roll: )
I do use them tactically, to exploit weaknesses of the opponent

4) At my current level, opponents don't tend to fall for the 'same serve twice'-routine, with the second being flat or top, they tend to kill those... I try to never serve the same twice in a row, and to keep variation at a maximum.

5) I spend way too little time on them, not over 1/2 an hour a week, but matchplay is also a very good exercise for your serves!
Author:  suds79 [ 21 Aug 2012, 03:21 ]
Post subject:  Re: Serves
1) 4 - Pendulum, Reverse Pendulum, No spin short, Deep/fast Topspin.

2) Some variations but would like more.
Pendulum with my Jpen (I'm left handed) typically has side/chop but can do side/Top.
No spin comes from pendulum motion. Same as fast topspin (much less spinny. a good speed change up)
Reverse Pendulum is only side/chop. I tend to have more errors on this serve. Particularly in doubles where the ball wants to curve out of the correct court.

3)

4) My shot/no spin & fast deep topspin are absolutely related. Just keeps them off balance on the depth & speed of the serve.

5) Probably about an hour a week. Not enough.

Not too long ago I taped my serves from the receivers position. Wow what an eye opener. You could easily read my serves a mile away. Got me to thinking why am I trying to toss it so close to my body then (slightly raising the chance for error) if you can still easily read the spin? I know you can't hide the ball or contact point but still I would like a little more disguise in my serve. Has me thinking about experimenting with a less swinging motion to a more stationary paddle and a last second wrist flick (Pendulum or Reverse Pendulum). Might be a little harder to read but then I sacrifice the amount of spin I can put on the ball.
Author:  THE GAMEr [ 21 Aug 2012, 08:46 ]
Post subject:  Re: Serves
This is a cool thread....REVIVE TIME!!!!!!

1: 6...a pendulum, reverse pendulum, tomahawk (this one's really bad right now....need practice), surprise speed serve, A weird BH serve, and a normal BH serve.
2:both pendulums (normal is better for now), and the weird BH serve (I really have a hard time explaining this serve.
3: I choose a serve depending on reaction to the first one and such....
4:DEFINITELY!!!!!! Hard to argue against this....
5:not me.....unfortunately.....all they do at my club is play games, and I don't have a table.
Author:  Benduo [ 21 Aug 2012, 20:34 ]
Post subject:  Re: Serves
Creativity is the key!!! Making the ball spin on different axes will give you spin that you would have never though could be possible.
The one I use most often is pure backspin, theres not a lot (more to do with the bat angle) but after the 2nd bounce, it bounces again almost immediately, not giving time for a return.
Next is a short sidespin, backspin pendulum serve
Author:  suds79 [ 21 Aug 2012, 23:34 ]
Post subject:  Re: Serves
This thread got me inspired.

Practiced again last night while video taping. (I can't recommend this enough on service practice).

Again was not happy with how easy it is to read my serves. So I began to practice not so much on the serves themselves but on disguising my follow through. Video taped it. Not bad at all. All of a sudden my serves are beginning to look much more similar. Sure if someone is focused you can still read the serve. After all you can't hide the contact. But if I can get just a split second of indecision, that's what I'm going for.

Here's what I do.

After contact I bring my paddle up & out (showing a reverse pendulum/topspin look) on every serve. Why this motion? Because the reverse pendulum serve is the most difficult for me to perform without errors. So to me it makes sense to keep this motion the same and natural as possible.

All my other serves like my pendulum I feel I could do in my sleep. So adding some deceiving action afterwards was not that hard as I thought it would be.

I recommend trying it out... Maybe if I'm brave enough I'll have to post some video on here on how it's going. ;)
Author:  rodderz [ 22 Aug 2012, 16:11 ]
Post subject:  Re: Serves
Quote:
I am heading for the mountains for a few days. When I get back, I will check this thread again

Its exactly 5 years later are you back yet :rofl:
Author:  Der_Echte [ 22 Aug 2012, 22:48 ]
Post subject:  Re: Serves
Watch out rodderz, he might ask you if you feel lucky!
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