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 Post subject: Tibhar Poly Balls
PostPosted: 16 Feb 2016, 01:29 
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I'm wondering if anyone else has experienced play with the Tibhar 3 star poly ball.

My club has bought what seems to be quite a number of these for league use after having used Joola balls for quite some time now. I got a hold of one of these Tibhar balls tonight and my impressions of it are not good. First, it feels light and cheap. It also looks slightly larger than your average 40+ ball, although this could be an illusion of the logo as it is fairly small and only black, compared to Joola having other color in the logo. The ball doesn't seem to spin as much as other poly balls I've used and it was hard to bring down a FH drive onto the table. Oddly enough I seemed to be able to hit better with the pips with it and bring it down onto the table still. I hit with a friend from a higher division and he also struggled to loop hard with it (and this is a lefty with a big hook loop).

Seems we have run out of Joola balls and will be playing competition for some time now with these Tibhar balls. It remains to be seen whether this will be good, bad or indifferent for me as it will depend on how my opponents take to them in comparison to me. I know they dished them out to our A4 grade tonight and I heard a lot of groans about them. I might have to dig out my digital scales and weigh it in comparison to other poly balls, but it definitely felt lighter in the hand to me.

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 Post subject: Re: Tibhar Poly Balls
PostPosted: 16 Feb 2016, 01:49 
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Hey, i need more info about Thibar poly balls, since here in Brasil all the Ofiicial Tournaments will use them.
Just a question, its seamed or seamless ball?
Now thibar have those two options...

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 Post subject: Re: Tibhar Poly Balls
PostPosted: 16 Feb 2016, 13:57 
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The ball I have is a seamed ball Manofan. I ran it and a Nittaku 40+ (SHA) through my robot's ball scale last night and it is fractionally larger than the Nittaku. I still haven't weighed it, but it feels lighter. It also acts lighter in play than all other poly balls I've used.

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S/U 1: Blade: Bty Gergely . FH Black Andro Rasant 2.1 . BH Red Tibhar Grass Dtecs
S/U 2: Blade: Bty Gergely . FH Black Hexer+ 2.1 . BH Red GD Talon
S/U 3: Blade: Bty Gergely . No rubbers...thinking of adding Red Dtecs and Black Rasant
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 Post subject: Re: Tibhar Poly Balls
PostPosted: 21 Feb 2016, 11:43 
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The Nittaku SHA and seamed Tibhar balls should be pretty much the same. Depends a bit on manufacture date. I think that all of the seamed balls made in China are still bad, even ones made in late 2015. There are only two factories.

The Nittaku Premium 40+ thta is made in Japan is a different ball, and much better.

Tibhar also markets a seamless 40+ ball now made by the same people who make XSF.

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 Post subject: Re: Tibhar Poly Balls
PostPosted: 21 Feb 2016, 15:18 
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We played competition with these last Thursday night. I'm glad I'd had a trial of them beforehand, but they played ok. There was sill others complaining about not being able to land loops and smashes with them though. In the end I found it ok and landed severalgood smashes with it and don't recall missing any I shouldn't have. I'm assuming these would have been produced later than the Joola and Nittaku SHA we'd been playing with, given they were bought much later. Whether they are actually the same ball I don't know, but on the guage it was definitely a fraction larger. My club has some JPN Nittaku's, but are only letting the Monday A1 division play with them....funny seeings as we all pay the same to play :punch: :swear:

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I'm always in the dark, but the Dark sheds lights upon everything!! :twisted: Beauty is only pimple deep! Beauty is in the eye of the pipholder!
S/U 1: Blade: Bty Gergely . FH Black Andro Rasant 2.1 . BH Red Tibhar Grass Dtecs
S/U 2: Blade: Bty Gergely . FH Black Hexer+ 2.1 . BH Red GD Talon
S/U 3: Blade: Bty Gergely . No rubbers...thinking of adding Red Dtecs and Black Rasant
Aussie Table Tennis Shop / Aussie Table Tennis Facebook Page / Equipment Review Index / Read my Reb Report Blog: click here.


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 Post subject: Re: Tibhar Poly Balls
PostPosted: 02 Mar 2016, 03:25 
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I am training with the DHS ball , and i hope that it is really close to the Thibar one...

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 Post subject: Re: Tibhar Poly Balls
PostPosted: 29 Mar 2016, 15:19 
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RebornTTEvnglist wrote:
The ball I have is a seamed ball Manofan. I ran it and a Nittaku 40+ (SHA) through my robot's ball scale last night and it is fractionally larger than the Nittaku. I still haven't weighed it, but it feels lighter. It also acts lighter in play than all other poly balls I've used.


Tibhar has both seam plastic ball and seamless ball now. It's easy to tell the difference, on the logo, "SL" stands for seamless.

Personal opinion, go for the seamless Tibhar ball.


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 Post subject: Re: Tibhar Poly Balls
PostPosted: 29 Mar 2016, 16:45 
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That Chiang Mai club where Brett was playing used Tibhar 40+ balls (the old seamed ones). I remember there were a number of broken ones on the railing. I suspect they're the same as the old DHS 40+ balls.

Iskandar


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 Post subject: Re: Tibhar Poly Balls
PostPosted: 30 Mar 2016, 12:49 
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iskandar taib wrote:
That Chiang Mai club where Brett was playing used Tibhar 40+ balls (the old seamed ones). I remember there were a number of broken ones on the railing. I suspect they're the same as the old DHS 40+ balls.

Iskandar



Yes, Tibhar SYNTT is with seam, Tibhar SL is seamless. I just checked the approval list on ITTF, it confuses me. Item "Tibhar SYNTT" has two stamps, one of which says "Germany" and one of which says "made in China". Does it mean, it switches to German manufacturer instead of DHS?


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 Post subject: Re: Tibhar Poly Balls
PostPosted: 30 Mar 2016, 17:03 
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That is strange!

Image

Also bizarre is when you click on the "Made in China" logo to enlarge it, the "GERMANY" logo comes up instead!

Image

Note it doesn't say "Made in Germany", though... Wonder if they might still be made in China!

It was funny - back when you could still buy film, the local Carrefour store carried Carrefour brand film that was "Made in the EU" - they didn't want to put "Made in Italy" because that would tag it as Ferrania film (which the cognoscenti-photogs disliked).

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 Post subject: Re: Tibhar Poly Balls
PostPosted: 30 Mar 2016, 18:30 
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I believe there was an initial trend for distributors to try to hide the origin of balls. Tibhar are a German company, so they just randomly put "Germany" on the ball, but they are, and always have been, Made in China.

I think there has been some "guidance" for the distributors since then and now they can't do this.

Tibhar are a bit naughty for this, and have prior form. Just look at their blatant attempt to mislead customers with their Evolution packaging, which goes to some lengths to try to convince you that some Japanese production is involved. They're not the only ones doing this kind of thing of course.


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 Post subject: Re: Tibhar Poly Balls
PostPosted: 30 Mar 2016, 19:41 
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Interesting. In the current Technical Leaflet T3:

http://ittf.com/stories/pictures/T3_Bal ... 1_2016.pdf

Quote:
C.1 The Stamp
The stamp on the ball must include the following four components:
• The ITTF Approval. This may be indicated by the initials “ITTF” or by "ITTF approved", or by the ITTF
logo.
• the trademark or brand name
• the inscription "Made in", followed by the country of production
• the inscription of either:
“40”, or “40mm” for celluloid balls
“40+” for non-celluloid balls
The stamp on the ball may not include any other components.
If the production process is taking place in more than one country, the reference shall be to the main
step of production. For example,
- if the ball is made of two halves which are produced in country A and put together in country B, the
reference is country A
- if the raw material of the ball is originating from country A and any material processing is done in
country B, then the reference is country B
Any case of doubt shall be brought before the ITTF Equipment Staff and will be decided by the ITTF
case by case.
The same text must appear on all balls of an approved brand. I.e. it is not permitted to put one
country name on some balls and a different one on others with the same brand name. Wrong claims
will be penalized with a fine and can lead to immediate withdrawal of the ITTF approval.
No other text is permitted. The stamp may cover an area no greater than 280mm² described by a
circle or a rectangle with a maximum side length of 25mm circumscribing all letters and symbols. It
may be printed in one or two colours, but the same colour or combination must be used for all balls of
one brand. All inscriptions must be easily readable. The trademark or brand name should be the most
pronounced inscription.
The requirements of Section C.1 do not apply to the secondary stamp for specific events (see A.3).


This puts the kibosh on the "GERMANY" stamp! :lol:

Quote:
C.2 Trademark or Brand Name

The Approval of the ITTF, the country or the expression “made in .....” are not considered to be part of
the trademark or the brand name. The trademark or brand name must be unique and may not be used
for another type of ball, especially not for an unapproved one. All balls with the same trademark or the
same brand name must have the same level of quality.
Also, a celluloid and a non-celluloid ball of the same supplier must not carry the same trademark or
brand name, respectively. If the supplier wishes to brand his celluloid and non-celluloid balls as similar
as possible, the minimum difference accepted is that the term “40+” is added to the brand of a
celluloid ball to define the brand of a non-celluloid ball. For example, “Super Supplier – Mega Brand”
and “Super Supplier – Mega Brand 40+” are an acceptable combination for the brand name.
With a brand name containing “40+”, both requirements no. 2 and 3 of C.1 are considered as fulfilled.
However, the “40+” then cannot just be used on the ball stamp, but must be used everywhere
(packaging, sales channels, advertisements etc).
An ITTF approved ball may loose its approval if the supplier markets another non-ITTF-approved ball
with the same or similar appearance as the ITTF approved one, with which it could be confused.
The ITTF will make its best effort to ensure that the trademark or brand name does not infringe on the
already existing balls brands. The ITTF is not responsible for any illegal use of registered trademarks.
Verifying the correct and legal use of trademarks is not part of the ITTF approval procedure.


OK, this explains why the manufacturers have to give cute extra names to their balls. E.g. the Butterfly G40+, the Tibhar SL, Tibhar SYNTT, etc. And it'd be interesting the compare the "headstamps" of the 3 star balls to the 1 star balls (apparently using the same "trademark or brand name" on both approved and unapproved balls is verboten).

Quote:
C.4 Date Code
All packagings (see A.4), but not the ball itself, must be marked with a date or a date code
corresponding to the date of production (month / year). The date code must be readable without the
need to destroy the packing. As long as the supplier uses his own date code system the supplier must
inform the ITTF Equipment Committee about the date code used and it’s decoding. From January 2004
on a uniform date code system will be used.
The date code consists of 4 characters: the first 2 for the month and the last 2 for the year. Month and
year are encoded using the capital letters from A to I for the numbers 1 to 9 (A = 1; B = 2; etc. up to
I = 9; X = 0).
Examples: a) ABXC means 1203, which is decoded as December 2003.
b) XEAA means 0511, which is decoded as May 2011
This date code system will be mandatory for all ITTF approved ball brands.
Manufacturers are strongly encouraged to clarify the design of the stamp, the packaging and the date
code before production with the ITTF Equipment Committee.
A missing date code is penalized with a fine.


Date codes have been around since 2004??? And all this while I thought they were new. And apparently the new style date codes are now mandatory? Let's see.

OK, my Sanwei balls have "XAAF" (0116) on the flap (wow, fresh out of the oven...). My very expensive Nittaku Premium 40+ has XGAE (0715) on the back of the box. But my iPong seamless 40+, they have a sticker saying "2015.10.10" on the flap. And my Double Fish 3 star 40+?? No code. Looked on both ends, INSIDE the box, on the inside flaps.. nothing. Oh wait.. On the side it says "STANDARD NO" then "Q/SYTY 11-2014" on it. Hmmmmmm.. I wonder if these were pre "material updated.."????

Iskandar


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 Post subject: Re: Tibhar Poly Balls
PostPosted: 31 Mar 2016, 06:24 
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I too have a 3 ball pack of Double Fish 40+ balls and could not find the date code on them. These were bought in HK either late last year or very early this year. Held to be old stock, packaged prior to the latest iteration of T3. I did ask the collective wisdom here in another thread.

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 Post subject: Re: Tibhar Poly Balls
PostPosted: 04 Apr 2016, 17:52 
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The guy who hosts our weekend doubles went out and bought a three-pack of the Double Fish balls. They're actually pretty good - they sound and feel "normal", though we didn't try them back to back with a celluloid ball. Someone managed to step on one, but we haven't managed to break one yet (not that any of us hits the ball that hard..).

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 Post subject: Re: Tibhar Poly Balls
PostPosted: 07 Apr 2016, 17:02 
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iskandar taib wrote:
That is strange!

Image

Also bizarre is when you click on the "Made in China" logo to enlarge it, the "GERMANY" logo comes up instead!

Image

Note it doesn't say "Made in Germany", though... Wonder if they might still be made in China!

It was funny - back when you could still buy film, the local Carrefour store carried Carrefour brand film that was "Made in the EU" - they didn't want to put "Made in Italy" because that would tag it as Ferrania film (which the cognoscenti-photogs disliked).

Iskandar


LOL. You need to zoom the window after you click on the "Made in China" logo....there're two stamps


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