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Stiga blade/rubber question
https://ooakforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=33198		 Page 1 of 3
Author:  uFLock [ 23 Jul 2018, 01:04 ]
Post subject:  Stiga blade/rubber question
Hello,

I have a question which I really hope you will be able to answer, or at least point me into the right direction.

I've recently started playing table tennis at the local club and I really enjoy it.

I have bought a pre-made Stiga Bat (Stiga 5 Star Response) and I think at the moment it is the perfect bat for me. It is super easy to control, it is really predictable and there is almost no catapult effect on it, so it outputs whatever you put in to it, which I believe is perfect for the beginner. The it is also very balanced weight wise for me. The total weight is only 160 gram.

I know how everyone feels about the pre-made bats, but please bare with me.

So after reading countless threads on every table tennis forum, spending weeks of research I decided to build a custom beginners bat. I started by trying to find out any information on my current bat, that I enjoy a lot, to give me a starting point, so I can build something really close to what I currently have and then build upon it as I progress. But, alas, I couldn't find any useful information about the blade nor the rubber that was used in production of this pre-made bat.

All I know are the following details:

Blade: very light, all wood, 5 ply blade with WRB tech (stiga allround WRB?)
Rubber: Stiga S5 (ITTF 68-016) don't know any spec of it, don't know if it's heavy/light, soft/hard e.t.c., my best guess it something close to STIGA J.M.S. Evo1 which I suspect was discontinued by Stiga.

So I have tried to build something on my own by reading what everyone suggests tend to suggest to the beginners, so now I have 2 custom bats at my disposal:

1. Stiga Allround Wood NCT + Yasaka Rakza 7 on both sides - very bouncy/catapulty/fast, impossible to control as a beginner
2. Stiga Allround Wood NCT + Yasaka Mark 5 on both sides - very close to my pre-made bat, but 20 gram heavier, balance is a slightly worse, still a bit too fast and catapulty, I think I still need to have practice for at least a year with my current bat, before I can use something like bat number 2

So my original question remains does anyone know the specs of the blade/rubber for the pre-made bat that I have, or at least something which would be closer to it than the bat number 2. Or does anyone here works or knows someone who works for Stiga Sports and can give me the information I seek?

I know this might be a silly question, but it does keep me awake at night, as I would like to know my current starting point as in:

1. What blade do I feel comfortable with right now?
2. Is it and offensive or all-round blade?
3. Do I like soft or hard rubbers?

All I know is that at the moment (4 weeks in or so) I like lighter, balanced setups with not too fast rubbers, that offer a lot of feel and control, but still allow for a couple of attack once in a while.

Any suggestions and advice are welcome.

Kind Regards,

Vladimir
Author:  pgpg [ 23 Jul 2018, 02:09 ]
Post subject:  Re: Stiga blade/rubber question
Can you try paddles of other players in the club? Might help with answering some of the questions you have. Talking to the coach (if there is one around), perhaps?

You did not mention thickness of Mark V you ended up with - dropping to thinner sponge can help both with weight AND speed. There is a thread here with a database of rubber weights - should help you in your quest for lighter setup.

If you are in the US, I'd suggest checking out colestt.com - he does have pretty good set of options for beginners, including some lightweight options (Reflectoid comes to mind). He also answers questions via email.

Good luck!
Author:  uFLock [ 23 Jul 2018, 02:16 ]
Post subject:  Re: Stiga blade/rubber question
pgpg wrote:
Can you try paddles of other players in the club? Might help with answering some of the questions you have. Talking to the coach (if there is one around), perhaps?

You did not mention thickness of Mark V you ended up with - dropping to thinner sponge can help both with weight AND speed. There is a thread here with a database of rubber weights - should help you in your quest for lighter setup.

If you are in the US, I'd suggest checking out colestt.com - he does have pretty good set of options for beginners, including some lightweight options (Reflectoid comes to mind). He also answers questions via email.

Good luck!


Thank you for your reply.

Both Rakza 7 and Mark V are 2.0mm thick, same as the Stiga "mystery" rubber on the pre-made bat, but I suspect the Stiga one is softer. I am afraid if I switch to thinner mark V it will be harder to re-adapt in the future, because of the new ball?

It's more of a social club (mostly old men lol), and I will not get 1-to-1 coaching till Autumn, 1-to-1 is the only option for me where I live because I am way past 18, unfortunately.

I did try other people setups, and they are usually either too fast or too heavy, or even slower than what I have. Some have nice light butterfly blades, but those stopped being manufactured 20+ years ago ... I will keep looking.

EDIT: Hope someone from Stiga visits these forums ...
Author:  Silver [ 23 Jul 2018, 11:45 ]
Post subject:  Re: Stiga blade/rubber question
That Stiga premade rubber is probably fairly soft. You probably won’t find actual numbers relative to stigas standard range since they don’t sell it separately.

Butterfly Tackiness drive or even tackiness chop is probably closer to it than mark v. Should also be much lighter.

The premade blade will be pretty different to a Stiga Allround, different and cheaper woods, although the end result may be ballpark comparable

On your questions:
1 how long have you been playing with either combo 1 or 2?
2 the nct you got is faster than an Allround classic. The premade is most likely slower but it could be a bit tricky to tell due to the rubber
3 sounds like you like soft.
Author:  iskandar taib [ 23 Jul 2018, 14:11 ]
Post subject:  Re: Stiga blade/rubber question
Here's my suggestion. It's going to be quite light, and won't be too fast. But it IS Chinese.

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/SANWEI- ... 74001.html

Image

Given the price, you should go ahead and order one anyway, even if you plan to buy something else. If you want the bare blade, go here:

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/SANWEI- ... 01460.html (on sale for the next 2 hours)

or here:

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Hot-sel ... 22548.html

Disclaimer - I use this blade, and own an ungodly number of them. They're lightweight and have a lot of feel. Very similar to the Stiga Allround Classic etc.

Incidentally, the nicer Chinese pre-mades are a lot more useful than the European pre-mades you find at Wal-Mart. Yinhe, 729 and DHS all make decent pre-mades, with decent, usable rubbers. The stuff you encounter at Wal-Mart tends to be heavy, very slow and of rather poor quality (see some reviews on the web where they find knots in the plywood when the rubber is removed), even with brand names like Stiga, Tibhar and Donic.

Iskandar
Author:  uFLock [ 23 Jul 2018, 20:06 ]
Post subject:  Re: Stiga blade/rubber question
Silver wrote:
That Stiga premade rubber is probably fairly soft. You probably won’t find actual numbers relative to stigas standard range since they don’t sell it separately.

Butterfly Tackiness drive or even tackiness chop is probably closer to it than mark v. Should also be much lighter.

The premade blade will be pretty different to a Stiga Allround, different and cheaper woods, although the end result may be ballpark comparable

On your questions:
1 how long have you been playing with either combo 1 or 2?
2 the nct you got is faster than an Allround classic. The premade is most likely slower but it could be a bit tricky to tell due to the rubber
3 sounds like you like soft.


Thank you for your reply :)

Answers:

1. Well combo one was really uncontrollable, so I didn't even attempt to play with it, as if even I was able to wield it my already "non-existent" technique would go even more downhill. I played with combo 2 yesterday during a 4-hour session, and although it wasn't too bad, it was a much more unforgiving and also I didn't have any confidence playing with it, I know it might just be because of the new setup, but I was very confident with my pre-made bat since the get-go, and also, I tried some other player equipment and I was more confident with that, than the Mark V setup
2. I agree, although I think the pre-made bat is a tad stiffer.
3. Yes, I tend to agree here -> soft to medium-soft is something that I like

I did some more research based on your reply, and my suspicions about the "mystery S5" rubber, so narrowed it all down to the following options:

Blade: New Stiga Azalea all round - which seem to focus on lightness and control - the two things I like about my current bat
Rubber: Stiga Carbo MC or Stiga Innova Ultra Light SynergyTech

Any ideas?

iskandar taib wrote:
Here's my suggestion. It's going to be quite light, and won't be too fast. But it IS Chinese.

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/SANWEI- ... 74001.html

Image

Given the price, you should go ahead and order one anyway, even if you plan to buy something else. If you want the bare blade, go here:

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/SANWEI- ... 01460.html (on sale for the next 2 hours)

or here:

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Hot-sel ... 22548.html

Disclaimer - I use this blade, and own an ungodly number of them. They're lightweight and have a lot of feel. Very similar to the Stiga Allround Classic etc.

Incidentally, the nicer Chinese pre-mades are a lot more useful than the European pre-mades you find at Wal-Mart. Yinhe, 729 and DHS all make decent pre-mades, with decent, usable rubbers. The stuff you encounter at Wal-Mart tends to be heavy, very slow and of rather poor quality (see some reviews on the web where they find knots in the plywood when the rubber is removed), even with brand names like Stiga, Tibhar and Donic.

Iskandar


Hello Iskandar,

Thank you for your reply.

But unfortunately where I live, delivery will take 2 months. Also I really like the handle of the Stiga blades, as I tried many other blades at the club the other day, and there is just something about the Stiga Handle that just feels right.
Author:  iskandar taib [ 23 Jul 2018, 20:25 ]
Post subject:  Re: Stiga blade/rubber question
Get one anyway. You can always lend it out, unless you really take a liking to it.. :lol: 3 weeks is normal delivery time, I think most people in Europe receive AliExpress packages in about that.

Yeah, the handle is a little smaller than the European blades, nothing a little grip tape won't fix..

Iskandar
Author:  lasta [ 23 Jul 2018, 20:36 ]
Post subject:  Re: Stiga blade/rubber question
You kan keep the blades you have now and get two sheets of KTL Pro XP. It's considered medium in everything (a tad bit harder than Mark V) and no problem for beginners to learn on. Cheap as peanuts.
Author:  iskandar taib [ 23 Jul 2018, 20:45 ]
Post subject:  Re: Stiga blade/rubber question
KTL Pro XP/XT are a little on the slow side, too - lots of control. Doesn't cost that much either (in the USD7-8 range if you look around). One is tacky, the other isn't (and I can never remember which is which at any given time without looking it up). Lots and lots of Chinese rubbers around in the $4-7 range, too, pretty much all of them are usable and beginner friendly (Reactor Corbor, Batwings, Yinhe 9000, Kokutaku 868, Sanwei T88-x.. all more or less the same). Only 999 is a little bit of an outlier.

Iskandar
Author:  Cobalt [ 23 Jul 2018, 21:10 ]
Post subject:  Re: Stiga blade/rubber question
What is your goal? If it's to find a blade like your current one then why not just use your current one? I do think however that this bat will only take you so far as the rubbers probably can't generate that much spin and will create habits of poor stroke making to compensate for the rubber.

If I were you I'd just get a Stiga blade in the All / All+ range and either put LkT XP Pro or Mark V on it. I'm not that familiar with Stiga version of Mark V. Other good options though are Xiom Musa, Nittaku Magic Carbon and for something softer and Chinese, the XP Pro or Galaxy Mars II.
Author:  uFLock [ 23 Jul 2018, 21:50 ]
Post subject:  Re: Stiga blade/rubber question
iskandar taib wrote:
KTL Pro XP/XT are a little on the slow side, too - lots of control. Doesn't cost that much either (in the USD7-8 range if you look around). One is tacky, the other isn't (and I can never remember which is which at any given time without looking it up). Lots and lots of Chinese rubbers around in the $4-7 range, too, pretty much all of them are usable and beginner friendly (Reactor Corbor, Batwings, Yinhe 9000, Kokutaku 868, Sanwei T88-x.. all more or less the same). Only 999 is a little bit of an outlier.

Iskandar


I will look into KTL Pro :)

Cobalt wrote:
What is your goal? If it's to find a blade like your current one then why not just use your current one? I do think however that this bat will only take you so far as the rubbers probably can't generate that much spin and will create habits of poor stroke making to compensate for the rubber.

If I were you I'd just get a Stiga blade in the All / All+ range and either put LkT XP Pro or Mark V on it. I'm not that familiar with Stiga version of Mark V. Other good options though are Xiom Musa, Nittaku Magic Carbon and for something softer and Chinese, the XP Pro or Galaxy Mars II.


Well my current bat is factory superglued, so don't think I will be able to change the rubbers without destroying the blade :)

I already have Stiga Alround NCT with Mark V and it is too fast for me.

EDIT: my goal is to get a custom blade/rubber combination as close as possible to what I have now, so I can build upon that.
Author:  ChasFox [ 23 Jul 2018, 22:31 ]
Post subject:  Re: Stiga blade/rubber question
I agree that the main issue you are having with the Stiga/MkV combo is probably that the MkV is a fairly hard rubber = less forgiving.

I would suggest trying a sheet of LKT Rapid soft 2mm on one side of the same blade which will give you a good A to B comparison with the MkV on both FH & BH.

Rapid soft is a really nice soft and light rubber for good control and spin on all+ and faster blades and is available on line in the UK in the UK for about half the cost of MkV.

If a blade feels a bit head heavy then just add a bit of weight to the bottom of the handle. A lump of Blutack will do as a start.
Author:  iskandar taib [ 23 Jul 2018, 22:43 ]
Post subject:  Re: Stiga blade/rubber question
The fact that the Stiga Allround and Mark V aren't really all that fast makes me wonder if what you REALLY need is simply more time to get used to the racket. Use it exclusively for a month, lock the pre-made away and don't touch it. At the end of the month I bet it will no longer feel too fast, and the pre-made will feel way too slow.

Iskandar
Author:  gradge [ 24 Jul 2018, 03:15 ]
Post subject:  Re: Stiga blade/rubber question
iskandar taib wrote:
Here's my suggestion. It's going to be quite light, and won't be too fast. But it IS Chinese.

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/SANWEI- ... 74001.html

Image

Given the price, you should go ahead and order one anyway, even if you plan to buy something else. If you want the bare blade, go here:

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/SANWEI- ... 01460.html (on sale for the next 2 hours)



or here:

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Hot-sel ... 22548.html

Disclaimer - I use this blade, and own an ungodly number of them. They're lightweight and have a lot of feel. Very similar to the Stiga Allround Classic etc.

Incidentally, the nicer Chinese pre-mades are a lot more useful than the European pre-mades you find at Wal-Mart. Yinhe, 729 and DHS all make decent pre-mades, with decent, usable rubbers. The stuff you encounter at Wal-Mart tends to be heavy, very slow and of rather poor quality (see some reviews on the web where they find knots in the plywood when the rubber is removed), even with brand names like Stiga, Tibhar and Donic.

Iskandar


I bought this Gewo Energy Control and wonder how it would compare to the Sanwei you mention? At a price of $14 is does seem like a total bargain?

https://bribartt.co.uk/product/gewo-ene ... ennis-bat/
Author:  Dusty054 [ 24 Jul 2018, 06:33 ]
Post subject:  Re: Stiga blade/rubber question
Stick with the pre made for now. Get some coaching if you can.
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