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PostPosted: 17 Nov 2008, 19:58 
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I'd just like to give a BIG thank you to Silver and Beer Belly, who have generously sent me some rubbers and cutoff to add to the sponge hardness table! All measurements have been added.

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PostPosted: 17 Nov 2008, 22:37 
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Why would anyone keep the cutoffs of their rubbers around???

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PostPosted: 18 Nov 2008, 03:56 
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addoydude wrote:
Why would anyone keep the cutoffs of their rubbers around???


Waiting for Alex to ask for them, of course!

I have several cutoffs of rubbers that I have used over the last couple of months -- and would already have sent them if the postage to Australia wouldn't exceed their value to your table. :lol:

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PostPosted: 18 Nov 2008, 06:37 
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addoydude wrote:
Why would anyone keep the cutoffs of their rubbers around???


I used to do this as well for all the bats I make up for other people...just in case I ever wanted to check out the rubber again... ended up taking a little too much space :?

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PostPosted: 22 Nov 2018, 14:44 
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Hi, Alex
Would you like me to post this billboard on MyTT and some other forums?
A lot of new rubbers did come out by now onto market, we certainly need to go on with our hardness tests, I believe.

Ever Yours
Igor Novick, civil building engineer


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PostPosted: 23 Nov 2018, 01:29 
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For what it's worth I have a big pile of cutoffs I've been meaning to send to Haggis - somehow it doesn't seem as important as it did three years ago.. :lol: Mainly cheap stuff but also a half dozen odd sheets of ESN and Japanese..

Iskandar


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PostPosted: 23 Nov 2018, 20:54 
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Durometer hardness, the values attained with one durometer type should never be correlated to those attained with another durometer type!
Alex, email of year 2011 wrote:
Hi Igor!
I'm curious to find out what durometer you're actually using? I think I would like to get a 2nd durometer, so that I can compare readings.
I would also prefer a durometer that puts less pressure onto the rubber, as the penetration of the rubbers means it measures more than just the rubber at the surface.

Thank you!
Alex...


Hi, Alex

My highest recommendation is that you have obtained Shore A device (now available from many AliExpress stores). The reason is that most of rubber makers, all China's included, would employ this Shore A scale for their rubber hardness evaluations.
Yes. You might give a try to Shore OO device as well, seeing it only needs low-pressure force of 200 gramme uploaded, whereas Shore A needs pressure of 1000 grammes. Be aware here, Shore OO will give you rather puffed dial indication, say Tenergy05 sponge Shore A 36* is indicated Shore OO 75-80 units.
Alex,
It looks like you don't maintain the Hardness Sheet any longer. I can't see any more updates in the Sheet since the year 2012. Bad news. indeed. You should go on, I believe. It is a job worthwhile, anyway.

Bye Bye. Till next.


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PostPosted: 24 Nov 2018, 10:15 
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The trouble is, if I change durometers, the readings are more going to be comparable to the old readings.
There never appeared to be much interest in these readings anyway, and people often questioned the values as they were not comparable to manufacturer specs, so I stopped collecting them.

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PostPosted: 24 Nov 2018, 11:21 
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So taking sponge hardness readings has stopped being a shore thing.

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PostPosted: 24 Nov 2018, 16:07 
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haggisv wrote:
The trouble is, if I change durometers, the readings are more going to be comparable to the old readings.
There never appeared to be much interest in these readings anyway, and people often questioned the values as they were not comparable to manufacturer specs, so I stopped collecting them.


ONE SHOULD USE CONVERSION DIAGRAMMES for a better understandable result.

Converting the numbers from Shore O scale (as now present in the Haggis' Rubber Sheet) into Shore A (as is a standard hardness scale with China manufacturers) can be easely done by using those conversional diagrammes, attached below.


Image

Image

You always can expect accurate result, anyway.
For example, the Haggis' Sheet indicates Tenergy05 hardness of 50 units (Shore O scale), the table conversion indicates 37 units by Shore A scale. This is the very value as is announced by Butterfly mnfc.
The given conversion diagramme is a real help, of which I totally convinced.


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PostPosted: 24 Nov 2018, 17:20 
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That's indeed very encouraging igorponger, thank you! :up:

I will start collecting new values again. :rock:

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PostPosted: 30 Nov 2018, 18:27 
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I've updated the table, added some values, and also included a copy of the chart that igorponger posted above (thanks igorponger!).

You can see the table updated Sponge Hardness Table here.

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PostPosted: 06 Dec 2018, 01:23 
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: : : SHORE DUROMETERs AS NOW USED IN RUBBER MAKING INDUSTRY : : :

Shore A (truncated cone indentor) inbuilt spring force 0.82 kgf
Image

Shore D (conical indentor) inbuilt spring force 4.45 kgf
Image

Shore O (semispherical indentor) inbuilt spring force 0.82 kgf
Image

Shore C (truncated cone) spring force 4.45 kgf
(image same as Shore A)


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PostPosted: 06 Dec 2018, 03:54 
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AN INTERESTED VIEW INTO BEHIND THE SCENES.
ESN factory testing laboratory is now using Shore O digital tester as can be seen from the video. None of the world's major table tennis company does employ this marginal Shore O version. ESN is apparently the only one to use Shore O scale. This is some unhappy inconsistency of the testing methodology, very hard to justify from a scientist's viewpoint, indeed.

https://youtu.be/vdhGxd-oxas?t=108



As an example, ANDRO GmbH is always using Shore A scale for marking on their own rubber products, and DHS rubber manufactore is doing likewise.
Rasanter 37*
Rasanter 42*
Rasanter 47*
Rasanter 50*

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oeQtqhVr-Hw

NOTE OF SPECIAL INTEREST: HaggisV, he has been testing rubber samples with the Shore O scale invariably, this is the reason that the numbers in the OOAK Hardness Sheet may differ somewhat from those in TT-Catalogues and rubber covers.
Again, do mind of the fact that Shore O is a durometer very rarely used by the major rubber makers (ESN is maybe a sole exception ). Shore A is a general standard scale.

Merry Christmass and Happy NewYear.


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PostPosted: 08 Dec 2018, 01:53 
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????

1) That video is OLD... "Published on Feb 13, 2013" Even if that durometer you see is a Shore O, a) they might've stopped using it and b) it might be for internal use only.

2) Every ESN made sheet I've ever come across uses the same hardness scale, so I don't see why you'd say ESN uses a different scale than Andro does. They certainly don't publish any Shore O values.

Iskandar


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