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PostPosted: 22 Aug 2012, 22:48 
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Hi Anti spinnerssss :>) - Here I would like to take out new topic which i haven't seen discussed much about. This would help me in understanding anti better. Lets discuss on the below questions:

Speed : X (km per hour)
Spin : Y(Top spin rotations per sec)
Racket angle: Flat (perpendicular to table)

When ball is struck with above X speed and Y spin on 2 rackets - one with slick anti and one racket with inverted rubber,how the trajectory of the ball behaves?

Trajectory of anti spin ---> It will be linear/horizontal and will rely on gravity to come down to table. Lets say length of
trajectory hit struck by anti spin is "P"
Trajectory of Inverted ---> Based on top spin, ball will go high and come back due to top spin. Player can control the
landing of the ball with the grippy rubber.
Lets say length of trajectory hit struck by anti spin is "Q"

My question is:
i) Is P > Q ?
ii) My understanding is length of the trajectory struck by anti is directly proportional to speed. Do you agree with this? And also Is length of the trajectory struck by anti, is proportionate to amount of top spin?

Lets discuss about the length of the trajectory. I hope everyone will participate actively here. Thanks in advance.

Racket set up used by me:
BH:Nightmare anti
FH: DHS hurricane 2
Blade: Stiga allround Evolution

Cheers,


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PostPosted: 23 Aug 2012, 00:09 
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It is illogical to play with a uniform surface!
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By correcting the angular momentum equations, we could have a moving radius of .44 x 10-17m and an angular momentum of 2.7 x 10-5m/s. In 10-18s, a ball would spin 5.8 x 10-23m. This spin motion would be stretched out by the linear motion. If we assume that motion is at speed c, we just multiply by c, which gives us 6.96 x 10-14m. Since the spin gives us a circumference, not a radius, and since I have shown that pi=4 in this situation, the effective circumference is .4518 x 10-16m. [6.96 x 10-14m/3.58 x 10-16m = 194] Which means the ball is actually not travelling at c, it is travelling at .0051c. To make the equations work with these numbers, we have to assume the ball is not going c. That mean the ball is spinning at 194 cycles per second. E = ½mv2
Well, .0057c is a scaling of velocity. We are finding the speed of the ball relative to the circumference. But G is a size, or radius. The ball size is G times the atomic size. So we need an equation to relate velocity and size.
Since we are dealing with the interaction of the spin and speed here, we can use the scaling constant G (right out of Newton's gravitational equation). I have shown that G is actually a scaling constant between movement and time. If we take the fourth root of G (times 2), we get .0057.
2G = mv2
Spin and speed is reduced at almost the same rate at .0057 per half second times the circumference
2G = v4

so to answer your question would be depending on a few other statistics we would
have to look at, but will just look at this as a NORM. AS a former Antiplayer angular motion z-y+Ec with G not with standing will mass out at 3.1 -c. Speed is spin is reduced at about 3 times -3, that figures in because the anti is also slower and less responsive to spin. Kill spin and speed. the same X+Y+Ec with regualr inverted wil reacted ( on average) 3 times more responsive than Anti. a 20 degree angle of return from anti will result in 3 times less speed and spin. the inverted will ( with the same X+Y+Ec) will convert to a 60 degree return and 3 times faster )n average.
I hope this is helpful in your quest.

Peace GIG
:rock: :Chop:

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THOUGHT OF THE WEEK: If you eliminate the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth.


New blade set-up... Nittaku Monophonic with Dawie 388d-1 ox and Big slam max ( really like this one) down to FH rubber selections--I like it better than talon
flaired handle and 90 grams


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PostPosted: 23 Aug 2012, 16:55 
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michiganbob54 wrote:
By correcting the angular momentum equations, we could have a moving radius of .44 x 10-17m and an angular momentum of 2.7 x 10-5m/s. In 10-18s, a ball would spin 5.8 x 10-23m. This spin motion would be stretched out by the linear motion. If we assume that motion is at speed c, we just multiply by c, which gives us 6.96 x 10-14m. Since the spin gives us a circumference, not a radius, and since I have shown that pi=4 in this situation, the effective circumference is .4518 x 10-16m. [6.96 x 10-14m/3.58 x 10-16m = 194] Which means the ball is actually not travelling at c, it is travelling at .0051c. To make the equations work with these numbers, we have to assume the ball is not going c. That mean the ball is spinning at 194 cycles per second. E = ½mv2
Well, .0057c is a scaling of velocity. We are finding the speed of the ball relative to the circumference. But G is a size, or radius. The ball size is G times the atomic size. So we need an equation to relate velocity and size.
Since we are dealing with the interaction of the spin and speed here, we can use the scaling constant G (right out of Newton's gravitational equation). I have shown that G is actually a scaling constant between movement and time. If we take the fourth root of G (times 2), we get .0057.
2G = mv2
Spin and speed is reduced at almost the same rate at .0057 per half second times the circumference
2G = v4

so to answer your question would be depending on a few other statistics we would
have to look at, but will just look at this as a NORM. AS a former Antiplayer angular motion z-y+Ec with G not with standing will mass out at 3.1 -c. Speed is spin is reduced at about 3 times -3, that figures in because the anti is also slower and less responsive to spin. Kill spin and speed. the same X+Y+Ec with regualr inverted wil reacted ( on average) 3 times more responsive than Anti. a 20 degree angle of return from anti will result in 3 times less speed and spin. the inverted will ( with the same X+Y+Ec) will convert to a 60 degree return and 3 times faster )n average.
I hope this is helpful in your quest.

Peace GIG
:rock: :Chop:



Thanks michiganbob54 for your views on this.. This is very nice with mathematics into it.. But I am still reading again n again to understand the above. :)


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PostPosted: 24 Aug 2012, 04:29 
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It is illogical to play with a uniform surface!
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A ball that travels at 12.5 meters per second (45 Kmh) hitting l *> blade surface
=4.167 Minus 2/3rd of base speed or 1.385 meters, or 4.54 feet + time and gravity
Spin (added energy) + (1/3rd *3.14) Pi. =.95. SO
P= 15 degrees with a ball traveling at 12.5 meters per second and spinning at 45 revolutions
Per second. Will travel about 1.385+.95=2.335 meters or 7 feet 6 inches. In 1.95 seconds.P= 15 degrees Q= 7 feet 6 inches in 1,95 seconds.
I hope that is what hello is looking for??LOL

Peace GIG
:rock: :Chop:

_________________
*IT IS NOT LOGICAL TO PLAY WITH LONG PIPS*
THOUGHT OF THE WEEK: If you eliminate the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth.


New blade set-up... Nittaku Monophonic with Dawie 388d-1 ox and Big slam max ( really like this one) down to FH rubber selections--I like it better than talon
flaired handle and 90 grams


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PostPosted: 24 Aug 2012, 18:54 
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Hello Hello!

Rest assured that many of us at some time have found m'bob54's intricate explanations hard to grasp.
Once you get through to the real meaning there will be some useful info to extract, though perhaps not as much as to justify the effort from m'bob54.

Have fun. Don't worry to much.

The most important thing is to know where your towel is.
[Ford Prefect]

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My blog of failures, etc., also containing equipment list at "resurrection" (referred to in a few of my early posts), and my current lineup
Rating in the middle/low range in the region.
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PostPosted: 26 Aug 2012, 01:16 
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Daaaaaaaaaaang..

Edit: Page saved for further study hahaaaa

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PostPosted: 03 Dec 2012, 22:21 
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Thanks for your post.. Really very informative..
I need to know this.

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PostPosted: 04 Dec 2012, 03:03 
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I sometimes think there are just too many ways to think about this. Now we have custom Anti's that have some grip, thin sponge, dead sponge, and custom sponge that one can customize almost any rubber. But as a rule expect 1/3rd less spin and speed. Anti does not work as well on Balsa blades and can be over-reactive and not play at its full potential. I recently did a testing on GD new soft antis-. very slow in 1.5 and too fast in 1.0. chopping in 1.5 was alot like chopping down a tree. it would wear your arm out if not on a mid-to faster blade.
but the answer is the same..blocking with Anti of any kind is somewhat blade dependent. go too slow and it does affect service returns on slow hanging balls. too fast and it can be uncontrolled. The right mix...can be deadly

Peace GIG
:rock: :Chop: *****still * the ball should go 1/3 distance of average inverted and 1/3 less spin...( unless treated with something like a silicone base clear cover...ie ARMORALL) ??yes it works great..I dont use it, but some will and are using it. as close to spin resistant as you could get.

_________________
*IT IS NOT LOGICAL TO PLAY WITH LONG PIPS*
THOUGHT OF THE WEEK: If you eliminate the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth.


New blade set-up... Nittaku Monophonic with Dawie 388d-1 ox and Big slam max ( really like this one) down to FH rubber selections--I like it better than talon
flaired handle and 90 grams


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