OOAK Table Tennis Forum


A truly International Table Tennis Community for both Defensive and Offensive styles!
OOAK Forum Links About OOAK Table Tennis Forum OOAK Forum Memory
It is currently 19 Mar 2024, 15:15


Don't want to see any advertising? Become a member and login, and you'll never see an ad again!



All times are UTC + 9:30 hours




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 246 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17  Next
Author Message
PostPosted: 15 Dec 2015, 07:01 
Offline
OOAK Super User
OOAK Super User
User avatar

Joined: 10 Jun 2007, 09:24
Posts: 1354
Location: Universe
Has thanked: 21 times
Been thanked: 102 times
BEWARE OF THE "ICY " TABLES...

Baal

Why do I hear no complaints regarding the DHS new plastic ball from my domestic players? More over, many of the high-rated players of Russia did spoke out in most complimentary terms as to the DHS plastic recent improvements. Perceptible improvement of the ball durability and size regularity is now appreciated by my own players in the first place.
Again, the new DHS 40+ upward bounce magnitude is no concern with good players. The DHS ball is now generally recognized as "A Ball of real playability". Yes.

Baal,
Before you start producing any further criticism of the new plastic ball, please take in consideration the essentials of reality, that
-- the slick low-friction table will always give a reduced ball's bounce you mentioned so oftentimes. Do not play on the shiny-slick tables.
Just take my friendly advice, take care you not playing on the slick-icy tables. The low-friction tables tend to wreck your game utterly.

Some later day I will gladly tell you in every particularity about the low-friction table's surface main disadvantage. It is a pretty worthy knowledge for every good player to hear. :D


Top
 Profile  
 


PostPosted: 16 Dec 2015, 16:55 
Offline
OOAK Super User
OOAK Super User

Joined: 16 Oct 2007, 13:44
Posts: 2908
Location: Houston
Has thanked: 7 times
Been thanked: 151 times
Maybe they like the extremely low bounce, maybe they have not played with better balls like Nittaku or the Butterfly G40+.

Trust me, Igor, these balls play very differently from celluloid and any of the other 40+ balls. Whatever DHS has done with their new material has not solved that problem. They are a distinct outlier. They seem rounder, I like the color better, and the weight meets ITTF standards. But the bounce is still very very low. I gave them to a US team member to hit with. He hated them too. It is not just "bad players" who dislike balls that bounce that low.

I wish it was different. I want DHS to make good balls, the more manufacturers the better.

I have also played with them on new Btfly tables, by the way. Same problem. Also, the Tibhar 28 tables I usually play on are very good tables. Most players in Europe will tell you that. They are widely used at ITTF pro tour events.

I repeat, in my opinion, people should not use Chinese seamed balls at this time.

_________________
Butterfly Viscaria Black tag
2.2 mm Nexy Karis M on FH and BH


Last edited by Baal on 19 Dec 2015, 15:38, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 17 Dec 2015, 05:28 
Offline
A.D.D.I.C.T.T.
A.D.D.I.C.T.T.
User avatar

Joined: 09 Nov 2012, 23:15
Posts: 1936
Location: Newcastle, UK
Has thanked: 193 times
Been thanked: 190 times
Blade: Victas Koji Matsushita ZC
FH: BTY Dignics 64 (2.1mm)
BH: Victas P1V (1.5mm)
Is the Stiga Optimum a Chinese seamed ball? That has a noticeably lower bounce.

_________________
My blog: "Learning to play: as a modern defender": http://ooakforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=58&t=22254
My YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCtazeX ... oICGS9bqNg
Join the OOAK Discord!: https://discord.gg/Yw2hYUdz3g

[Other gear I've used]
Blades: Butterfly Defence 3, Butterfly Defence Pro, Butterfly Innerforce ZLC, Butterfly Innershield, DHS Power G7, Stiga Offensive Classic Carbon
SPs: Friendship 802 (1.5), TSP Spectol (1.3, 1.8, 2.1), TSP Spectol Speed (1.3), TSP Super Spinpips Chop Sponge 2 (0.5, 1.3)
LPs: Butterfly Feint Long II (1), Butterfly Feint Long III (0.5, 1.3), Tibhar Grass D.TecS (OX), TSP Curl P1-R (0.5, 1, 1.3), TSP Curl P4 (1.3)


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 19 Dec 2015, 15:36 
Offline
OOAK Super User
OOAK Super User

Joined: 16 Oct 2007, 13:44
Posts: 2908
Location: Houston
Has thanked: 7 times
Been thanked: 151 times
dunc wrote:
Is the Stiga Optimum a Chinese seamed ball? That has a noticeably lower bounce.


yes.

_________________
Butterfly Viscaria Black tag
2.2 mm Nexy Karis M on FH and BH


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 21 Dec 2015, 23:26 
Offline
Full member
User avatar

Joined: 04 Feb 2009, 19:26
Posts: 68
Location: France
Has thanked: 8 times
Been thanked: 8 times
Some interesting findings in the minutes of the Executive Committee (09/19/2015) concerning the plastic ball:

Quote:
12.2 New term for plastic ball
Discussion started in Equipment Committee on finding a new term for
“plastic ball”, because celluloid is also plastic. Equipment Committee
will make proposal to the EC once the new definition is agreed.


Quote:
13 Athletes’ Commission report
Ball quality and quantity is still a problem, one out of 6 balls is good. Top players get good quality balls, but the majority use balls that are too soft, easily broken and the balls supplied for practice are even worse.
It is proposed to change balls after 3 games.
EC agreed that the situation with balls is still not satisfactory, and will be followed up with manufacturers.
At the same time AC is requested to collect more opinion from Asian players, to report officially the problems to the Competition Manager on site and to make use of its Chair’s invitation to visit DHS in China.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 13 May 2016, 16:20 
Offline
Bytes worse than his Bark
Bytes worse than his Bark
User avatar

Joined: 15 Sep 2011, 12:25
Posts: 1692
Location: Sydney, Australia
Has thanked: 111 times
Been thanked: 375 times
Blade: OldNittaku Carbon
FH: Tenergy 05 Hard
BH: Yasaka Shining Dragon max
Hi Torsten,

Do you know why no orange plastic balls are on the market? Beyond the fact that none have been sent for testing?

There are some of us who play at venues with white walls, and with only white plastic balls are fast running out of the orange celluloid balls ...

_________________
Retriever (sometimes golden, but often leaden)
Moderator, Inverted Retriever Technique sub-forum - http://ooakforum.com/viewforum.php?f=74


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 16 May 2016, 08:55 
Offline
Full member

Joined: 25 Aug 2014, 19:55
Posts: 65
Location: Munich, Germany
Has thanked: 2 times
Been thanked: 44 times
Yes, there is an explanation. When you look at the current List of ITTF Approved Balls ( http://www.ittf.com/stories/Pictures/Balls_06_2016.pdf ) you will recognize that some suppliers now show up with two separate approvals for white non-celluloid balls with seam.

This means that they have spent the past months with what we requested from them: To finalize research and development on the remaining issues such as durability (and some did so by even working on two types of material).

This has of course been time-consuming, and for this reason, adding the orange balls still could not have priority for them. However, ITTF's guidance on this topic did not change: Orange non-celluloid balls will be approved by ITTF just as orange celluloid balls, and are expected to appear in the future.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 16 May 2016, 11:33 
Offline
Bytes worse than his Bark
Bytes worse than his Bark
User avatar

Joined: 15 Sep 2011, 12:25
Posts: 1692
Location: Sydney, Australia
Has thanked: 111 times
Been thanked: 375 times
Blade: OldNittaku Carbon
FH: Tenergy 05 Hard
BH: Yasaka Shining Dragon max
Thank you Torsten.

_________________
Retriever (sometimes golden, but often leaden)
Moderator, Inverted Retriever Technique sub-forum - http://ooakforum.com/viewforum.php?f=74


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 08 Jun 2016, 07:57 
Offline
Bytes worse than his Bark
Bytes worse than his Bark
User avatar

Joined: 15 Sep 2011, 12:25
Posts: 1692
Location: Sydney, Australia
Has thanked: 111 times
Been thanked: 375 times
Blade: OldNittaku Carbon
FH: Tenergy 05 Hard
BH: Yasaka Shining Dragon max
Hi Torsten,

I posted this in another thread here, but thought I would repeat it verbatim here:

This whole issue (date of ball manufacture, which factory, what level of QC etc) would not arise if the specifications of the plastic ball were more precise *and enforced*.

We almost do not have this whole issue with celluloid, and cannot remember it occurring with the transition from 38mm to 40mm.

What comeback is there if a box of 3 star balls with an unacceptable number of them:

not round?
not balanced?
not bouncing?
not lasting?


As far as I can tell, the buck stops with the ITTF given that they approve of balls even if they are OEMed and rebadged.

So where are the sanctions imposed on the ball producers or rebadgers? I have not heard of any ball approvals being rescinded.

</rant>
Disclaimer: I have still only had a 15-20 minute hit with a Stag seamless ball XGAF (Rebadged, June 2015) and did not like it. Also still waiting for orange ones.

_________________
Retriever (sometimes golden, but often leaden)
Moderator, Inverted Retriever Technique sub-forum - http://ooakforum.com/viewforum.php?f=74


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 20 Apr 2017, 07:05 
Offline
Full member

Joined: 25 Aug 2014, 19:55
Posts: 65
Location: Munich, Germany
Has thanked: 2 times
Been thanked: 44 times
Hi All,

just to inform you that I have updated the Q&A document again, it's now http://old.ittf.com/stories/pictures/Plastic_balls_Q_A_v3.pdf .

Major updates (with respect to the bottom right page numbers) are on page 5, 6 (last point), 9, 10 (last point), 14, 17 and 19. It also covers what I recently wrote here: http://ooakforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=25&t=31105#p335161.

Any further questions or comments are welcome as always, be it affirmative or critical.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 02 May 2017, 22:36 
Offline
Senior member

Joined: 16 Nov 2016, 04:12
Posts: 162
Has thanked: 12 times
Been thanked: 31 times
I have used DHS 3 star new balls before but two of them broke in the first minute of playing so I have not kept using them...

My club uses nittaku 3 star premium ones that are 40+ and they are pretty nice I recommend them. Since we started playing with them last year any other ball feels weird now lol... especially the smaller balls


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 14 Jun 2017, 16:30 
Offline
New Member
User avatar

Joined: 21 Mar 2016, 13:15
Posts: 29
Has thanked: 3 times
Been thanked: 3 times
This is a quite old thread....


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 14 Jun 2017, 23:29 
Online
Dark Knight
Dark Knight
User avatar

Joined: 13 Dec 2006, 12:34
Posts: 33337
Location: Adelaide, AU
Has thanked: 2734 times
Been thanked: 1547 times
Blade: Trinity Carbon
FH: Victas VS > 401
BH: Dr N Troublemaker OX
It started a long time ago, but it's been active, with a lot of new information being added.

_________________
OOAK Table Tennis Shop | Re-Impact Blades | Butterfly Table Tennis bats
Setup1: Re-Impact Smart, Viper OX, Victas VS 401 Setup2: Re-Impact Barath, Dtecs OX, TSP Triple Spin Chop 1.0mm Setup3: Re-Impact Dark Knight, Hellfire OX, 999 Turbo
Recent Articles: Butterfly Tenergy Alternatives | Tenergy Rubbers Compared | Re-Impact User Guide


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 17 Jun 2017, 23:31 
Offline
The Pied Pipper
The Pied Pipper
User avatar

Joined: 13 Jun 2017, 23:16
Posts: 1325
Location: Somewhere out there!
Has thanked: 118 times
Been thanked: 35 times
I notice this does not draw a reply from anyone official, best brush it into the corner with your duff balls!!., :swear: :swear: :devil: :cash: :cash: 8)

Retriever wrote:
Hi Torsten,

I posted this in another thread here, but thought I would repeat it verbatim here:

This whole issue (date of ball manufacture, which factory, what level of QC etc) would not arise if the specifications of the plastic ball were more precise *and enforced*.

We almost do not have this whole issue with celluloid, and cannot remember it occurring with the transition from 38mm to 40mm.

What comeback is there if a box of 3 star balls with an unacceptable number of them:

not round?
not balanced?
not bouncing?
not lasting?


As far as I can tell, the buck stops with the ITTF given that they approve of balls even if they are OEMed and rebadged.

So where are the sanctions imposed on the ball producers or rebadgers? I have not heard of any ball approvals being rescinded.

</rant>
Disclaimer: I have still only had a 15-20 minute hit with a Stag seamless ball XGAF (Rebadged, June 2015) and did not like it. Also still waiting for orange ones.

_________________
_________________
Think, before you drink, before you write!


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 18 Jun 2017, 12:51 
Offline
Bytes worse than his Bark
Bytes worse than his Bark
User avatar

Joined: 15 Sep 2011, 12:25
Posts: 1692
Location: Sydney, Australia
Has thanked: 111 times
Been thanked: 375 times
Blade: OldNittaku Carbon
FH: Tenergy 05 Hard
BH: Yasaka Shining Dragon max
I haven't been holding my breath. A little transparency would be good, and if everyone knows that XYZ type A ball is bad anyway there would not be very much brand damage.

Instead of only the ball manufacturer looking bad, we have both the ball manufacturer and the ITTF looking bad.

_________________
Retriever (sometimes golden, but often leaden)
Moderator, Inverted Retriever Technique sub-forum - http://ooakforum.com/viewforum.php?f=74


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 246 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17  Next



All times are UTC + 9:30 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 0 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Copyright 2018 OOAK Table Tennis Forum. The information on this site cannot be reused without written permission.

Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group