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PostPosted: 09 Jun 2018, 22:20 
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Excellent freezeframes wilkinru. Before changing your swing, try just setting up around 4 - 6 inches further back after your serve. You may be surprised how much difference a few inches can make.


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PostPosted: 10 Jun 2018, 01:10 
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BRS wrote:
Excellent freezeframes wilkinru. Before changing your swing, try just setting up around 4 - 6 inches further back after your serve. You may be surprised how much difference a few inches can make.


Yeah I think the setup will allow the practiced swing to occur. My thought is that practicing the correct stroke at the right distance will be an eye opener.


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PostPosted: 11 Jun 2018, 00:08 
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Hey guys,

thank you for the feedback, I really appreciate it.

Wilkinru, a picture is worth a thousand words and you really nailed it with those frames, back to the hall and I will see what I can do to improve, hope to get back with some better looking videos soon


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PostPosted: 11 Jun 2018, 08:23 
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Brett Clarke wrote:
Watch the body on the pivot. Heming has a very solid backhand, but he plays his big shots with his forehand.

https://www.facebook.com/hudog2103/vide ... 343630682/


I tried this exercise yesterday and after about 20 balls my legs were mush. Amazing!


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PostPosted: 11 Jun 2018, 09:39 
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Just trying to pivot against the robot, without the short ball, I can't do more than 8-10 shots when fresh. When getting exhausted, it lowers to 4-6.


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PostPosted: 11 Jun 2018, 12:02 
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Barfly wrote:
Wow, so much great things happening, Brett is back and we have another pro on board, good times!

Seems like perfect time to ask a question about my recent struggles with third ball consistency and general dilemma whether to try to cover almost everything with my forehand or recover more neutrally and develop, rely more on my backhand.

Video of my FH third ball openers:

https://youtu.be/jt7KrepqxLw

Some general issues:
Recovering to close to the table?
Standing too straight?
Taking the ball too late when it almost passes me?
Cant stabilize my elbow in the golden point position for the life of me, it just keeps going over my shoulder height no matter how much I concentrate on it,any new ideas how to stop that habit?


Video of my backhand topspins after the serve:

https://youtu.be/tpgDAivzSSk

So, which of these approach has more potential and you would focus on if you were in my place?

Thank you for all the help!


Hey Barfly, it's all about using your body to have a better backswing. You need to fold you body down to lower your racket, as per LTT93, At the same time, you need to turn everything (knees, hips, shoulders, whatever) back more to take your racket behind the ball. Because you don't use your body well on the backswing, you are trying to force the forward swing.

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PostPosted: 11 Jun 2018, 12:08 
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wilkinru wrote:
Brett Clarke wrote:
Watch the body on the pivot. Heming has a very solid backhand, but he plays his big shots with his forehand.

https://www.facebook.com/hudog2103/vide ... 343630682/


I tried this exercise yesterday and after about 20 balls my legs were mush. Amazing!


Heming is super tired after doing this exercise as well. He goes to the gym and he's fit, but this is really hard stuff. The difference between you and Heming is, he'll recover faster.

If you put everything into an exercise, you should be feeling it after 20-30 seconds for sure. Remember a point only goes for a few seconds, so you don't need to be a marathon runner.

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PostPosted: 12 Jun 2018, 05:40 
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Brett Clarke wrote:
wilkinru wrote:
Brett Clarke wrote:
Watch the body on the pivot. Heming has a very solid backhand, but he plays his big shots with his forehand.

https://www.facebook.com/hudog2103/vide ... 343630682/


I tried this exercise yesterday and after about 20 balls my legs were mush. Amazing!


Heming is super tired after doing this exercise as well. He goes to the gym and he's fit, but this is really hard stuff. The difference between you and Heming is, he'll recover faster.

If you put everything into an exercise, you should be feeling it after 20-30 seconds for sure. Remember a point only goes for a few seconds, so you don't need to be a marathon runner.


I once had a point last 8 seconds. I think I lost the next 5 points in a row.


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PostPosted: 14 Jun 2018, 15:44 
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Hey Guys,
I apologise in advance if I sometimes send messages saying "check out this video" and then provide a link but its somehow missing. I am pretty bad with computers. I tried posting it here but accidentally started a new topic on this website.

Here is my second try, showing a video of William Henzell maintaining his amazing world class backhand even with only practicing once a month. Check it out!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-bsvvheZz24


Goes to show how far good technique, timing and the 2-step process can take you


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PostPosted: 14 Jun 2018, 16:09 
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Here are some more good points of me and William's last practice session! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fSOTFgMXob4


@fastmover and anyone else curious on the topic of pivoting or staying with backhand: Here is a link that shows a moment where its appropriate to stay on the backhand and be strong there, and two others where I have started with a strong/good enough receive to set up a pivot opportunity from William and chose to turn around using my forehand to try win the point!


First point of the video: This is a common backhand oriented set play: Get in with a strong banana flick and get back fast into position to the backhand ready to play a strong backhand. You will see Zhang Jike and Fan Zhendong doing this a lot in matches, training and multiballs.

Second point: After playing a decently ok receive, I chose to pivot and actually got the ball I wanted/anticipated for. I have to say it wasn't the best receive/strongest backhand at this level. It wasn't a bad one either but William especially with his skills, could have played me down the line and most likely won the point. However, I took the risk in this point and it paid off.

The things that I've done well here are: I've stepped back 10-15cm's (this often can be good and helps give you space to turn your body and give yourself space/time to have a swing at it, yet you're not too far back from the table, the Chinese will do this when they pivot for the winning shot). I've also taken my right foot/leg/hip/waist back and left side forwards, to set myself up in a position to play a forehand with a good body turn, where I have the room needed instead of being in a straight-on position which won't allow me to pivot my body around to the ball. Additionally, if William does play down the line, I am in a position where I have a chance to retrieve that ball with a crossover movement, with any other body position, there is no chance! I have also began hopping on my right leg (which Brett has mentioned is super important in cases such as this). The hopping would allow me to crossover to my forehand to cover a huge step/area and quickly, if needed.

Third point: I start with a quick, early and pretty heavy short push. This good receive has made it hard for William to come in after his serve and push it back short and low. It is a tough ball when you serve, don't know what receive will come and your opponent pushes the ball short, low and heavy. Generally, the rule of thumb in table tennis would say something like: push back short if you are able to see it early and take the ball back early, if you are not confident you can return the ball back short and low, you are better off going in to flick it or push it long as you can easily still play good quality in these two options. If you are late on a short ball and not confident to put it back short and low, and you try to do it anyway, it is likely that it will come back high/half long or both. This is generally not preferred as it gives your opponent time and space to hit. Again, this is another common tactic used by the chinese and you will see this used by them in matches, and training. This is precisely what I am practicing with Brett, in the video that he is feeding me multiball.

I have used this common tactic here and William knows this in that moment in time. He has decided to push the ball long at me and I am anticipating this so I chose to pivot and try win the point. I did a good job here to use this tactic, but let's not talk too much about the end result of that point ;) haha.

Hope this makes sense and is clear


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PostPosted: 15 Jun 2018, 01:49 
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On the first return of the first point you did something that I've never done but it is so obvious: lean to the right for a backhand. I've been doing this stupid t-rex arm backhand thing when it goes to the shoulder or spins towards the shoulder. I guess for years and years my logic is that I should not lean to my right because I should just do a forehand there. I realized this last night doing some random backhand robot practice. This is just how bad my table tennis is.

It's also nice to know that top players also look like that when someone blocks down the line after a pivot :D


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PostPosted: 15 Jun 2018, 22:11 
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wilkinru wrote:
On the first return of the first point you did something that I've never done but it is so obvious: lean to the right for a backhand. I've been doing this stupid t-rex arm backhand thing when it goes to the shoulder or spins towards the shoulder. I guess for years and years my logic is that I should not lean to my right because I should just do a forehand there. I realized this last night doing some random backhand robot practice. This is just how bad my table tennis is.

It's also nice to know that top players also look like that when someone blocks down the line after a pivot :D



Hi Wilkinru,
"what do you mean by t-rex arm backhand thing when it goes to the shoulder or spins towards the shoulder?" Can you please show me in a video what this action is, so I can get a better understanding of what it is?

You CAN lean to the right to play a backhand but of course it has its advantages and disadvantages:

ADVages: you can play a backhand receive. In my personal opinion, and in the opinion of Richard Prause (Ex top50 player, timo boll's old coach), receiving serve with the backhand is easier, especially with the banana flick used these days. You are closer to the ball when receiving with backhand, as opposed to forehand. This makes it easier to be near the ball, allowing you to read the spin easier and have less room for error/misjudging the serve's length, spin/height etc

DISADVages: its a wide serve which isnt easy to get around to, and recover back from. Also if somebody starts to mix in long serves fast to your backhand, life can get difficult


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PostPosted: 15 Jun 2018, 22:40 
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Fascinating video and analysis, thank you. On the second point when you pivoted you hit the winner down the line. How do you decide when to go down the opponent's fh line and when to go wide to his backhand? Does it depend on where your body is relative to the table, or just a split-second decision?

I tend to go down the line too much. It's predictable and many balls get blocked back wide. But it's very hard to hit a powerful fh off the bh side of the table, there isn't a lot of margin for error.


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PostPosted: 15 Jun 2018, 22:58 
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BRS wrote:
Fascinating video and analysis, thank you. On the second point when you pivoted you hit the winner down the line. How do you decide when to go down the opponent's fh line and when to go wide to his backhand? Does it depend on where your body is relative to the table, or just a split-second decision?

I tend to go down the line too much. It's predictable and many balls get blocked back wide. But it's very hard to hit a powerful fh off the bh side of the table, there isn't a lot of margin for error.



Hi BRS,
Yes, hitting a powerful forehand is a hard shot, far more so against backspin. However, I will expand your options here with regards to placement. Tomorrow, I will make one video showing you exactly what I am about to tell you.

1.) If you stop at the exact moment that I have pivoted my body around, about to hit my pivot forehand, you will notice that my body is in a position where I can turn and hit the ball anywhere with my forehand. This is how you want to set up your pivot, left hip and left leg in front, right leg and hip behind.

2.) From this position, I have the following choices with regards to where I play my pivot:
-Crosscourt to William's backhand
-A fade away wider to William's backhand or to his middle pocket (I will show you this shot tomorrow)
-To William's middle/right pocket (This is the best option in general. Left pocket for playing against left handers)
-Down the line to William's forehand

So, playing crosscourt and down the line to an opponents racquet is generally not the best two options, as it is in the hitting zones of the opponent and they can fluke a reaction block back and it is quite difficult to get to this ball from a pivot.

Playing a fade away shot to a person's backhand wide or middle, is extremely tough to play against. It can be hit hard or slow, with some sidespin which makes it extremely hard to block against.

Playing to the middle pocket of an opponent is generally regarded as the best spot to play to an opponent. People can react quite fast and readily well when they need to just put their racket to either side. However, when the ball is directed right into their middle, they hesitate between using a forehand or a backhand and their reaction to this placement is a lot slower. You will see a lot of the top players, when they get a high ball or a chance to hit winners, their most common option is to the middle of an opponent.


Lastly, sometimes it is just a split-second reaction. It is easy to say that you want to play to a certain spot, but hard to always choose where you want to play a shot in the midst of a high octane match, when it is happening fast, etc. Sometimes you just have to hope that the place you played a shot is the right one. sometimes it will go your way, sometimes it won't. Both will happen to every player.


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PostPosted: 15 Jun 2018, 23:15 
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I've been trying to learn how to play fade pivots cross-court so that the opponent cannot block easily... At this moment I can do this against a slow high ball, like a popped-up serve return. But I struggle to do this against balls of reasonable quality. Does it make sense to fade a low, reasonably spinny push? Or it is better to hit straight against this one?


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