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PostPosted: 12 Feb 2019, 11:15 
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BRS wrote:
I'm at a league now and in my first match had the most complete loss of focus collapse in a long time. I won a close first set and was up 7-1 and then 9-2 in the second. The opponent is an old guy who is a legend here, roughly 2100. I've played him twice before, losing in five and three.

Anyway up a set and a shitload, I started enjoying the win, writing the post in my head, completely out of the match. Nine points later it was 1-1. You can picture the rest.

It's on video, so I'll post it tomorrow so you can see the full horror of it.

He also started playing better, and found plays that worked. But not going up 2-0 was 100% on me.


Sure, I await the video. It is quite possible you aren't giving your opponent enough credit. I have been up like that on many players who out rate me by 200 pts and lost. It is sometimes about me being honest with myself about whether o was really ready to win that match or not. In this case though I doubt he was that .uch better than you but if it is who I think it is, he is a wily old time who can always bring out a very high level at any moment. More of a hitter than a looper.

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PostPosted: 12 Feb 2019, 11:20 
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David Sakai. I fully give him credit for the last three sets. But the second set was a total mental wipeout by me, I stopped paying attention to the game and was enjoying like a happy daydream of victory.

But life goes on. I came back from 0-2 down to Charlene, so I will have one pleasant video to look at.

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PostPosted: 12 Feb 2019, 11:36 
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fastmover wrote:
Brett Clarke wrote:
Speaking of strategy/tactics, I'm back working on PTTP. I really want to get 50 videos in the series.


I'd like to see a video about the aggressive pivot from LTT29. Playing points without the proper technique is a waste of time!


Yeah, what good is it all if you don't have the right technique, right?

All Jokes aside, I've had the big LTT29 on my list for a while. I just need the right footage.

Let's see if you can see if you can solve this riddle first. How does one make their arm go from low, to high, and then back to low again, to almost complete a circle? Once solved, I'll tell you how to do the aggressive one.

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PostPosted: 12 Feb 2019, 11:44 
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BRS wrote:
David Sakai. I fully give him credit for the last three sets. But the second set was a total mental wipeout by me, I stopped paying attention to the game and was enjoying like a happy daydream of victory.

But life goes on. I came back from 0-2 down to Charlene, so I will have one pleasant video to look at.

I knew it was Sakai. Watching the match will be interesting but he is so experienced and crafty that I can imagine you being unable to consistently loop through him.

As for thinking ahead, as long as you are positive it is not a rationalization after the fact. He may just have been playing like crap the first two games.

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PostPosted: 12 Feb 2019, 13:15 
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Brett Clarke wrote:
fastmover wrote:
Brett Clarke wrote:
Speaking of strategy/tactics, I'm back working on PTTP. I really want to get 50 videos in the series.


I'd like to see a video about the aggressive pivot from LTT29. Playing points without the proper technique is a waste of time!


Yeah, what good is it all if you don't have the right technique, right?

All Jokes aside, I've had the big LTT29 on my list for a while. I just need the right footage.

Let's see if you can see if you can solve this riddle first. How does one make their arm go from low, to high, and then back to low again, to almost complete a circle? Once solved, I'll tell you how to do the aggressive one.


I think I know what you are talking about. I think I can do the motion (see the DTT29 footage in discord), but can't explain the mechanics.

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PostPosted: 12 Feb 2019, 19:49 
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Richfs wrote:
NextLevel wrote:

Does he give you tips to control his ball better? Do you ask for tips?


I have asked for tips but he says it's difficult for him to see from where he stands. It has just sort of been some general tips like you're using too much arm on FH or something like that. Difficult to ask too much as he wants to train, not sure how much I could get out of him. I don't know how much it bothers him that I miss some blocks as there's not really anyone here (including me) who can block that well for him but I'd like to do a better job.

Not much to do than record next time and try to figure it out I suppose. I have some footage from September when I trained with him last. Can't remember if I'd joined ttedge by then but I certainly wasn't bowing on my blocks then and I'm not sure I was today.


You are getting something out of it without even realising I'll bet. When I played with much stronger players I couldn't block for them either, until I could. It forced me to adapt. Takes time though. Of he doesn't have any other better sparring partners I'd be trying to train with this guy as much as possible. Don't think so much about what you are doing either, that's probably causing conscious muscle control issues more than anything else. Let body adjust naturally as in that LTT Brett did with NL and Ben.


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PostPosted: 13 Feb 2019, 00:41 
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I noticed that the quality of my game to a great extent depends on how satisfied I am with the warmup drills. I usually do some 10-20 mins warmup when I arrive at the club; having completed it, I start playing matches and normally don't do drills anymore. So it appears that my entire evening of TT depends on how well I do the first 10-20 mins and who my partner is. I know that doing the drills with some (usually lower skilled) players would ruin my evening as I wouldn't be able to land any shot on the table; on the other hand, warming up with some other players provides me with confidence and energy.
I'm especially concerned about tournaments since there's rarely a chance to have a good and extensive warmup with a suitable partner. And without having a proper warmup, I'm feeling that my game is falling apart.

Is there a way to reduce the importance of the initial warmup? I see that some people can play with virtually no warmup, and their game doesn't seem to suffer from that.

Or is there a way to increase the quality of the warmup, even with a less skilled partner, so it doesn't have a negative impact on my game?


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PostPosted: 13 Feb 2019, 00:53 
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ziv wrote:
I noticed that the quality of my game to a great extent depends on how satisfied I am with the warmup drills. I usually do some 10-20 mins warmup when I arrive at the club; having completed it, I start playing matches and normally don't do drills anymore. So it appears that my entire evening of TT depends on how well I do the first 10-20 mins and who my partner is. I know that doing the drills with some (usually lower skilled) players would ruin my evening as I wouldn't be able to land any shot on the table; on the other hand, warming up with some other players provides me with confidence and energy.
I'm especially concerned about tournaments since there's rarely a chance to have a good and extensive warmup with a suitable partner. And without having a proper warmup, I'm feeling that my game is falling apart.

Is there a way to reduce the importance of the initial warmup? I see that some people can play with virtually no warmup, and their game doesn't seem to suffer from that.

Or is there a way to increase the quality of the warmup, even with a less skilled partner, so it doesn't have a negative impact on my game?


Well it depends on the quality of your strokes as well and what you think you are doing in the warm up. If you know how to loop slowly enough that the ball is easy enough to block for someone who must puts the racket there and can at least repeat the same motion, that is one thing. But I find that most players at the level I suspect you are don't take responsibility for controlling their loops.

It is also another thing I'd you are using the warmup to get the juices flowing vs thinking it is necessary to play well. If you think it is absolutely necessary to play well, that puts pressure on you to find a good blocker. But if you think you just want to get in shots to let you practice a little, then you have more leeway

The other thing is to get better serves. This stabilizes your performance especially against significantly worse opposition. Playing with more control over your spin by learning how to accelerate the wrist and the forearm at the right time in the shot also helps..

But in reality everyone wants to warm up against a good block. But don't think about it in terms of playing level think about it in terms of getting warmed up. Shadow swinging can sometimes help too. Ultimately, the key is to try to put yourself in the mindset to play good TT. Letting the degree of warmup affect your playing level is not the way to go. Just use a different strategy until you feel you have warmed up your shots.

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PostPosted: 13 Feb 2019, 01:07 
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NextLevel wrote:
Well it depends on the quality of your strokes as well and what you think you are doing in the warm up. If you know how to loop slowly enough that the ball is easy enough to block for someone who must puts the racket there and can at least repeat the same motion, that is one thing. But I find that most players at the level I suspect you are don't take responsibility for controlling their loops.

It is also another thing I'd you are using the warmup to get the juices flowing vs thinking it is necessary to play well. If you think it is absolutely necessary to play well, that puts pressure on you to find a good blocker. But if you think you just want to get in shots to let you practice a little, then you have more leeway

The other thing is to get better serves. This stabilizes your performance especially against significantly worse opposition. Playing with more control over your spin by learning how to accelerate the wrist and the forearm at the right time in the shot also helps..

But in reality everyone wants to warm up against a good block. But don't think about it in terms of playing level think about it in terms of getting warmed up. Shadow swinging can sometimes help too. Ultimately, the key is to try to put yourself in the mindset to play good TT. Letting the degree of warmup affect your playing level is not the way to go. Just use a different strategy until you feel you have warmed up your shots.

NL, thanks for the reply!

I didn't mean to say that it's the level of a partner that affects my warmup - in fact, some lower level players make a great warmup partner if they're disciplined enough to keep the ball on course (e.g. Fh-FH), etc. On the other hand, some (although a very small number) of more skilled players don't let me warm up properly by instantly going from one corner to another, serving weird spin, etc - that just isn't what I'm looking for for a warmup.

I think your advice about not thinking of warmup as being necessary to play well makes great sense, I will try that. It does put a lot of pressure on me since I start thinking that I won't play well tonight because of my dissatisfaction with the warmup.

Your point about getting in the mindset to play good TT is also great.
I think my real question is - how do I get in that mindset, with or without a warmup? Physical warmup and shadow swinging are necessary but I feel I require some good warmup play to get there.


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PostPosted: 13 Feb 2019, 01:27 
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On some days, step to the table and play without warning up as long as you are physically warmed up. Don't injure yourself by playing without any blood flow, but don't warm up to your satisfaction. See how it goes. With practice it gets better. And then you actually have evidence of what to adjust in those situations.

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PostPosted: 13 Feb 2019, 01:41 
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When I play a tournament I usually try to prearrange the warm-up with someone I know.

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PostPosted: 13 Feb 2019, 01:48 
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fastmover wrote:
When I play a tournament I usually try to prearrange the warm-up with someone I know.

Yeah, I should try that, too.

Does warmup have a big impact on your game?


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PostPosted: 13 Feb 2019, 02:00 
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NextLevel wrote:
BRS wrote:
I'm at a league now and in my first match had the most complete loss of focus collapse in a long time. I won a close first set and was up 7-1 and then 9-2 in the second. The opponent is an old guy who is a legend here, roughly 2100. I've played him twice before, losing in five and three.

Anyway up a set and a shitload, I started enjoying the win, writing the post in my head, completely out of the match. Nine points later it was 1-1. You can picture the rest.

It's on video, so I'll post it tomorrow so you can see the full horror of it.

He also started playing better, and found plays that worked. But not going up 2-0 was 100% on me.


Sure, I await the video. It is quite possible you aren't giving your opponent enough credit. I have been up like that on many players who out rate me by 200 pts and lost. It is sometimes about me being honest with myself about whether o was really ready to win that match or not. In this case though I doubt he was that .uch better than you but if it is who I think it is, he is a wily old time who can always bring out a very high level at any moment. More of a hitter than a looper.


Video https://youtu.be/Q5GsEZbmcE4

I didn't really watch it, just edited. I'll look at some frames later. Even at live speed it was obvious that my BH was unusually solid at the start and fell off later. I couldn't tell if he changed something, or it really was just mental, or simple reversion to the mean.

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PostPosted: 13 Feb 2019, 02:01 
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ziv wrote:
fastmover wrote:
When I play a tournament I usually try to prearrange the warm-up with someone I know.

Yeah, I should try that, too.

Does warmup have a big impact on your game?


Yes, warmup is super important. Before a tournament I try to do a full routine and finish with some sets. Takes about 40 - 60 minutes counting physical warmup beforehand.

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PostPosted: 13 Feb 2019, 02:08 
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Yes, warm-up is very important, especially if the hall is not familiar. When I warm-up I pay special attention to practicing opening loops and serve-and-attack kind of sequences, I need to do at least 10-15 min of those.

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