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PostPosted: 07 Jul 2019, 10:57 
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I bought lots of pips but never used with a sponge. The question is whether it is very different to use sponge pips, whether it gets faster or less control, advantages and disadvantages? I really need advice to know what direction to go.


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PostPosted: 07 Jul 2019, 16:01 
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bateranash wrote:
I bought lots of pips but never used with a sponge. The question is whether it is very different to use sponge pips, whether it gets faster or less control, advantages and disadvantages? I really need advice to know what direction to go.


I guess, it first depends on your style of play & skill ..Then, there're secondary factors such as the LP itself, you're using, and also the blade....

I play with both, and feel there're pros and cons to both .... here's my thoughts...

  • Most (Not all) OX LPs, will give more reversal than most sponged LPs
  • I feel (but, it would depend on the LP/sponge and blade) that most sponged LPs would a better @ absorbing pace, especially when blocking... This could also be due to more direct contact with the wood, in case of OX
  • The word is that, generally, with sponged LP, one can create more spin, as compared to OX, due to the increased dwell time ...
  • Although, I don't (know how to), I've been told that with sponged LPs, one can achieve more variation in spin and speed.
  • I hear that it's Easier to hit with grippy sponged LPs, compared to grippy OK Lps...

Personally, I'm leaning to towards thin (0.5-0.7mm) sponged LPs, nowadays. Especially against consistent power-loopers.... I've played with thin-sponged versions of D.tecs, and Palio CK531A, and quite like both...

I've ordered a sheet of Yinhe Neptune, in 0.7mm... This time, to try a grippy'er LP, with sponge, to chop (or, I should say, try to ) , around mid-distance from the table

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Setup 1 : GKI Euro XX Blade Xiom Vega Europe Max (Black) Bomb Talent OX (Red)
Setup 2 : 729 C-5 Blade Reactor Corbor Max (Black) Dawei 388D-1 OX (Red)
Setup 3 : Donic Defplay Senso V3 Blade Palio AK-47 Blue Max (Black) Palio CK531A 0.6mm (Red)
Setup 4 : XVT Hinoki Balsa Carbon Blade 729 Focus III Snipe 40° Max (Black) Pogo OX (Red)
Setup 5 : Butterfly Joyner-H Blade (Black Metal Tag) Palio AK-47 Yellow Max (Black) Yasaka Mark V Max (Red)


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PostPosted: 08 Jul 2019, 10:18 
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My thoughts

Most LP choppers use or used sponge.
Most close to the table blockers have used OX for better reversal (reality is continuation).

I am looking at the question for my play as I am transitioning into a close to the table LP player who tries to win by setting up my FH. I find hard, fast, stiff blades are very difficult with OX and I need some sponge to hit and even to block-but I cannot chop with them.

For fast offensive blades with flex I am finding OX works ok for hitting, blocking and I can step back and chop. I am leaning in this direction.

OP. What are you trying to do with your LP?


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PostPosted: 08 Jul 2019, 13:36 
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With new balls I found that I had better control with some sponge. Some players in the forum found the same thing. Some sponge with "slippery" pips plays close to same as ox. The grippy pips with sponge is quite different thing alltogether. Now I back to ox, as Troublemaker ox is somewhat similar to slippery pips with some sponge with added dwell.


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PostPosted: 09 Jul 2019, 08:49 
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vanjr wrote:
My thoughts

Most LP choppers use or used sponge.
Most close to the table blockers have used OX for better reversal (reality is continuation).

I am looking at the question for my play as I am transitioning into a close to the table LP player who tries to win by setting up my FH. I find hard, fast, stiff blades are very difficult with OX and I need some sponge to hit and even to block-but I cannot chop with them.

For fast offensive blades with flex I am finding OX works ok for hitting, blocking and I can step back and chop. I am leaning in this direction.

OP. What are you trying to do with your LP?

I'm looking for more control. When the opponent loops or hits but the ball is jumping off my racket off the table.


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PostPosted: 09 Jul 2019, 08:55 
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ootbs wrote:
bateranash wrote:
I bought lots of pips but never used with a sponge. The question is whether it is very different to use sponge pips, whether it gets faster or less control, advantages and disadvantages? I really need advice to know what direction to go.


I guess, it first depends on your style of play & skill ..Then, there're secondary factors such as the LP itself, you're using, and also the blade....

I play with both, and feel there're pros and cons to both .... here's my thoughts...

  • Most (Not all) OX LPs, will give more reversal than most sponged LPs
  • I feel (but, it would depend on the LP/sponge and blade) that most sponged LPs would a better @ absorbing pace, especially when blocking... This could also be due to more direct contact with the wood, in case of OX
  • The word is that, generally, with sponged LP, one can create more spin, as compared to OX, due to the increased dwell time ...
  • Although, I don't (know how to), I've been told that with sponged LPs, one can achieve more variation in spin and speed.
  • I hear that it's Easier to hit with grippy sponged LPs, compared to grippy OK Lps...

Personally, I'm leaning to towards thin (0.5-0.7mm) sponged LPs, nowadays. Especially against consistent power-loopers.... I've played with thin-sponged versions of D.tecs, and Palio CK531A, and quite like both...

I've ordered a sheet of Yinhe Neptune, in 0.7mm... This time, to try a grippy'er LP, with sponge, to chop (or, I should say, try to ) , around mid-distance from the table


Thanks a lot, I really enjoyed your review!


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PostPosted: 09 Jul 2019, 08:57 
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Roy wrote:
With new balls I found that I had better control with some sponge. Some players in the forum found the same thing. Some sponge with "slippery" pips plays close to same as ox. The grippy pips with sponge is quite different thing alltogether. Now I back to ox, as Troublemaker ox is somewhat similar to slippery pips with some sponge with added dwell.


Troublemaker ox or sponge?


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PostPosted: 09 Jul 2019, 12:19 
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bateranash wrote:
Roy wrote:
With new balls I found that I had better control with some sponge. Some players in the forum found the same thing. Some sponge with "slippery" pips plays close to same as ox. The grippy pips with sponge is quite different thing alltogether. Now I back to ox, as Troublemaker ox is somewhat similar to slippery pips with some sponge with added dwell.


Troublemaker ox or sponge?


Looks like OX

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PostPosted: 09 Jul 2019, 15:25 
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bateranash wrote:
I'm looking for more control. When the opponent loops or hits but the ball is jumping off my racket off the table.
Sponge can help absorb the pace if you're a chopper and have decent technique. If you mainly block or do not chop down on the ball, a sponge can make it worse, depending on the type of sponge. Dampening sponges help take the pace off best.

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PostPosted: 09 Jul 2019, 21:29 
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haggisv wrote:
bateranash wrote:
I'm looking for more control. When the opponent loops or hits but the ball is jumping off my racket off the table.
Sponge can help absorb the pace if you're a chopper and have decent technique. If you mainly block or do not chop down on the ball, a sponge can make it worse, depending on the type of sponge. Dampening sponges help take the pace off best.


I second haggisv for some of his answer-most LP with sponge however do not have dampening sponge. If you want control and are a blocker, OX LP (and a slower blade-a fast hard blade is difficult with sponge.)
If you are a chopper, I still think OX is more controllable. Sponge helps with far table chops, pushes vs under spin and hits, but most of the time does not help control.


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PostPosted: 09 Jul 2019, 22:20 
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bateranash wrote:
vanjr wrote:
My thoughts

Most LP choppers use or used sponge.
Most close to the table blockers have used OX for better reversal (reality is continuation).

I am looking at the question for my play as I am transitioning into a close to the table LP player who tries to win by setting up my FH. I find hard, fast, stiff blades are very difficult with OX and I need some sponge to hit and even to block-but I cannot chop with them.

For fast offensive blades with flex I am finding OX works ok for hitting, blocking and I can step back and chop. I am leaning in this direction.

OP. What are you trying to do with your LP?

I'm looking for more control. When the opponent loops or hits but the ball is jumping off my racket off the table.


With D.Tecs the ball bounces more then my Dr.N VIper. This one is awesome for close to table (chop)block. Because the sponge it's easier to 'attack' the ball when they push the ball to you. I have more difficulty with the chop far form table. With teh D.Tecs that was easier/better ... but as i'm a close to the table player I use the Dr.VIper.
It hardly bounces if you make a chopblock motion ....
I use 0.5/0.6 spounge.

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PostPosted: 10 Jul 2019, 02:03 
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I'm still a novice (switched to LP 5 months ago but being formally coached) but I think that the answer really depends on your style of play. Certain things works really well with OX and some are horrible with OX. I think it also depends on if you play with a fairly slick LP like Dtecs or something skinny like P1R. I also depends a lot on if you stay close to the table or not.

I personally typically chop in order to open up an opportunity to loop or smash with my inverted but I also really value the possibility to hit through backspin with my LP or counter topspin if they try to pin me down on my LP side. Doing things without sponge is absolutely harmless against the level of players that I typically meet as the hits are simply too slow and wobbly balls is not an issue to them.


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PostPosted: 10 Jul 2019, 05:09 
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Over the years I've experimented with different sponge thicknesses under long pips, but with a style that's based on being close to the table and using blocks and chop blocks, I've always gone back to OX. Especially with the new ball, if you want to play close to the table, OX is the best unless you are going to be an all out attacker. Using long pips with 1.0 sponge (for example) close to the table for defense will get you killed. You'd have to aggressively counter hit to be able to change up the pace enough to bother most players. While yes, it is easier to attack with a little sponge, what you gain in consistency you lose in effectiveness, because then the sponge causes it to act more like medium or short pips.

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PostPosted: 10 Jul 2019, 06:30 
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mart1nandersson wrote:
I'm still a novice (switched to LP 5 months ago but being formally coached) but I think that the answer really depends on your style of play. Certain things works really well with OX and some are horrible with OX. I think it also depends on if you play with a fairly slick LP like Dtecs or something skinny like P1R. I also depends a lot on if you stay close to the table or not.

I personally typically chop in order to open up an opportunity to loop or smash with my inverted but I also really value the possibility to hit through backspin with my LP or counter topspin if they try to pin me down on my LP side. Doing things without sponge is absolutely harmless against the level of players that I typically meet as the hits are simply too slow and wobbly balls is not an issue to them.



Well, OX at high levels still does work. Manika Batra being one example. Outside of the top 100, I think it's fair game. Now, if you mean passive play with OX blocking... that has a much lower ceiling. But if you have a good forehand attack, then it really doesn't matter what rubber is on your backhand!

I think OX LP hitting is still quite deadly with the grippy versions. You can hit against top spin and control the game, regardless of what they hit at you. Now, it's basically like playing with a slightly more 'disruptive' medium or short pip at that point. Mainly dead balls or perhaps slight reversal if you give a tiny chop-block.

If all you have is the blocking element, then it only takes a somewhat decent player with a good strategy to bring you down. I've been there...!!

For people playing at the table and blocking, OX seems to be their best bet. If you hit aggressively, tack on some sponge. I like the grippy OX versions, as they allow me to chop but also smack with good consistency if the paddy-cake player emerges.

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PostPosted: 10 Jul 2019, 23:25 
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When I hit with the Trouble Maker OX it forces a lot of mistakes, even against players rated a bit above 2000 USATT. Something like 755 is easier to hit with, but easier for opponents to return.

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