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PostPosted: 23 Sep 2019, 01:45 
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Darth Pips
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Location: Cudahy, WI, USA
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Blade: Dr Neubauer Matador
FH: Tibhar Evolution MX-P 1.9
BH: Dr N ABS2 Soft
Played a giant round robin event on Friday night with the TM with 0.6 mm sponge, and it performed very well. There were a couple of other LP players in my group, and they were surprised at the pip effect and slowness that I was able to get with the sponge. They felt it played like an OX pip, which is a very good sign. I do believe it helped me when hitting and pushing to have a little more stability and control. I only got into trouble with it when I tried hitting too hard. Controlled, medium speed attacks are plenty effective and have a strong sinking effect that caused even 2000 US level players to have a lot of difficulty lifting them enough to return without going long. I think I will be switching to the 0.6 mm sponge as my permanent set-up.

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"The greatest teacher, failure is"
USATT Rating: 1712
Blade: Dr Neubauer Matador
FH Rubber: Tibhar Evolution MX-P 1.9
BH Rubber: Testing various frictionless antis, including Dr N ABS2 Soft, DMS Scandal, DMS Diabolic Extra Slow


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PostPosted: 23 Sep 2019, 09:37 
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What is the durability of this rubber?


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PostPosted: 23 Sep 2019, 19:18 
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Blade: Sauer and Troger Zeus
FH: Xiom vega Asia DF
BH: Dr Neubauer Troublemaker
isean wrote:
What is the durability of this rubber?


The durability of Troublemaker is very good. I have played with Troublemaker in ox, since March of this year and have lost no pimples. It plays better as time goes by.


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PostPosted: 23 Sep 2019, 21:03 
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Blade: TSP Trinity Carbon
FH: Joola Golden Tango 1.8mm
BH: Tibhar Grass Detecs OX
Gollum wrote:
charmander defender wrote:

I really feel satisfied and content when my dear forum members who use similar tt material / style as mine have the same impressions regarding TM and DG .

Yes, it is really sensible to use TM for the low spin and defensive players as the slowness does help with the non spin balls and rallies pip against pip whereas DG's disruption makes aggressive players harder to reloop and they also make many more mistakes .

Just for the DG setup with Grubba all+ I changed the inverted to Nittaku Jammin 1.4 and as we have been discussing in other threads, DG blocks differently, in this case much better than with Thibar SD 40 +.It's incredible how the fh rubber affects the lp performance !! .

..and the Grubba all + keeps working fantastic with both DG and TM . Thank you mynamenotbob for the suggestion at that time .

Perhaps Gollum might explain to us the advantages of D. Techs over DG with different opponents because for me a 2 way approach is enough . :lol:

"charmander defender"Just a matter of experiment & rediscovery. I used D. Techs quite some time ago when I used Re-Impact Smart & found it very disruptive but a bit unpredictable, when I went to the Trinity Carbon I used the DG for quite a while but then found the D.Techs also worked very well with this blade. My LP of choice at the moment is TM but having a bag full of blades I find there are times when they each work well |( :up:


HI Gollum, Do you think that TM is easier to play against no spin players? I had some problems with detecs against veteran players who didnt use spin. Maybe I should try TM against them? Can you change racket after game to another. I mean how long it takes to adapt between TM and Detecs? Ive been thinking to use 2 different rackets against different opponents?

Soba


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PostPosted: 23 Sep 2019, 22:13 
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Darth Pips
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Joined: 26 Jun 2007, 03:59
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Location: Cudahy, WI, USA
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Blade: Dr Neubauer Matador
FH: Tibhar Evolution MX-P 1.9
BH: Dr N ABS2 Soft
In my opinion the biggest difference between DTecS and TM is the speed. TM is significantly slower and easier to control. If you can adjust to the different speed, you would be fine.

_________________
"The greatest teacher, failure is"
USATT Rating: 1712
Blade: Dr Neubauer Matador
FH Rubber: Tibhar Evolution MX-P 1.9
BH Rubber: Testing various frictionless antis, including Dr N ABS2 Soft, DMS Scandal, DMS Diabolic Extra Slow


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PostPosted: 24 Sep 2019, 00:17 
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My Precious
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Joined: 25 May 2012, 20:02
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Location: Adelaide Australia
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Blade: Trinity Carbon
FH: Joola Golden Tango
BH: Troublemaker OX
dwruck wrote:
In my opinion the biggest difference between DTecS and TM is the speed. TM is significantly slower and easier to control. If you can adjust to the different speed, you would be fine.

Soba I agree with Dwruck Both DG & DTecs both great LPs for me but with TM I have much more control :up: :clap:
But changing where possible has at times given me problems adjusting & at the moment I would probably stay with TM :clap:

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Setup 1: Blade: TSP Trinity Carbon | Joola Golden Tango black 1.8mm FH & Tibhar Grass D. TecS OX red BH
Setup 2: Blade: TSP Trinity Carbon | Joola Golden Tango PS black 2.0mm FH & Troublemaker OX red BH
Setup 3: Blade: TSP Trinity Carbon | Joola Golden Tango black 1.8mm FH & & Spinlord Dornenglanz OX red BH

See the ball, be the ball...


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PostPosted: 24 Sep 2019, 03:05 
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Blade: Grubba all+
FH: Moristo DF 1.2 :)))
BH: DG ox/Globe 979 ox
Gollum wrote:
dwruck wrote:
In my opinion the biggest difference between DTecS and TM is the speed. TM is significantly slower and easier to control. If you can adjust to the different speed, you would be fine.

Soba I agree with Dwruck Both DG & DTecs both great LPs for me but with TM I have much more control :up: :clap:
But changing where possible has at times given me problems adjusting & at the moment I would probably stay with TM :clap:


Been to a new tournament. In my opinion,Tm works best with no spin ball opponents, lp/ sp pips players. For loopers DG or D.techs works best since relooping is harder for them and they make many more mistakes.This is my experience with high level players .

A good looper will finally kill you in the 4th / 5th loop so Tm's consistency is not enough at that level, however, when I used DG they made mistakes when relooping . This is my humble experience . :)


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PostPosted: 24 Sep 2019, 22:39 
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Im currently playing with TM in ox on a S&G firestarter. I can say it's the best combo I have ever tried.

Troublemaker is the most versatile LP I have tried, there is really nothing it does badly.

What it does best is controlling loops with chop blocking and its very easy to get balls back on the table. Attacking is one of the best treats, very easy to attack both underspin and floating balls.

Gives it my best recomendations.

Kind regards

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RE-IMPACT BARATH
SpinLord Stachelfeuer OX
Andro HD 2,0
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PostPosted: 25 Sep 2019, 22:43 
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Blade: TSP Trinity Carbon
FH: Joola Golden Tango 1.8mm
BH: Tibhar Grass Detecs OX
charmander defender wrote:
Gollum wrote:
dwruck wrote:
In my opinion the biggest difference between DTecS and TM is the speed. TM is significantly slower and easier to control. If you can adjust to the different speed, you would be fine.

Soba I agree with Dwruck Both DG & DTecs both great LPs for me but with TM I have much more control :up: :clap:
But changing where possible has at times given me problems adjusting & at the moment I would probably stay with TM :clap:


Been to a new tournament. In my opinion,Tm works best with no spin ball opponents, lp/ sp pips players. For loopers DG or D.techs works best since relooping is harder for them and they make many more mistakes.This is my experience with high level players .

A good looper will finally kill you in the 4th / 5th loop so Tm's consistency is not enough at that level, however, when I used DG they made mistakes when relooping . This is my humble experience . :)


Can you change TM to DG in the tournament when you see next match is against looper or vice verse? i have now tried to change detcs and TM . I mean I first play one match with TM then I change it to DG in next match. I can adapt quite easily.

Soba


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PostPosted: 26 Sep 2019, 06:50 
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Blade: Grubba all+
FH: Moristo DF 1.2 :)))
BH: DG ox/Globe 979 ox
Can you change TM to DG in the tournament when you see next match is against looper or vice verse? i have now tried to change detcs and TM . I mean I first play one match with TM then I change it to DG in next match. I can adapt quite easily.

Soba



Yes, this is what I currently do at tournaments.Against Lp / Sp and no spin opponents TM, against loopers , DG. Yes, I can also adapt quite easily . :)


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PostPosted: 26 Sep 2019, 08:13 
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My two pennies: Ruling allows (hopefully I am right!) a change in equipment between maches but not between games in a match. So yes. For me (personally) I find a change in equipment challenging to adapt and enjoy (even in pratice) as my muscle and brain memory are well tuned to my two main same setups which I use effectively and enjoy against all opposition - win or lose! :D


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PostPosted: 29 Sep 2019, 01:41 
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I have been away from the forum for a long time. Enjoyed reading all 25 pages of reviews on Trouble Maker. Had my first hits with TM yesterday at a Senior Center nearby on a Firewall + blade that I had not used in 13 years. Will try another blade today with the Chattanooga Table Tennis Club. As I approached 70 years of age I began thinking of returning to slower blades like Firewall+(used by Pushblocker )which I used in my 3rd, 4th and Fifth USATT tournaments in 2006 when I was 57..used Super Block then...In tournaments 6 thru 10 I used All+/Off- Donic Cayman. For the last decade and through USATT tournament number 90 I moved away from defensive use of LP'S to Aggressive Attacking. My rubbers have been Tensor SP's or Juic 999Turbo inverted and Giant Dragon Talon OX and then Giant Dragon Talon National Team OX. Outside of tournaments I have experimented with all kinds of LP's OX. My tournament blade for the past decade or so has been TSP 8.5 Balsa/carbon which is an extremely fast OFF+ blade. My highest rating has been 1846 and is now 1682. Have not played USATT tournament in a couple of years in Atlanta, GA. I spent March and April of 2019 in China, and received free training in Shanghai from a number of coaches. A goal is to be able to use LP OX effective on the FH as well as BH. While in China I hit with Nittaku Wallest One(OX)..Found it be be the first LP(it is considered a hitting LP) that I could get out of kindergarten with on FH. TM may be the answer. With only one hour of hitting with TM on a blade I had not used in 13 years one thing stood out above all the rest in comparison to Giant Dragon Talon National Team OX... a lower trajectory and lower bounce after hitting the table from the TM (and Talon National Team stands out as strong in that arena). Additionally, I felt this is going to be an easy LP to master.. I did hit really well with a few punch blocks. Will post more later. PS..I enjoyed all the posts and it was great to read ones from those I admire here such as: hassisv, nathanso, mynamenotbob, and the guy from the great Badger state, dwruck.

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Blade: TSP 8.5 Balsa: FH Andro Blowfish+ 2.0 (Black);BH Giant Dragon National Team Talon OX(Red)
Blade: TSP 8.5 Balsa: FH TSP Spectol Blue 2.0-2.1 (Black); BH Strahlkraft OX (Red)
Blade: TSP 8.5 Balsa: FH Joola Express Ultra Max (Black): BH Dornenglanz II OX (Red)

USATT Rating: 1682


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PostPosted: 29 Sep 2019, 06:19 
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Blade: Grubba all+
FH: Moristo DF 1.2 :)))
BH: DG ox/Globe 979 ox
The more you use TM, the better it gets,... the less friction, the better results ,....( for my style of play )

the less friction, the slower it gets,...... the less friction, the more control,... the slower, the shorter the blocks ,......

It makes the opponent pass the ball gently, then, if you twiddle all right, the opponent is taken by surprise by the inverted .

I am currently playing against high level players and when I twiddle I get the point,however, if I continually block with Tm, there comes a time when the consistency is not enough and the looper gets the point eventually .

I have never heard of anyone putting down Tm, except those , who due to their particular style, have lost pips . I rarely hit, hence, the durability of any LP extends greatly .

The next idea for manufacturers to be implemented is to create a TM -like rubber with massive spin reversal, and weird low trajectories . Then, we would not miss the FL pips so much :lol: .... but it does seem Tm has already been succesful for many dear forum members, which creates a unity in feeling :lol:


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PostPosted: 29 Sep 2019, 22:00 
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I am now a much chuffed owner of a TSP Balsa 2.5 Def with Dr. N TM (Black) OX. Thanks a million Char Def for the blade and the TM. I glued a sheet of 61 Second Lightning DS in 1.8 thickness on the FH and gave the setup a try at my club today.

What an ideal setup to complement my control oriented game. With TM I was able to consistently play clever placements on service returns and also during rallies. I rarely missed! There was good reversal too but I felt it was not as significant and disruptive as Bomb Talent which I normally use. I can honestly say TM exceeds BT in the control department. It blocks very short and low and forces many errors due to the sheer slow pace. I won many a point also by serving low and close to the net with TM catching opponents out by surprise. The FH too offered great control with good feel and enough speed for me when blocking and attacking with the inverted.

Sadly there were no power loopers at the club today but the opponents I tested TM against were certainly no pushovers since they play regular competition and have many years of playing experience against varied styles and equipment. It was easy work against a friend (a pretty good attacker on both wings) who uses a Stiga offensive blade with some version of Hurricane on FH and Yasaka Anti Power on BH. I was in total control.

Against strong and consistent loopers, I presume short and low blocks from TM will not suffice as active FH play and attacks will be essential to put them under some pressure to give oneself a chance.

As an avid fun & recreational LP player I would summarize TM as being a very versatile and easy to play LP offering great control with slow speed. :up:

I look forward to testing TM further (with confidence I add) against power loopers :topspin: when they are next at the club.


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PostPosted: 30 Sep 2019, 06:31 
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Had 3 hours practice at the club yesterday. Used TSP Balsa 8.5 OFF+ blade with TM OX Black and Moristo SP 2.0. As mentioned in my first impression, low trajectory and low bounce held to be true. Will set up a mirror blade with TM Red OX for comparison later. My second impression has to do with "Control". When I advise new LP OX players on their selection of blade/rubbers to use I generally suggest a Def+ to All+ blade for better control and to start with what I have come to believe is one of the best LP rubbers that does everything LPs can do well while maintaining excellent control....that is Pogo...Secondly, perhaps Easy P.... I found the TM to have almost unheard of control on all my shots, including attacking hits with TM on the FH. I could not control Pogo or Easy P so quickly. I am certain I will find the weakness(s) of TM at some point but it seems to me that the ability to maintain control while creating deception via ball position and speed variation is a huge advantage to this rubber. It took a full 6 months before I felt comfortable in mastering Talon OX on such a fast blade...Already at that level with TM now. My initial belief is that this is probably the best LP OX from Neubauer since SB. Not only is this a good all around rubber as noted by others here, but it seems to be a beast as an aggressive offensive weapon. Finally, of note, very insensitive to serves.

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Blade: TSP 8.5 Balsa: FH Andro Blowfish+ 2.0 (Black);BH Giant Dragon National Team Talon OX(Red)
Blade: TSP 8.5 Balsa: FH TSP Spectol Blue 2.0-2.1 (Black); BH Strahlkraft OX (Red)
Blade: TSP 8.5 Balsa: FH Joola Express Ultra Max (Black): BH Dornenglanz II OX (Red)

USATT Rating: 1682


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