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PostPosted: 12 May 2021, 07:19 
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Blade: Stiga 2000 ALL '76
FH: DHS H3N
BH: DrN ABS2 2.3
skilless_slapper wrote:
Sponged lp is more like playing with medium or short pips. You need to be very aggressive, going for pressuring hits and if you don't... as mentioned, the ball will be of little threat. They force you to be offensive in nature. Like he zhoujia from China, for example.

Coming from frictionless anti... the mindset is totally different, along with the play style.

Basically, the easier it is to attack with, the easier it will be to return. So you must decide which element is most important to you. Are you going to be hitting every shot? Or wanting to block a good deal?

Thanks skilless_slaper! Before switching to frictionless anti, I used to actually play medium pips (Dr N Diamant) for many years so I have an idea on the style though obviously it would take time to go back to an aggressive style.
With the plastic balls, reversal itself is not going to win you matches anymore so I thought to try something else.

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PostPosted: 12 May 2021, 07:59 
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Blade: SOULSPIN DEFENSE
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Matt Pimple wrote:
skilless_slapper wrote:
Sponged lp is more like playing with medium or short pips. You need to be very aggressive, going for pressuring hits and if you don't... as mentioned, the ball will be of little threat. They force you to be offensive in nature. Like he zhoujia from China, for example.

Coming from frictionless anti... the mindset is totally different, along with the play style.

Basically, the easier it is to attack with, the easier it will be to return. So you must decide which element is most important to you. Are you going to be hitting every shot? Or wanting to block a good deal?

Thanks skilless_slaper! Before switching to frictionless anti, I used to actually play medium pips (Dr N Diamant) for many years so I have an idea on the style though obviously it would take time to go back to an aggressive style.
With the plastic balls, reversal itself is not going to win you matches anymore so I thought to try something else.


You might like one close to nittaku super do knuckle - relying on faster, knuckle balls with good placement

If you go down the rabbit hole of, "Oh I want this amount of reversal, with this amount of hitting ability and still able to drop shot vs big loops blah blah blah" then you'll be like many of us... and go through 50+ rubbers!

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PostPosted: 12 May 2021, 22:01 
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Darth Pips
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[/quote]
Thanks skilless_slaper! Before switching to frictionless anti, I used to actually play medium pips (Dr N Diamant) for many years so I have an idea on the style though obviously it would take time to go back to an aggressive style.
With the plastic balls, reversal itself is not going to win you matches anymore so I thought to try something else.[/quote]

I will say, there is a huge difference in the reversal between the Dr N and DMS anti spin rubbers from my testing. Yes, smart players will eventually force you to attack...but you can win a lot more points on "reversal itself" with Storkraft vs ABS2 (any version).

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PostPosted: 13 May 2021, 00:18 
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dwruck wrote:

Thanks skilless_slaper! Before switching to frictionless anti, I used to actually play medium pips (Dr N Diamant) for many years so I have an idea on the style though obviously it would take time to go back to an aggressive style.
With the plastic balls, reversal itself is not going to win you matches anymore so I thought to try something else.[/quote]

I will say, there is a huge difference in the reversal between the Dr N and DMS anti spin rubbers from my testing. Yes, smart players will eventually force you to attack...but you can win a lot more points on "reversal itself" with Storkraft vs ABS2 (any version).[/quote]

I've used Dr n tarantula, bison, Buffalo, rhino, gorilla and whatever other animal he's thrown out there!

And I would agree, the DMS do have more reversal overall. Tarantula probably came closest to matching them, but still had a little less. Mega block, scandal, etc.

Having said that, I will block against people while using scandal or whichever anti, and they don't have too many problems with them. I swap to ox d.tecs and then they begin mishitting and misreading many more balls!

To me, the dms reversal is almost too pure! Making it easier to read and play against. It really only shines vs very heavy top spin players who will routinely attack into it. They also feel less difficult to use, are slower and safer.

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PostPosted: 13 May 2021, 05:28 
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Wow, that is interesting feedback. The players I play with regularly have commented that the DMS anti spin rubber is significantly more difficult to play against than the anti spin. I do find it works the best against heavy top spin, no doubt. An area where the anti clearly out perform the long pips for me is on serve return. Serve return is safer with the anti, and I have much more of an ability to control the depth of my return. Unquestionably, the most challenging type of player to play against is a flat hitter, but that's also going to be the case with long pips. Sure, with long pips like Grass D Tec S you have some ability to put your own spin on the ball, but I find that control is more difficult. When you have a grippy long pip attempting to handle a fast no spin ball, it grips that hard flat ball makes control very difficult. When a hard flat ball hits against the hard dead rubber, it's easier to control and keep the ball short to avoid a follow up attack if you choose.
After a great deal of practice, I've also found attacking with the anti to be more consistent than the long pip. Perhaps not quite as effective as a hit with, say, Grass D Tec S OX. But my success percentage after about 3 months of using Storkraft is already higher than it was after many years of playing long pips OX.
I think a lot depends on the blade you use. These frictionless anti spin rubbers are VERY blade dependent. If I compared long pips to anti on my Donic Defplay Senso V3, for example, the long pip is much better. But on the Dr Neubauer Matador, or DMS Deluxe Carbon, there is no comparison. The anti wins, hands down.

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PostPosted: 11 Jun 2021, 07:41 
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After 1.5 years with MP Dr. Neubauer KO Pro 1.3 I have found that switch to Grass D.Tecs 1.2 was not that difficult. Technique is similar, only some shots works better then another, matter of tactics. What I gained is chop and shorter drops for the cost of block complexity. Counterhitting is not what I do with my BH, both my rubbers are not good for that.


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PostPosted: 11 Jun 2021, 19:35 
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Blade: Nittaku Shake Defence
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Matt Pimple wrote:
dwruck wrote:
Matt, for me, the best way to attempt to handle hard loop drives with OX long pips is to aggressively chop block. If you just hold the blade steady, it takes on all of the force of the shot. You could learn the "pull back" technique, where you are pulling back on the blade as the ball approaches. But I think an aggressive chop block is better, as long as you match (or close to) the speed of the ball rotation, it can accentuate the amount of spin reversal you give back while taking some of the momentum off the ball. But it won't be anywhere near what a frictionless anti can do.

Thanks Doug! I guess I would have to practice that...a lot. On my couple of tries with OX lp I could chop block slow loops but I have no idea how you would do that on a shot with lots of pace.


And this is and always was my biggest issue when facing a good player who has really good ratio of spin/speed on their loops. Which is what made me try the ABS 2 EVO in the first place. It needs to be a pull back block or a loose hand chop block. But just try that when it's not a drill or caught off guard.....

But yh, practice practice practice. If you cannot cope still after couple of months then just go back to the EVO. I will second all the OX comments, it's honestly just easier and better more effective.

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