OOAK Table Tennis Forum

Either my service receive is bad (I'm betting this one lol) or my twiddle speed is just not good enough (probably both actually ) but for the life of me if they serve long low and quite fast no spin/little backspin I am most of the time done for

A no spin long push is totally different as they are slower and I have time to get that, same thing for the serves if they aren't fast (which is the case most of the time)

_________________
my youtube
http://www.youtube.com/ndragon88

My Vlog / Blog
viewtopic.php?f=58&t=32572

Yeah, so what I mean is, I anticipate the serve - if they do it more than once. Very few amateur players can make their long float technique look identical to other serves, so after they've caught you out once, it should be pretty obvious when they try to do it again. If you know it's coming from their body language, you'll probably find you have time to twiddle.

If that isn't the case though - e.g. they can hide their technique well, or they mix up the location of their long float serves (causing twiddle problems), your best remaining option is to play a long push down the middle. This will cut your opponent's angles, so even if they can attack it well, they can't use angles to put the ball past you.

_________________
My blog: "Learning to play: as a modern defender": http://ooakforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=58&t=22254
My YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCtazeX ... oICGS9bqNg
Join the OOAK Discord!: https://discord.gg/Yw2hYUdz3g

[Other gear I've used]
Blades: Butterfly Defence 3, Butterfly Defence Pro, Butterfly Innerforce ZLC, Butterfly Innershield, DHS Power G7, Stiga Offensive Classic Carbon
SPs: Friendship 802 (1.5), TSP Spectol (1.3, 1.8, 2.1), TSP Spectol Speed (1.3), TSP Super Spinpips Chop Sponge 2 (0.5, 1.3)
LPs: Butterfly Feint Long II (1), Butterfly Feint Long III (0.5, 1.3), Tibhar Grass D.TecS (OX), TSP Curl P1-R (0.5, 1, 1.3), TSP Curl P4 (1.3)

I honestly cannot tell when he will do the long serves so it's pure reaction for me.
Notice he also mixes it up and does a little top spin, no spin or a little backspin too.
The 2nd serve I added in so people can see even with low friction OX LPs you can still banana flick to open up a mid long float serve

Sorry I know this is from an old video but tbh not much has changed vs these serves

_________________
my youtube
http://www.youtube.com/ndragon88

My Vlog / Blog
viewtopic.php?f=58&t=32572

(caveat, all of the below observations are based on my level - not USATT 2200+ etc)

That type of player is rare, all of his serves are very similar. There is a (subtle, but usable) difference with his float serve though - he makes absolutely no movement with his bat. His body looks the same etc, but as his bat approaches the ball, it's a simple linear motion. His serves with spin on require the bat to move differently before impact, so you do have a brief indication of an incoming float serve. Might not be enough to twiddle though.

Other thing I would say is, I'd probably be ~1/2 metre further back to receive serve than you. That not might work for your style, but I find it way easier to come in for a (genuine) short serve (which, at my level, are quite rare - usually "short" serves still have a second bounce off the table) than moving back to receive a long serve. A short serve can't be fast, so you've always got time to step in. That extra space can be the difference between a good return and your opponent winning the point directly off their serve.

_________________
My blog: "Learning to play: as a modern defender": http://ooakforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=58&t=22254
My YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCtazeX ... oICGS9bqNg
Join the OOAK Discord!: https://discord.gg/Yw2hYUdz3g

[Other gear I've used]
Blades: Butterfly Defence 3, Butterfly Defence Pro, Butterfly Innerforce ZLC, Butterfly Innershield, DHS Power G7, Stiga Offensive Classic Carbon
SPs: Friendship 802 (1.5), TSP Spectol (1.3, 1.8, 2.1), TSP Spectol Speed (1.3), TSP Super Spinpips Chop Sponge 2 (0.5, 1.3)
LPs: Butterfly Feint Long II (1), Butterfly Feint Long III (0.5, 1.3), Tibhar Grass D.TecS (OX), TSP Curl P1-R (0.5, 1, 1.3), TSP Curl P4 (1.3)

1st never chop a backspin with LP because you return topspin easy to attack for your opponent. Better attack with push.

2nd always attack with push or sidesweep

N. B. Attack can be a difficult placement sort or long for your oponent and can be slow or fast

_________________
No more political prisoners in Catalonia.

You can read if the serve is long or short depending where is the rebound at the table, if the ball rebound near the player is long, if rebound near the net is short.

_________________
No more political prisoners in Catalonia.

Similar to what Dunc said, I'd say you're maybe standing a little too close to the table. It's especially apparent on that slow motion shot. Try having your start position be a bit further back (maybe not half a meter, but try different distances & see what works for you), and if your opponent serves short, just take a slightly bigger step in to respond to them.

I'm not attempting to chop it - it's just that long backspin serve to BH is difficult to return low and deep, at least for me. Sending it into the net, off the table, or leaving it high to be attacked are all bad outcomes. Need more practice, I guess...

_________________
USATT: 1807 | League: 1887

is chopping backspin with LP really that bad of an idea, or is it specifically a bad idea with OX? As long as I cut through it hard & keep it low, it seems like a difficult ball for my opponent to deal with

Yh I actually mentioned it to Dunc that when I watch my more recent matches I've automatically started standing bit further back. But I did play him a bit recently and I still didn't get that 1 serve back lol. But I didn't try the step back and chop/push/shovel (whatever its called) so I'm planning to try it.

Will be training with him next Wednesday for 3hrs. Going to ask him to serve to me for 1 of the exercises

_________________
my youtube
http://www.youtube.com/ndragon88

My Vlog / Blog
viewtopic.php?f=58&t=32572

Stepping back slightly vs a fast server is usually a good idea, especially if you can't handle the quick ball!

You can stay close to the table if you're able to control the ball, of course...

But for most, it's probably easier to chop it downward rather than block it back low. I find chopping/bumping it to the person's weak side - usually wide forehand, anticipating a return to my own fh. Or I kick it out wide to the backhand, very wide! If it's not wide enough, they can step around and use a fh blaster. So this placement just depends on the person's skills.

Or going into the jam zone, as always.

It is less difficult to move forward than it is to move backward... so basic strategy is just step back a little and see how it goes!

A little more risky, you can always twiddle and give a rather heavy chop back from the bh side. The long ball is usually pretty simple to do this against.

More advanced might be utilizing chop-blocks, lift bumps and that sort of thing while staying at the table.

_________________
SOULSPIN CUSTOM BLADES
Fh: Spinny rubber
Bh: Not so spinny rubber...

I think the placement/height is more important than the spin type. Whether it's top spin, dead or backspin... Even before those, I find speed changes still rank higher than spin changes - namely with the LP. Since you can't affect the spin THAT much regardless of your stroke. Maybe the person is wanting a long ball off the table he can loop (usual strategy). If you can drop it shorter, his plans are foiled! Right up by the net on their forehand side. That shot is easier with some sponge to dampen the speed. Short ball attempts are overall riskier for giving pop ups.

Check out this game of Robet S's

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4t5UEoARerk

Notice how he handles the quick serve balls

_________________
SOULSPIN CUSTOM BLADES
Fh: Spinny rubber
Bh: Not so spinny rubber...

[/quote]

is chopping backspin with LP really that bad of an idea, or is it specifically a bad idea with OX? As long as I cut through it hard & keep it low, it seems like a difficult ball for my opponent to deal with[/quote]

It all depends the rubber if have grip or not.

OX frictionless does topspin
TSP P1R, Badman reload or similar, you can chop because you can generate your own backspin.

_________________
No more political prisoners in Catalonia.

Ooooh thanks for that vid!!!

Anyone know his equipment? Looks like sponge but of course I could be wrong

_________________
my youtube
http://www.youtube.com/ndragon88

My Vlog / Blog
viewtopic.php?f=58&t=32572

I believe it's OX. He was watching me play at the nationals this year for a short while... that made me more nervous than the match! Normally people can't tell if you're a bad or a good pip user, just that it's all JUNK rubber nonsense! So, when he spectated me I knew all of my bumbling mistakes would be very apparent to him I let the pips world down that day...

_________________
SOULSPIN CUSTOM BLADES
Fh: Spinny rubber
Bh: Not so spinny rubber...