OOAK Table Tennis Forum

Thanks for all the advice everybody! In my journey to find the best fit for my new SP forehand game, it sounds like I should give DMS Firestorm and Victas VO>102 a try. Still got Waran II and TSP Spinpips Red to try out. Got my first tournament with the new setup this weekend, it will be a great learning opportunity. Will likely go into that using the regular Waran as my primary setup, maybe have a blade with either Waran II or Spinpips Red on it as a backup to try later in the day if I feel like it.

_________________
"The greatest teacher, failure is"
USATT Rating: 1725
Blade: Stiga Cybershape Carbon
FH Rubber: Butterfly Tenergy 19 2.1
BH Rubber: Dr Neubauer ABS3 1.5

FWIW Waran was my first short pips.
About a year in I tried Waran 2 but found it too hard and much heavier.
I then changed to Victas V>102 — my current BH rubber — which works well for my game.
V>101 is a bit faster, less spinny, and V>103 is a bit slower, supposedly has more control, but I went back to the 102 for now.

How would you compare V>102 to Waran? Can you tell why you prefer the former to the latter? Thanks!

Nathanso, I see you are now playing the Nittaku Moristo SP AX...any insight into what made you switch from the Victas to that? I read your write-up on the Moristo SP AX in the thread you started, but I didn't get an impression of the reason for the switch. You mentioned the speed, was that it?

_________________
"The greatest teacher, failure is"
USATT Rating: 1725
Blade: Stiga Cybershape Carbon
FH Rubber: Butterfly Tenergy 19 2.1
BH Rubber: Dr Neubauer ABS3 1.5

I found V>102 spinnier and somewhat faster than Waran. Sensitivity to incoming spin seems to be the same.
Note that I used both in max thickness on a carbon blade.

I'm in test mode right now, seeking to optimize the speed+spin vs spin-resistance trade-off since BH blocking and punch-driving with SP (off the twiddle) is a big part of my game. No clear winner yet, but I still consider Moristo Ax to be my primary SP.

You guys weren't kidding about the weight of the Waran II compared to regular Waran. I glued the sheet of Waran II I had to the same type of blade as I have my regular Waran on, and I can definitely feel a significant difference in weight.

Also put the sheet of Spinpips Red on a blade with ORKan II on the backhand. I'm intrigued to try this setup, just by feeling it, the Spinpips Red definitely seems to have more grip than the Waran.

At the tournament I'm playing this weekend, because I've had the most experience with it, I will likely play with my Waran/ORKan combination (soft sponges). It's a giant round robin, so if I'm at the bottom of a group and out of the running for prizes, I might try one of these other setups, just for the heck of it. Probably will have a hit with a friend tomorrow night, might try a couple of these out just to see how they feel.

Based on the feedback here I think I'm going to order some Victas VO>102 to try. Really appreciate all the knowledge here!

_________________
"The greatest teacher, failure is"
USATT Rating: 1725
Blade: Stiga Cybershape Carbon
FH Rubber: Butterfly Tenergy 19 2.1
BH Rubber: Dr Neubauer ABS3 1.5

Hi Nathanso, how would you compare the 102 to Express Ultra?

I haven't put much play time into the Express Ultra. Moreover, I don't want to derail this thread from Waran-related content so I'm going to hold fire until I publish my more comprehensive SP reviews. p.s. Victas VO > 102 1.8mm is on order.

Had my first hit last night with Waran II. I was just doing drills with a long pips blocker, so I was not facing incoming loops. The obvious thing, speed, was noticeably faster than regular Waran. I felt like spin was slightly higher as well, although the ball still traveled pretty flat. Hitting against his OX long pips, he seemed to have a little more trouble with the Waran II. I also felt like it was easier to lift back spin with the harder sponge Waran II. I will probably give the Waran II a try in the tournament this weekend. Maybe because I have a slower blade (Donic Defplay Senso V3), having the harder sponge on there will be good. When I was using inverted, I used harder sponges as well. The test for me will be not just in attack, but also in defense, is it as controllable and bothering opponents as much as the softer/slower regular Waran.

Also had my first hit with TSP Spinpips Red. All the feedback that I've read is right, this is a very spinny pip. To keep this on topic, comparing it to Waran, spin was noticeably higher, both on serves and on hits/loops. I felt like it almost played like a slightly spinny inverted. It felt faster than regular Waran, maybe equal to or slightly slower than Waran II. Throw angle felt a little higher than Waran also. At least against my training partner, he had very little trouble blocking the Spinpips Red, whereas with the Waran and Waran II he had a lot more problems. Think I'll leave this on the sideline in this weekend's tournament and try it against loopers in practice at the club later.

_________________
"The greatest teacher, failure is"
USATT Rating: 1725
Blade: Stiga Cybershape Carbon
FH Rubber: Butterfly Tenergy 19 2.1
BH Rubber: Dr Neubauer ABS3 1.5

Had a fun time at the tournament yesterday. Was a giant round robin format and I was ranked 7th out of 8 guys, so playing mostly guys rated above me. Early on I started with the Waran II, thinking the harder sponge would be more necessary against the better players. But the fact was, I just couldn't control it against their shots. So I switched back to the softer Waran and started playing better and better as the day went along. After only winning 1 game out of my first five matches, I won my last two matches (one against a player above me, one against the player below), both 3-0. I stopped thinking technically about my forehand stroke and just played with feel, and started hitting some very good, well controlled forehand shots. Blocking with the softer sponge was much easier, and I could counter attack better. Earlier in the day players were going after my forehand as they could tell I was struggling. By the end, they were staying away from it, which worked well for me because I really like the ORKan on the backhand. Without swinging hard I felt like I was able to get decent enough speed with more spin than I expected. Had one opponent notice how often the ball was hitting his finger when trying to block my forehand shots, as I was getting more sidespin than he expected. I've still got a long ways to go, but considering I was able to play to my current rating with a setup I've only been using maybe 7 or 8 times prior to the tournament, with a completely different stroke on the forehand, this is very encouraging. I will be sticking with the regular Waran 2.0 mm sponge on my forehand for a while.
On a side note, it was fun to see a short pips penhold player in my group. His rating was in the mid 1900s and he took second place, and even beat the top seed, who was rated over 2200. He used Victas VO>101 very effectively. The amount of spin that he was able to vary on spins gave a lot of people trouble, and his flat hits would end points consistently.

_________________
"The greatest teacher, failure is"
USATT Rating: 1725
Blade: Stiga Cybershape Carbon
FH Rubber: Butterfly Tenergy 19 2.1
BH Rubber: Dr Neubauer ABS3 1.5

It seems DMS have just released the soft version of the Firestorm. Quote:
Due to the longer ball dwell time of this new combination, we managed to increase the spin properties to the upper limit. Due to the slightly decreased speed, the control values too are increased. The high disruptional effect when hitting and blocking is unchanged and the blocks continue to create a low trajectory sinking effect.

I wonder if it's closer to the Waran than the original version.

Dwruck

Is your Waran the original yellow sponge or the recent batch red/orange sponge which has also appeared on Keiler and seems harder and less dangerous.

Waran on the FH in the thicker sponges is a strange animal in that it is not that good for looping due to a low throw but very dangerous and spinny in blocks, chops etc as you mention. Thinner sponges best for hitting or chopping only as they bottom out easily making blocking etc. harder.

Also Waran seems to suit slowish blades with good dwell especially on the BH as they make it more controllable and easier to impart spin on blocks.

Firestorm soft could indeed be an interesting Waran alternative.

Lastly why does no one appear to try spin pips blue?.

Hi ChasFox, my Waran sheets have the more recent batch that you describe. I've learned to do soft loops against under spin with it, but against dead balls or top spin balls trying any sort of spin-type stroke is not possible. I do like that I can return a soft loop with a bit of top spin against just about any amount of under spin, as heavy under spin used to give me a lot of trouble. I might have to try the Firestorm soft. Also interested in trying the Victas VO>102 as I've read a lot of good things. I do have a blade with the TSP Spinpips Red on it. As others have noted, it is very different from Waran, quite spinny and sponge is faster. It also feels quite a bit heavier to me. I almost forgot, I also have a sheet of Globe 889-2 sitting around to try.
EDIT: Ordered a sheet of Firestorm Soft today!

_________________
"The greatest teacher, failure is"
USATT Rating: 1725
Blade: Stiga Cybershape Carbon
FH Rubber: Butterfly Tenergy 19 2.1
BH Rubber: Dr Neubauer ABS3 1.5

After several days of trying out the Moristo SP Ax (max) on my spare racket, I've decided not to go back to the Victas V>102.
Impressions are of course subjective, but it seems a bit spinnier, more forgiving of small racket angle errors, and flat-hit balls are much faster — at least the opponents complain more.

I also took the opportunity to switch my forehand rubber from Tenergy 25 to Victas V>402 Double Extra, and the same comments apply; my forehand drives are much more consistent now.