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PostPosted: 14 Jul 2021, 23:35 
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Did he use an old sheet of the SG? It seems that there wasn't very much spin reversal

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PostPosted: 14 Jul 2021, 23:39 
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Iron Pips
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Rinforzando wrote:
Did he use an old sheet of the SG? It seems that there wasn't very much spin reversal
He used a rather fresh sheet, original sponge in 0.8. And DHS balls. Simon is very used to playing against anti and he does not do lots of spin on his attacks. But there is enough spin I can assure you.

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PostPosted: 15 Jul 2021, 10:57 
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First of all, this is very useful. And if you continue, it will be much appreciated.

Playing with anti is surely not about spin reversal but we all enjoy that ability and especially your showing what is happening to the ball when it is left alone shows absolutely how much backspin results from that simple block.

In this video --> https://youtu.be/hVXs3XcWz_g?t=199 ( which I linked to the very moment ) , the backspin caused from the same kind of block feels like twice the spin reversal compared to the recent ones you guys just posted. The difference is considerable. And that one was 1.6mm and this one is 0.8mm. So, from a spin reversal point of view, 0.8 must be better but it **looks like** 1.6 proves otherwise.

Am I reading this whole thing wrong?


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PostPosted: 15 Jul 2021, 16:06 
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KindButcher wrote:
First of all, this is very useful. And if you continue, it will be much appreciated.

Playing with anti is surely not about spin reversal but we all enjoy that ability and especially your showing what is happening to the ball when it is left alone shows absolutely how much backspin results from that simple block.

In this video --> https://youtu.be/hVXs3XcWz_g?t=199 ( which I linked to the very moment ) , the backspin caused from the same kind of block feels like twice the spin reversal compared to the recent ones you guys just posted. The difference is considerable. And that one was 1.6mm and this one is 0.8mm. So, from a spin reversal point of view, 0.8 must be better but it **looks like** 1.6 proves otherwise.

Am I reading this whole thing wrong?


Thanks! Let me know if anything should be changed to make those kinds of films more useful!

About the back spin, I think it is about the same, but in the video you linked I was looping with a tacky chinese rubber and Marcus lifted the ball rather high with his block, removing most of the speed, and therfore making the ball roll backwards earlier from the loop. That is why it has more spin left at the time it reaches the floor. If you block a spinny loop low, but rather long (you might add some speed) the ball is carrying lots of speed forward. For making that ball stop and turn backwards requires much more back spin than if your block is made very short (if you dampend the speed by having moving the bat towards the body at ball contact). Using a thicker anti makes this a lot easier, so 1,6 mm may be making the blocks harder to attack, but then because of the slower speed forward. Also, with a thicker anti, the block will go higher. And keeping the blocks low is, at least at my level, more important than making them slow.

There may be a slight difference in how much spin reversal can be generated with these different setups, but the other factors, like spin and speed and timing etc are much more important for the result. So these versions are all very good, what to choose is a mater of taste, what feeling you like and how it works with your FH rubber. I will keep the Winner, if works great with my FH rubber and I use it with 1,2 mm to have a little more security.

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PostPosted: 22 Aug 2021, 19:41 
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Hi,
how long does SG last?
Does it get grippy after some time?


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PostPosted: 24 Aug 2021, 00:09 
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CelestialBoy wrote:
Hi,
how long does SG last?
Does it get grippy after some time?


So far so good. Mine is maybe 1-2 month old and nothing changed.

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Setup 1
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FH - Xiom Tau 2 max
BH - Barna Original Super Glanti 1.6mm

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FH - Victas Triple Double Extra max
BH - Victas Curl P4V 1.5mm


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PostPosted: 24 Aug 2021, 07:18 
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Rinforzando wrote:
So far so good. Mine is maybe 1-2 month old and nothing changed.

Ok thanks, after reading your comment I have ordered mine 1.6mm red.


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PostPosted: 25 Aug 2021, 19:48 
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Blade: Siam custom
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CelestialBoy wrote:
Rinforzando wrote:
So far so good. Mine is maybe 1-2 month old and nothing changed.

Ok thanks, after reading your comment I have ordered mine 1.6mm red.


Will you glue it to your current setup on your profile ? If so, it may be a very slow combo. But if it is what you're looking for, then so far so good

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Setup 1
Blade - Siam custom
FH - Xiom Tau 2 max
BH - Barna Original Super Glanti 1.6mm

Setup 2
Blade - Gerry Goriki Danshi
FH - Victas Triple Double Extra max
BH - Victas Curl P4V 1.5mm


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PostPosted: 26 Aug 2021, 19:02 
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Rinforzando wrote:
Will you glue it to your current setup on your profile ? If so, it may be a very slow combo. But if it is what you're looking for, then so far so good


No, that setup written on the profile is now outdated. I will glue the SG on a 7 plies off blade and on the other side I will try the short pips Firestorm Soft 2.1 :)


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PostPosted: 27 Aug 2021, 16:03 
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Finally, I was able to test Barna Original Super Glanti 1.6mm on Palio TCT Titanium. I think this is the 2nd set up one can find after def-attack's very nice reviews on this particular combo.

The video created yesterday and here it is https://youtu.be/g4PQ1AIYJe0?t=4 ( as my first time hitting with this combo ).

Sorry that I had both sides as red (as I was just testing the rubbers & the blade ). But to make it easy, I made no twiddling ever, not even at serves.
( So ALL Backhand shots were from the Anti. )

Please note that his combo was a first time encounter for me. And despite this fact, there wasn't much a learning curve!
So it is definitely a promising combo.

AND It's absolutely true that the spin reversal is totally amazing when a super hard and stiff blade ( like Palio TCT ) and a completely frictionless anti top sheet comes together.

You will see that a simple block can easily send off an incoming top spin back as a vicious back spin in disguise.

Down sides?
Well, for me, the control was not there as there is no feeling of the ball whatsoever.
However,, surprisingly, that lack of control did not cause much frustration & I cannot explain this.

A few words for the FH...
Skyline 2 did very well on this siper fast blade. And this test proved promising.
My serves were still loaded, and My FH chops were reasonably successful. I missed the table only a few times which can easily be adjusted with some familiarity with this combo.

Also, my occasional attacks ( I'm an attack-handicapped guy ) were much better than I expected.
Given how fast this blade is, and how I hate fast blades, how terrible I'm with my attacking shots, this was the biggest surprise to me!

Serdar is a great spin player and by profession, he is an F-16 Pilot! Lots of respects to him!

And Thanks to Joachim for suggesting this combo. Original Inspiration: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hVXs3XcWz_g

Bottom Line:

Order a black skyline 2 ( 2.15mm ) and keep this combo as a reasonable equipment!
And perhaps test Reflection 1.5mm also on the same blade to do a apple-apple comparison betwee Reflection and Barna Original Glanti -- which I cannot figure out the pros and cons of one over the other.


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PostPosted: 27 Aug 2021, 22:19 
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Darth Pips
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BH: DMS Storkraft 0.8
Thanks for sharing your video. That forehand chop of yours looks nasty. Just a ton of back spin on it. You get a lot of nice spin on your serve too. One of my favorite combinations with the frictionless anti is exactly like yours, when you served from your forehand side of the table with the extreme side spin on the ball. Once you get that third ball, which still has all the spin on it, and use the anti, it's so difficult for an opponent to deal with.

My one big recommendation for you would be to stay closer to the table. It looks like your natural style is to back away and use a chopping motion. With the frictionless anti you want to stay close to the table and take the ball as quickly as possible, giving as solid a bump as possible, to maximize spin reversal. When you back away and do a chopping type motion it really reduces the spin reversal. On those fast top spin serves he gave you to your backhand, learn to smother them with the anti; thanks to the very low speed it will be controllable. The thing I am continuing to learn is to even be able to drop those short. Smart player will do that serve, expecting a long under spin ball that they loop. Learning to drop those serves short is a key tool in your arsenal. Controlling the in and out of ball placement will help you significantly against higher rated players where the reversal alone won't win you enough points.

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PostPosted: 28 Aug 2021, 06:36 
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Thanks dwruck for your feedback.

You really summed it up very well. The more side-spin on our serves, the more the residue will be leftover on our third-ball pushes :)
A simple push on that third ball will drive many opponents nuts as many people forget that there is still some leftover spin on the 4th ball.

You are right on the dot with your advice regarding staying close and how best to use these antis.

In fact, I'm the only guy I know who uses antis like LP. Everybody tells me, you like the chopping action so much, you should use the right tool for that, which is an LP with some sponge. But I've learned the hard way that the higher the levels are, the more difficult the equipment become and I'm far from it. Managing an LP with a thick sponge is not my cup of tea yet. So LPs are out the window for now. Plus, we cannot do the table-top show ( the ball placement capability for sending the balls to left/right, long/short at will ) with an LP that easy (whether with a sponge or not). Those are antis' territory. Antis offers us tremendous control that is not possible with other rubber styles unless one has a super soft wrist/hand that can tame those super-fast blades and rubbers like cotton.

But there is something in chopping I cannot let go of. I'm in love with it. It's the most satisfactory thing to me in playing table tennis and I do get a lot of points going that track.

It is very true that these frictionless antis are created first and foremost for tabletop blocking and for their great spin-reversals potantial. Of course, this is a personal taste, but to me, blocking with antis is not visually attractive. Blocking with straight rubbers is ( as demonstrated by Koki Niwa or Kenta Matsudaira or the good-old Mozart ). So I tend to try to learn the chopping path more than the tabletop blocking due to the visual aspects.

Antis are totally capable of doing this. For example, I can chop from far away with a classic anti ( like superstop 1.9mm on Chen Weixing blade as demonstrated here: https://youtu.be/PtmcOueKwWw?t=67) , and I can also chop with a frictionless anti ( like scandal 0.9mm on deluxe carbon ( as demonstrated in here https://youtu.be/p4DipK774Xw?t=74) and now with glanti on palio. It's the same strike and this strike can definitely send a lot of backspin without much effort with a ton of control.

As in most cases, there is room for improvement on this territory but I am surprised it is not explored by anybody that I know of.

Balaban and Mladonavic offer excellent styles with overall play and their tabletop blocks are visually stunning. Kind of Koki Niwa style... I'm very interested in learning that!

It would have been very nice to share various styles on this forum, and discuss how to get there fast. From that mindset, Marcus's videos are very educational and right on the dot. If we have a list of trainable drills, we can improve much faster. Training and perfecting a certain style is the name of the game,

Tomorrow, I'll have my Sat tournament. I plan to use the same glanti but I have to remove the skyline 2 ( cause it is red ) and put something similar skyline 3 ( which is black. ).
I prefer the sticky skyline 2. With skyline 3, my FH chops may suffer. We'll see tomorrow.


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PostPosted: 31 Aug 2021, 22:09 
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Sorry I'm just seeing this now, would have wished you good luck in the tournament. I'd be interested to know how it went and what you learned!

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USATT Rating: 1777
Blade: DMS Carbon Deluxe
FH Rubber: Tibhar Evolution MX-P 1.9
BH Rubber: DMS Storkraft 0.8


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PostPosted: 31 Aug 2021, 23:32 
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KindButcher wrote:
Thanks dwruck for your feedback.

You really summed it up very well. The more side-spin on our serves, the more the residue will be leftover on our third-ball pushes :)
A simple push on that third ball will drive many opponents nuts as many people forget that there is still some leftover spin on the 4th ball.

You are right on the dot with your advice regarding staying close and how best to use these antis.

In fact, I'm the only guy I know who uses antis like LP. Everybody tells me, you like the chopping action so much, you should use the right tool for that, which is an LP with some sponge. But I've learned the hard way that the higher the levels are, the more difficult the equipment become and I'm far from it. Managing an LP with a thick sponge is not my cup of tea yet. So LPs are out the window for now. Plus, we cannot do the table-top show ( the ball placement capability for sending the balls to left/right, long/short at will ) with an LP that easy (whether with a sponge or not). Those are antis' territory. Antis offers us tremendous control that is not possible with other rubber styles unless one has a super soft wrist/hand that can tame those super-fast blades and rubbers like cotton.

But there is something in chopping I cannot let go of. I'm in love with it. It's the most satisfactory thing to me in playing table tennis and I do get a lot of points going that track.

It is very true that these frictionless antis are created first and foremost for tabletop blocking and for their great spin-reversals potantial. Of course, this is a personal taste, but to me, blocking with antis is not visually attractive. Blocking with straight rubbers is ( as demonstrated by Koki Niwa or Kenta Matsudaira or the good-old Mozart ). So I tend to try to learn the chopping path more than the tabletop blocking due to the visual aspects.

Antis are totally capable of doing this. For example, I can chop from far away with a classic anti ( like superstop 1.9mm on Chen Weixing blade as demonstrated here: https://youtu.be/PtmcOueKwWw?t=67) , and I can also chop with a frictionless anti ( like scandal 0.9mm on deluxe carbon ( as demonstrated in here https://youtu.be/p4DipK774Xw?t=74) and now with glanti on palio. It's the same strike and this strike can definitely send a lot of backspin without much effort with a ton of control.

As in most cases, there is room for improvement on this territory but I am surprised it is not explored by anybody that I know of.

Balaban and Mladonavic offer excellent styles with overall play and their tabletop blocks are visually stunning. Kind of Koki Niwa style... I'm very interested in learning that!

It would have been very nice to share various styles on this forum, and discuss how to get there fast. From that mindset, Marcus's videos are very educational and right on the dot. If we have a list of trainable drills, we can improve much faster. Training and perfecting a certain style is the name of the game,

Tomorrow, I'll have my Sat tournament. I plan to use the same glanti but I have to remove the skyline 2 ( cause it is red ) and put something similar skyline 3 ( which is black. ).
I prefer the sticky skyline 2. With skyline 3, my FH chops may suffer. We'll see tomorrow.


Hey bro, I'm not even interested in the rubber but I have subscribed and try to watch / catch up on your vids as I enjoy your playstyle.

Would it be really long for you to edit the videos so it's just the points?

Also just FYI I really enjoy watching your classic anti chopping game the most! Good luck on your journey, I will follow along and see how you get on

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PostPosted: 01 Sep 2021, 04:00 
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Kindbutcher
Red: Super stop 1.9mm -have you tried best anti in 2mm.
My style is very similar to yours-i am an anti chopper.
i may try the super stop mate


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