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Der Materialspezialist Störkraft frictionless anti
https://ooakforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=36887
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Author:  gaijinjoe [ 11 Apr 2021, 09:42 ]
Post subject:  Re: Der Materialspezialist Störkraft frictionless anti

Hmmm... I wanted to try it on two blades. Def-attack mentioned it worked well on thin balsa blades and I have a TSP Black Balsa 3.0 glass-fiber.

I also have a TSP Trinity Carbon which has a balsa core with limba and samba woods. I don't know if those woods make a difference: https://tabletennisshop.com.au/index.ph ... ts_id=1170

The storkraft I have is 0.8 thickness. If I had to choose one blade I'm guessing I should probably go with the Trinity Carbon?

Author:  Def-attack [ 11 Apr 2021, 16:04 ]
Post subject:  Re: Der Materialspezialist Störkraft frictionless anti

gaijinjoe wrote:
Hmmm... I wanted to try it on two blades. Def-attack mentioned it worked well on thin balsa blades and I have a TSP Black Balsa 3.0 glass-fiber.

I also have a TSP Trinity Carbon which has a balsa core with limba and samba woods. I don't know if those woods make a difference: https://tabletennisshop.com.au/index.ph ... ts_id=1170

The storkraft I have is 0.8 thickness. If I had to choose one blade I'm guessing I should probably go with the Trinity Carbon?

Black balsa is not very good, the carbon layer kills the spin. The other one I don't know about.

Author:  gaijinjoe [ 11 Apr 2021, 16:58 ]
Post subject:  Re: Der Materialspezialist Störkraft frictionless anti

Wait, didn't you say the TSP Balsa 2.5 defence was good? The Black Balsa 3.0 is just like that except .5mm thicker. Both have the glassfiber. The Trinity Carbon of course has carbon plies. Was the thin balsa with glassfiber actually not good and your meant another blade?

Author:  Def-attack [ 11 Apr 2021, 19:05 ]
Post subject:  Re: Der Materialspezialist Störkraft frictionless anti

gaijinjoe wrote:
Wait, didn't you say the TSP Balsa 2.5 defence was good? The Black Balsa 3.0 is just like that except .5mm thicker. Both have the glassfiber. The Trinity Carbon of course has carbon plies. Was the thin balsa with glassfiber actually not good and your meant another blade?
The old discontinued TSP balsa 2.5 fitter def was, for some reason, very good. Stiga def pro with carbon is also good with 0.8 mm (no balsa in that blade). Black balsa was not good, no spin on blocks. TSP balsa 8.5 was not good either (thin carbon layer beneath outer ply kills the spin). But my own balsa with walnut is good with 1.2 or 1.6 mm, or 0.8 if you are fast. Stiga allround CR is good with 0.8 mm. Palio TCT is good, but you need 1.6 mm and SuperGlanti is far better than Störkraft on that (and most of the others, at least for pure spin reversal).

It is really difficult to know before trying what blade works good with a specific glanti.

Author:  gaijinjoe [ 11 Apr 2021, 21:36 ]
Post subject:  Re: Der Materialspezialist Störkraft frictionless anti

Def, thanks for the info. I guess I'll try the Trinity Carbon I have. Hopefully I get lucky. I can't afford to buy multiple sheets and blades :(

Incidentally, do you have a post anywhere explaining your homemade blade in more detail? How made it, etc? Thanks!

Author:  Def-attack [ 11 Apr 2021, 21:47 ]
Post subject:  Re: Der Materialspezialist Störkraft frictionless anti

gaijinjoe wrote:
Def, thanks for the info. I guess I'll try the Trinity Carbon I have. Hopefully I get lucky. I can't afford to buy multiple sheets and blades :(

Incidentally, do you have a post anywhere explaining your homemade blade in more detail? How made it, etc? Thanks!
You can look in my blog, from post #20 and forward: viewtopic.php?f=58&t=37457&start=15

Author:  dwruck [ 12 Apr 2021, 22:06 ]
Post subject:  Re: Der Materialspezialist Störkraft frictionless anti

Storkraft should work well with that carbon blade. It has outstanding properties on the DMS Deluxe Carbon blade. As I continue to train with that combination, I am better understanding the touch and feel of the rubber. Just remember, you will likely not do well the first time you use it. It requires a lot of training and patience. But if you like to block close to the table, the long term payoff is great. I've started developing a technique where I can hit against under spin and dead balls, hard, which gives my opponents a significant level of trouble. I start with an open blade, at the angle that I would use to block a top spin, and aggressively snap my forearm and wrist through. It does not work if I have any hesitation in the shot, but if I do it aggressively and with full effort, the consistency is surprisingly good. It really adds another dimension to my game.

Author:  dwruck [ 03 May 2021, 22:10 ]
Post subject:  Re: Der Materialspezialist Störkraft frictionless anti

Got an update on my progression with Storkraft. In my training sessions with my coach my control is significantly improved. And I've figured out a method for being able to attack against under spin and no spin balls very effectively. I make a fast rotation with my forearm and wrist, starting with an open blade and rolling my forearm and wrist through in a quick snapping motion, and it gives deadly shots that are fast, flat, and very difficult for opponents to deal with. It's difficult to do against low balls, but anything higher than net height I have good consistency with it. This has taken my game to the next level. I've been playing very well against my regular practice matches in my basement, so I was excited to go to our club, which just reopened. I didn't lose a match all night, including a 3-0 win over a player rated 1950 and a 3-1 win over a player rated 1850. The faster blade has made my forehand more effective, and the Storkraft gave them all kinds of difficulties when both defending and attacking. Maybe the most effective shot was the quick, right off the bounce aggressive push deep into their backhand corner, that tied them up a lot. Then I combined that with dropping balls short and the in and out kept them off balance. When I had troubles, it was because I popped the ball up a little too high with the anti, or I missed a loop. This gives me a lot of confidence that my coaching and training is working, and I will be very excited to play a tournament at the end of this month. :)

Author:  Rinforzando [ 05 May 2021, 00:12 ]
Post subject:  Re: Der Materialspezialist Störkraft frictionless anti

It's great to hear from you again !

dwruck wrote:
And I've figured out a method for being able to attack against under spin and no spin balls very effectively. I make a fast rotation with my forearm and wrist, starting with an open blade and rolling my forearm and wrist through in a quick snapping motion, and it gives deadly shots that are fast, flat, and very difficult for opponents to deal with. It's difficult to do against low balls, but anything higher than net height I have good consistency with it. This has taken my game to the next level.


Is your movement similar to the strawberry flick ?

Author:  dwruck [ 05 May 2021, 21:47 ]
Post subject:  Re: Der Materialspezialist Störkraft frictionless anti

No, I'd say it's more of a hard drive, hitting through the ball aggressively.

Author:  nathanso [ 06 May 2021, 02:33 ]
Post subject:  Re: Der Materialspezialist Störkraft frictionless anti

DW, In your opinion, how difficult would the transition to Störkraft 0.8mm be for a US1750 OX LP BH attacker? How is it for serve return? And how does Störkraft perform at chopping compared to LP?

Author:  dwruck [ 06 May 2021, 22:10 ]
Post subject:  Re: Der Materialspezialist Störkraft frictionless anti

As a former 1700-1900 level OX long pips player I feel like I can respond pretty well to your question. It takes a lot of practice and training.

If you want to chop, you should not use these frictionless antispin rubbers. You do not want to get caught away from the table with them. If you are away from the table and try to brush the ball to bend the pips like you would with a chop, it won't get back to the net much less over it. When I get forced back I've learned to do a stroke that is very much through the ball. It can get the ball back on the table and keep you in the point, but it's pretty dead, not much reversal by the time it gets to the table. It's like doing a very aggressive "bump" through the ball, enough to get it back on.

When I played OX LP I had a very active stroke, chop blocking and hitting with it. I'm having to learn to not use a chop block stroke. Even close to the table, really the last thing you want to do is "brush" the ball. The best effect comes from a stable wrist and making solid contact forward and through the ball. After a few months of coaching and practice on the robot I'm finally getting better with this. At first it's very counter intuitive, because I felt like I had to be more active to take the pace off. If you are a pure blocker, keeping a steady wrist, your adjustment time will be less.

Getting the "touch" right is another thing that takes some time. You won't believe how much slower this rubber is. And you need to drill a lot to get the angle right. Knowing how much to go forward, into the slower loops, is a big hurdle I'm still working to get better at. Blade angle is huge too, again, it's counter intuitive to keep such an open angle against hard top spin shots.

The final piece for me was, it affected my forehand as well. What I read here from experts like Amir really is true - you want a very stiff blade, preferably with carbon. At first I tried using the antis on my Donic Defplay Senso V3 and it was a very bad fit. I went to the Dr Neubauer Matador and it was better. But then the light clicked on for me when I got a DMS Deluxe Carbon blade. It's a fast, stiff blade, so you wouldn't think you can control hard shots defensively, but trust me, you can and it returns the most nasty spin you'll see. On the flip side, using a much faster, stiffer blade resulted in having to put in a lot of work on my forehand. I wasn't used to the speed and catapult of the shots and I was wild for a while with my forehand. But now, I get comments from long time practice partners that my forehand is better than ever.

In summary, it's definitely not "plug and play" to come from OX long pips to Storkraft, especially if you play a more active style with your pips. But if you like to play close to the table, it's worth it, there's nothing better for close to the table defense. After about 4-5 months of consistent coaching (bi weekly), practice with a robot, and practice matches with different styles, I'm now feeling very comfortable with it, and the results are showing themselves. I will reiterate, if you want to back off the table and chop, I would advise against making the switch.

Author:  nathanso [ 06 May 2021, 23:18 ]
Post subject:  Re: Der Materialspezialist Störkraft frictionless anti

Thanks for your thoughtful reply. Your description of learning to play with Störkraft anti is reminiscent of my foray into 563 medium pips some years back. In the right hands, 563 is a terror to play against, but those hands were clearly not going to be mine! I rely on grippy LPs to impart spin and control the ball (and occasionally, to chop) so an anti like Störkraft probably isn't my cup of tea.

Author:  dwruck [ 07 May 2021, 04:58 ]
Post subject:  Re: Der Materialspezialist Störkraft frictionless anti

Once learned, the control is high. But yes, if you are looking to impart your own spin and occasionally chop, I'd look elsewhere. Perhaps try chopping with short pips, like Hou Yingchao?

Author:  gepi1993 [ 11 May 2021, 04:50 ]
Post subject:  Re: Der Materialspezialist Störkraft frictionless anti

Hi,

can you please help me comparing storkraft with vortex?

I'm playing with vortex red sponge 1.2 on dr neubauer matador from 1 year and this setup is pretty fine but i feel like i'm too slow and can't be agressive enough against passive players. In other words i play very well against agressive players and i'm weak against long pimples blockers or people who only put the ball with no spin on my bh witout looping at all.

Before vortex i tried a dr. neubauer abs 2 soft 2.5 mm but it wasn't effective at all for me, decent on agressive strokes (little better than vortex) but terrible on reversal and blocks.

Can storkraft let me being more agressive manteining nice reversal and blocks?

Wich mm size you suggest me?

I want something that is a bit faster than vortex but not too much so i don't know if it's better 0.8 or 1.2.

Another question, do you think matador is good for that kind of rubber? Or is better to switch on something more stiff like texa or texa carbon?

Thanks for help.

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