OOAK Table Tennis Forum

Table tennis supplier Cole Ely posted the following on mytt:

_________________



The MNNB Blog has had some pretty amazing stuff lately. Just click this text to check it out. | My OOAK Interview
Table Tennis Video Links: itTV | laola1.tv | ttbl | fftt | Challenger Series | mnnb-tv

No matter how good you are at something, there's always about a million people better than you.
Homer J. Simpson

I sure hope they finished all their testing!

When I interviewed Vladimir Samsonov in September he said he had not tested the new balls yet... I sure the Althletes Commission that he chairs was consulted on this decision and there was considerable support. I will ask him.

_________________
OOAK Table Tennis Shop | Re-Impact Blades | Butterfly Table Tennis bats
Setup1: Re-Impact Smart, Viper OX, Victas VS 401 Setup2: Re-Impact Barath, Dtecs OX, TSP Triple Spin Chop 1.0mm Setup3: Re-Impact Dark Knight, Hellfire OX, 999 Turbo
Recent Articles: Butterfly Tenergy Alternatives | Tenergy Rubbers Compared | Re-Impact User Guide

Assuming this message is accuate, and I have no reason to doubt Cole, this message really bugs me.

The ITTF cannot "stop" the celluloid balls without an official vote. This message tends to imply that the decision has already been made, and it's just a matter of time. This is misleading and manufacturers will obviously stop producing the celluloid balls, as they think a ban is inevitable, whereas in reality no such decision has agreed to and the ITTF have no right to imply that. Once manufacturers stop making the celluloid balls, there will be no need for a vote to ban them, as they simply won't be available.

_________________
OOAK Table Tennis Shop | Re-Impact Blades | Butterfly Table Tennis bats
Setup1: Re-Impact Smart, Viper OX, Victas VS 401 Setup2: Re-Impact Barath, Dtecs OX, TSP Triple Spin Chop 1.0mm Setup3: Re-Impact Dark Knight, Hellfire OX, 999 Turbo
Recent Articles: Butterfly Tenergy Alternatives | Tenergy Rubbers Compared | Re-Impact User Guide

As usual, they are like a big government, they are going to do what they want and just don't care. It is not so much "what" they do, it is "How" they do it. They do not seem to be able to just tell the truth with out smoke, mirrors or just plain lies. Like the "ban" on celuloid. Without the "Ban", I see no reason yet to change the ball. Even if the change is a good thing, the ITTF could have just given the reasons for the change, better quality balls, balls last longer, etc.

I was in manufacturing (plastic molding and extrusion) for many years. I know how much new equipment will cost. It is totally new machines that are needed. No modifying old machines. These machines are expensive! I will be very surprized if the cost of balls does not go way up for many years. If they last longer, the manufacturers will raise the cost because of reduced sales also.

I wish the new balls were available now so I could try them and also see if they cycle in robots.

And even if you stock up on celluloid balls now, if the new one's don't recycle in robots, practicing with old balls may become counter-productive if the bounce of new balls is so different.

_________________
I'm always in the dark, but the Dark sheds lights upon everything!! Beauty is only pimple deep! Beauty is in the eye of the pipholder!
S/U 1: Blade: Bty Gergely . FH Black Andro Rasant 2.1 . BH Red Tibhar Grass Dtecs
S/U 2: Blade: Bty Gergely . FH Black Hexer+ 2.1 . BH Red GD Talon
S/U 3: Blade: Bty Gergely . No rubbers...thinking of adding Red Dtecs and Black Rasant
Aussie Table Tennis Shop / Aussie Table Tennis Facebook Page / Equipment Review Index / Read my Reb Report Blog: click here.

I am not surprised. Meanwhile a certain part of them have a long tradition of doing what they have no right to do.

The ITTF does't care that this dubious ban creates hardship for 28 TT companies (729, Adidas, Artengo, Butterfly, Champion, Cornilleau, DHS, Donic, Double Fish, Dunlop, Gewo, Giant Dragon, Go Sport, Imperial, Joola, Killerspin, Nimatsu, Nittaku, Peace, Rucanor, Schildkrot, Stag, Stiga, Tibhar, TSP, Xiom, Yasaka and Yashima) who have produced 59 ITTF-approved *** balls. (http://www.ittf.com/stories/Pictures/Balls_04_2011.pdf)

They don't care that this new ball will make millions of balls worldwide pretty much worthless overnight, just like they did to us before a decade ago.

They don't care that this will likely render a large percentage of expensive table tennis robots obsolete.

They don't care that this will disrupt all of our games and likely force many of us to have to waste money on new equipment (again).

All the ITTF cares about is slowing the ball down (again) under the self-serving delusion this will suddenly make their failing pro tour catch on.

_________________



The MNNB Blog has had some pretty amazing stuff lately. Just click this text to check it out. | My OOAK Interview
Table Tennis Video Links: itTV | laola1.tv | ttbl | fftt | Challenger Series | mnnb-tv

No matter how good you are at something, there's always about a million people better than you.
Homer J. Simpson

Let me correct that, my version is:"they are going to disrupt all of our games and likely force many of us to have to waste money on new equipment (again)". Sounds more realistic to me.

Out of the 28 companies that sell table tennis balls, I wonder how many actually have their own factory? I'll bet there are only a few factories and most companies just have the balls private labeled for them. I could be wrong.

_________________



The MNNB Blog has had some pretty amazing stuff lately. Just click this text to check it out. | My OOAK Interview
Table Tennis Video Links: itTV | laola1.tv | ttbl | fftt | Challenger Series | mnnb-tv

No matter how good you are at something, there's always about a million people better than you.
Homer J. Simpson

This is quite frustrating..

Honestly, only few issues can be cited in our current celluloid balls. No safety or health issues I have known. Change is good, if it is for the better..

_________________
Setup 1 : Bty Mizutani Jun FH : Tenergy 80 Max BH : Acuda Blue P3

I'm sure the ITTF are not as heartless as you describe. Before they make a major change like this, they would at-least make sure that it did not drastically change how everything works.

_________________
Please view my blog, viewtopic.php?f=58&t=17571 , all the problems that I face in table tennis, I post on here, and I would very much appreciate it if you give your opinion on the matters.
S#1: Joola Wing Passion Fast, FH: 729 Cream 2.2, BH: 802-40 2.
S#2: Joola Trix Medium, FH: Hurricane 3 Neo 2, BH: 279 FX Lightning 2.2.
S#3: Galaxy 896, , BH: Pro XP 2.FH: Pro XP 2.2
S#4: Senso Waldner Carbon, FH: Apollo I 2.2, BH: Blowfish Plush Short Pimple Tensor.
S#4: Giant Dragon Kris Special, FH: Giant Dragon TaiChi Soft, BH: Giant Dragon Meteorite Soft.

If I were to ask for evidence to back up all your statements here, would you be able to provide anything other than an opinion? "They don't care" is a classic case of mind reading - how do you know "they don't care" other than by your interpretation of their actions?

To this point I have seen absolutely zero evidence to support any of these assertions. For example, what evidence do you have that this is going to render even a single TT robot "obsolete"?

Given that all balls - regardless of composition - will be exactly the same size and weight, and are required to bounce to the same degree, what evidence do you have that these new balls will slow the game down by even a nanosecond? Apart from speculation and hearsay, that is.

And, in the interests of putting my money where my mouth is, I'm sending a copy of these comments to the ITTF asking for a response. I'll let you know if and when I get a reply.

_________________
"So long, and thanks for all the fish
So sad that it should come to this" Sung by the dolphins in The hitchhiker's guide to the galaxy

Please ask them for proof of their dubious claim that there will be a worldwide ban on celluloid while you're at it. This is the question they will not answer because we caught them in a lie. Will you still support them after being lied to?


Adham has stated on several occasions that the ITTF doesn't care about recreational players.


Robots are made for balls less than 40mm, not over 40mm. We'll have to wait until the new balls are on the market to see how many robots will not be compatible. There will be some.


Larger balls are slower. That is physics and easily provable. Just compare 38mm, 40mm and 44mm balls.

_________________



The MNNB Blog has had some pretty amazing stuff lately. Just click this text to check it out. | My OOAK Interview
Table Tennis Video Links: itTV | laola1.tv | ttbl | fftt | Challenger Series | mnnb-tv

No matter how good you are at something, there's always about a million people better than you.
Homer J. Simpson

As for the "don't care" Sharara has said as much about similar equipment issues. His main concern is professional ITTF sanctioned play. The notion that it isn't their primary concern would probably be a more accurate and less inflammatory way of putting the reality of the situation.

The balls will be the same weight, but will be slightly larger than current balls - though will almost surely still be within the previous allowable size range.

The bounce test is a simple drop test and may not be that good of an indication of how a ball bounces when driven at glancing angles and at higher and lower velocities with different amounts of spin. Since the balls are pretty much guaranteed to be .35mm or more larger in diameter than current balls and of the same weight, it does follow that they will spin a little bit less and slow down in flight a bit more. This follows from fairly simple physics.

It will be interesting to see the response you get. The ITTF has already spread mis-information about celluloid and the hazards of celluloid. Sharara said that cellulose has the same lung hazards as asbestos. Amazing. They also did something odd in prefacing the new rule with the new size parameters as applying to non-celluloid balls only, but the actual rule that was passed doesn't say that. Is that a form of rigging the vote? If they re-word it to match the preface, then they are adding language that wasn't voted on. If they don't re-word the language, then they have deceived their membership by giving a condition on the "ballot" that won't be adhered to. Very odd.

_________________
Jay Turberville
http://www.jayandwanda.com
Hardbat: Nittaku Resist & Dr. Evil

So is this letter (info) sent to all suppliers and all manufactourers/National Associations?

_________________
Blade Ulmo Duality| FH Tibhar mx-p Black, Dawei 388D-1 red OX
NZ table tennis selector, ask a question
My Blog here..How table tennis objects are made
Table Tennis abbreviations, and acronyms