OOAK Table Tennis Forum

The Dr Neubaer bloodhound blade is quite stiff and hard due to all wood plus carbon and is really good for pips on the BH. Downside is it is quite hard to loop with on the FH due to the low fast ball jump off.

I have been using Keiler 1.8 on a Tibhar Force Pro Blue, mainly hitting and blocking. Tenergy 05fx on fh.

But I do not like the blade when using ABS balls, It seems a bit hard to lift balls, and I want more loop and arc on fh.
Tried a Ma Lin Carbon and its just too fast for what I want to do.
Tried a couple of faster 7 ply wood Sanwei Fextra and Xiom Solo and I do not like what they do to my fh, bit too bouncy and too flat now.

So I am considering either trying on a 5 ply wood for looping (Stiga Infinity in the cupboard), but thinking to try 1.5 Keiler (I have a sheet)
Or maybe a balsa carbon
Andro Carbon light all+ for example, which I suspect would be great on hits and blocks with the Keiler.

Has anyone tried the Spinlord blades, maybe an ultra carbon.

Any ideas??

If the problem with all those blades is mainly your FH then maybe you need something less springy than FX. I am using Rasanter R42 in 2mm on my B&W blade and it is great for topspin close to table e.g when opening up, as well as hitting, pushing, blocking etc. R42 2mm should work for you on any off- blade with good dwell and medium throw i.e. not too pingy.

Look forward to your feedback on keiler 1.5mm

Ok, I give in. After all the searching, I am back to Keiler 1.5 mm red on my backhand. I've tried lots of different stuff, but I enjoy the Keiler more than any of them. Of the one's I have tried Killer Pro Evo is closest to the mark. Most of the others would require a faster blade, or change in technique. I'll just put up with boosting the sponge to speed up the break in process and wait a while for the effect of the booster to settle down before mounting the rubber.

Below is a list of the one's I can think of off the top of my head, I'm sure there are others. Some I already had before I settled on Keiler the first time. I've played in tournaments with Power Pipes, Killer Pro Evo and Killer Soft. I could probably play well with any of the Killer versions, but if I had to choose the Killer Pro Evo is easiest and closes to Keiler.

Do Knuckle (nice just a little slow for what I want to do)
Super Do Knuckle (pips are oriented the opposite to Do Knuckle)
Diamant (don't get along with this at all)
Killer
Killer Pro
Killer Soft
Killer Pro Evo (I was advised this would be close and it is)
GXM (works best for me on a really fast blade)
PeaceKeeper
Pistol 2 (don't get along with this at all)
388 C1 (don't get along with this at all)
Spectol (more sensitive to spin, also produces more spin than Keiler)
651
652
874 (don't get along with this at all)
Sharping
Dragonow
Elfrark (works best for me on a really fast blade)
Pimplemini (works best for me on a really fast blade)
Feint Long II
Giant Long
[email protected] (works best for me on a really fast blade)
MilliTall II (works best for me on a fast blade)
Orkan 2 (works best for me on a slower blade)
563
Power Pipes (was interesting, but I struggled with certain shots with this)

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Donic Waldner World Champion 89 FL; Donic Bluestorm Pro (Red) Max; Victas VO>101 (Black) 1.8

that is one long list!! Might be tempted to try Keiler i 1.5mm in red as have only used black so far.

One possible alternative to Keiler is the new DMS flashback which is getting good reviews

I can add feedback on a few other MP's/SP's that I have tried all in 1.5mm

S&T Hipster. Easy to use, nice blocks but too slow with new ball unless perhaps on a very fast blade
DMS Breakout: lacks both grip and disruption with new ball - too one dimensional
DR N Explosion - big disappointment, no ball feel and lacks both grip and disruption
Armstrong Attack 3M - similar to hipster needs a fast blade to be at all dangerous.
TSP Spin Magic- Unusual rubber with very soft sponge and lots of control but can be quite effective on a fast blade

Funny thing:

I wanted to recommend Dr Neubauer Explosion, while you couldn´t get along with it.
Comming from Keiler 1.5mm I went to 563-1 1.8mm and now to Explosion 1.5mm and I´m very happy with it.
It has the perfect balance of speed, controll and disruption for my style, which is playing near the table with block/counter/smash and some disruption on the BH.
FH is inverted with much more smash then topspin.

I think It depends very much on style and very much on the blade!
My TSP Reflex Award 50 is an all wood blade. It´s relative stiff with relative hard outer pliers and speed is imho off-

Greetings Claus

I am currently toying around with DMS Flashback in 1.5 mm on a Stiga Clipper Classic, very nice combo. Flashback is rather allround with a little more sink effect than Keilier while it also may be a little more difficult to attack with. But the lesser makes blocking a little easier I guess, since heavy top spin does not grip as much (also depends on the blade and your touch).

Here is me in my 3rd session with Flasback, first time I used it on the Clipper, I started with Sauer & Tröger Black & White. My opponent uses Keiler 1.2 mm on FH.

To me it seems that Keiler looses its weirdness at high impact but is rather tricky to play against if used with light touch. Hard hits make the ball fly like from short pips or inverted, but a slightly more loose hit makes the ball sink.

With Flashback it is almost the other way around. If I hit hard the ball sinks a lot. But if I roll or just play loose there is still some weirdness but not much sink. At low impact I think Keiler and Flashback are similar, but at high impact Flasback gives you many winners (unless you hit the net or misses the table of course ).

https://youtu.be/ow9-pV_0ZSQ

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Def-attack's attempts to find balance between defence/attack | Getting better - health and game |
My Youtube

You know, I think this is what I like about Keiler! It not only can give the weird balls when asked to, but it can also put away the resulting return. This is something I have struggled to do with many of the other pips. The one's that are higher on the weird scale are difficult to finish points with, the pips that are easy to finish are usually not very disruptive. Keiler hits the perfect middle ground for me. Sounds like Flashback might be following the opposite path to Keiler.

As for Dr N Explosion, I have it also but didn't mount it up this time around, and I found it to be fairly unremarkable. Not fast enough to be a dangerous short pip, little spin, but little weirdness at the same time. Control was good, probably due to the fact that it has little reaction to spin. Unimpressive for an offensive game (might be different on a faster blade, mine is about Off -). As always this reflects my needs in a pip, and may not match with what someone else needs. If you value the properties of Explosion it would be a great pip to choose.

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Donic Waldner World Champion 89 FL; Donic Bluestorm Pro (Red) Max; Victas VO>101 (Black) 1.8

You are right, Flashback is difficult for attacking pop ups. It is like hitting with a fast long pip almost, you need the exact right angle or ball goes to the net or long. It seems that Keiler is better there. On the other hand, when I manage to place an attack on the table it is often a winner. But I need to practice that attacking shot a lot more (I have only almost only played matches so far)

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Def-attack's attempts to find balance between defence/attack | Getting better - health and game |
My Youtube

Keiler is a sort of hybrid short pip medium pip with some of the benefits of both whilst Flashback seems more of pure medium pip with its longer more flexible cylindrical pips. Flashback sounds similar to Orkan which I found is great for disruptive blocking but the pips are a bit too flexible and there is a bit too much reversal for controlled counter hitting - the ball can easily drift long.

AS for explosion I think it needs a lively blade and is more of a block and hit rubber without the subtlety of say keiler as regards spin and speed variation.

'Yeah, well, that's just, like, your opinion, man.'

I´m able to play more variable with Explosion because of more control.
But naturally there is a lot of subjectivity here.

Greetings Claus

Glad to hear Explosion is working for you Claus. These rubbers cost too much to waste.

I hate to dig up old posts, but the first positive thing I have heard from Spinlord concerning Keiler was on the ttdd.de website "new faster version of the Keiler and/or the Wran (late 2022)".

There may be room for cautious optimism. It would be nice to be able to revisit Keiler, hopefully close to its original dynamic form. Maybe later this year! Hope this doesn't mean just a "faster" rock hard sponge, but something more like the original "yellow" sponge.

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Donic Waldner World Champion 89 FL; Donic Bluestorm Pro (Red) Max; Victas VO>101 (Black) 1.8

sounds good news as I would love to get back to using Keiler/Waran again with a decent quality sponge that hopefully lasts more like the original yellow sponge did