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new Medium pips list charateristics-Help us to create a list
https://ooakforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=42&t=32976		 Page 3 of 6
Author:  maddrag [ 09 Jun 2018, 01:30 ]
Post subject:  Re: new Medium pips list carateristics-Help us to create a l
If you play with 2 differents thickness of rubber rate them so.we can see how the rubber is doing with different thickness.
Author:  ChasFox [ 09 Jun 2018, 03:17 ]
Post subject:  Re: new Medium pips list carateristics-Help us to create a l
Soba wrote:


Hi,

Today I played first time with 1,8mm Keiler and I find it easier to play with better players than with 1,5mm. Games were more like speed and topspin. Then I played with weaker players who pushed and make no spin balls to my backhand and I noticed it was difficult to play. Short game was very difficult with 1,8mm. Still I start practise with this 1,8mm. Any tips for no spin serves and strokes to my backhand?

Soba


That sums up Keiler 1.8mm well great against good players giving you speed and spin but tricky in passive over the table play and when on the back foot. That is why I currently am using 1.2mm on a slowish blade but may try 1.5mm again to get more spin.
Author:  maddrag [ 09 Jun 2018, 12:07 ]
Post subject:  Re: new Medium pips list carateristics-Help us to create a l
for soba

The 1.8mm is working better against higher rank opponants. More spin mean more that goes into your pips. At the same time the sponge is playing a bigger part of a shot. It plays more as an inverted rubber so you can counter better. You can create more of your spin.it has less reversal.

On the opposite, the float ball give you hard time. The 1.8mm is chopping more and too often send it into the net against a float ball. You will also send your attack hit ouside. Brushing the ball too much. You need more precision and stay with shot that get the ball into the pips. If you push with too open blade the ball will never goes into the pips and the ball just bounced over the tips of the pips if you not agressive enough .

The shot to do is a more direct contact with the pips:

- Against light push or float just hit more downward and more direct forward. You should feel the ball going into your pips and get more control.

- To do a conuter hit, just hit it straightforeward (no brushing)a nd get the ball goes into the pips. You can punch it. A good way to hit float ball. ( See jian li )

those shot need to be done with a certain autority or the light gesture just never get the ball into the pips and you will end up loosing control of your shot and confidence. Practice a lot those shot as it is often more difficult than to play big looper.

Also against lower rank players play more safe on the placement, a bit less agressive, less speed but with good contact as they are not having the skill to kill you with an enormous loop. Try to play longer, do long serve top spin to creating more speed to conter or chop. Don't go into short ball exchange with float balls.

Hope it help you and tell me how it went.

DON'T FORGET TO RATE THE MPs as this forum is for that.
Author:  Soba [ 09 Jun 2018, 14:32 ]
Post subject:  Re: new Medium pips list carateristics-Help us to create a l
Hi,

Spinlord Keiler Blade KKS5 (BH ALL balsa). This is 1,5mm

1-Speed 8
2-Control 7
3-short game 6
4-long game 8
5-own underspin 6
6-own topspin 5
7-reverse3
8-disruption 7
9-block 8
10-attack 8
11-defense 7
10-flat hit 8
11-float 7
12-knuckle ball 5
13-push 6
14-classic chop 6
15-throw angle medium
Author:  maddrag [ 09 Jun 2018, 21:34 ]
Post subject:  Re: new Medium pips list carateristics-Help us to create a l
thank you soba for your rating. Any other MPs you played in the past that you can rate. It would be great.

I invite everyone who played or play with MP to rate their ruber also.
Author:  maddrag [ 09 Jun 2018, 21:49 ]
Post subject:  Re: new Medium pips list carateristics-Help us to create a l
hi Soba,

Is it posible that Your rating for short game 6 and long game 8 is reversed. 1dennistt has similar result than you but he got short game 8 and long game 6. As this Mp seems to be for attack it seems you reversed your rating . Tell me your answer.
Author:  Soba [ 10 Jun 2018, 23:28 ]
Post subject:  Re: new Medium pips list carateristics-Help us to create a l
maddrag wrote:
hi Soba,

Is it posible that Your rating for short game 6 and long game 8 is reversed. 1dennistt has similar result than you but he got short game 8 and long game 6. As this Mp seems to be for attack it seems you reversed your rating . Tell me your answer.


Hi Maddrag,

Im not so sure what you mean by short and long game? This Keiler is quite tricky to play over the table short push etc. I understood that long game is little bit far than over the table and short game is over the table? Then thos 6 to short game and 8 to long is my opinnion.

Soba
Author:  Soba [ 10 Jun 2018, 23:31 ]
Post subject:  Re: new Medium pips list carateristics-Help us to create a l
Hi,

Milky way Pluto 1,5 mm and blade DR Neub. Matador (OFF)

1-Speed 7
2-Control 7
3-short game 7
4-long game 7
5-own underspin 6
6-own topspin 4
7-reverse 5
8-disruption 7
9-block 8
10-attack 6
11-defense 8
10-flat hit 7
11-float 7
12-knuckle ball 5
13-push 8
14-classic chop 7
15-throw angle medium
Author:  maddrag [ 11 Jun 2018, 23:20 ]
Post subject:  Re: new Medium pips list carateristics-Help us to create a l
thank you soba.

Any other Mps to rate everyone? The board start to be interrested. ( see at the first page)
Author:  ChasFox [ 12 Jun 2018, 03:18 ]
Post subject:  Re: new Medium pips list carateristics-Help us to create a l
Will try to do a rating in Gipfelsturm 1.5mm after a couple of sessions I put it on a work colleagues bat as I found it a bit uninspiring. Probably a bit like KO.good for blocking off the bounce but not much else!
Author:  maddrag [ 12 Jun 2018, 03:26 ]
Post subject:  Re: new Medium pips list carateristics-Help us to create a l
That the result is good or not doesn't matter. The point is that we know what to expect from that rubber.

Thank you for your help. Invite other to do the same. It will be good for everybody. Did you look at the attachment ? (First page, first communication))
Author:  1dennistt [ 13 Jun 2018, 03:26 ]
Post subject:  Re: new Medium pips list carateristics-Help us to create a l
Soba wrote:
maddrag wrote:
hi Soba,

Is it posible that Your rating for short game 6 and long game 8 is reversed. 1dennistt has similar result than you but he got short game 8 and long game 6. As this Mp seems to be for attack it seems you reversed your rating . Tell me your answer.


Hi Maddrag,

Im not so sure what you mean by short and long game? This Keiler is quite tricky to play over the table short push etc. I understood that long game is little bit far than over the table and short game is over the table? Then thos 6 to short game and 8 to long is my opinnion.

Soba


I agree, short push is really not the strong point of Keiler, I tend to play aggressive when over the table and try to open the point, so I will use a flip, a banana flip or a roll more often than a short push. So for me the short push really is not as much of an issue. I'm currently experimenting with different options to gain more control over this shot. On the other side, I try not to give up the table, so I don't spend as much time back from the table. I am learning to drive through the ball more when 1 or 2 steps back from the table, instead of resorting to flipping the racket to attack or chopping, so I might have to update my answers at some point.

Anyway that probably explains how we came to different conclusions in our ratings.
Author:  maddrag [ 14 Jun 2018, 00:49 ]
Post subject:  Re: new Medium pips list carateristics-Help us to create a l
anyone has seen the attachment of the first communication of this forum ? It give a summary of all rating received so far for MP. Do you like it ? Give your comments please.
Author:  maddrag [ 23 Jun 2018, 14:36 ]
Post subject:  Re: new Medium pips list carateristics-Help us to create a l
Just received the MDS power pipes rubber today in 1.5mm.

This is a summary for the physical aspect of the MP. This is giving us good clues of the play we will be able to do with it. I will compare it to the agressor. ( see pictures for comparaison)

pimples aspect:

lenght: same ( 1.7 mm)
Diameter: agressor>power pipes ( agressor is 2,1mm, so around 1.8 mm maybe)
stiffness: Agressor>power pipes power pipes offer a good bent of the pimples)
grippy/stiky side: power pipes>agressor (power pipes have a feel of fish scale.)
grippy tops: agressor>power pipes ( glossy look)
density: agressor>power pipes ( powewr pipes remind the PR3 alpha)

sponge aspect:

hardness: agressor> power pipes ( power pipes remind me the TSP P4)

interpretation:

The power pipes is definitely on the short pimples side.

-The sticky side of the pimples will control the ball better and will create spin or stop the spin. How much it will stop the spin, will be determine in the game.

-The fact that the pimple are quite long can create possible wobble ,sink, and good underspin.

- The fact that the pimples tops are slick can give more reversal. We can roll the ball on top of the pimples without interaction with the pimples but as soon the pimples start to be bent, it grab the ball intensively. But how much it will interact,we will see. ( the agressor have grippy tops so can't roll the ball without a small interaction with the pimples)

-The fact that the density is less and the pimples a bit thinner than the agressor the the ball will go easier between the pimples and the sponge will interact more with the ball. Usually godd for control, block,hit and top spin. ( inverted rubber caratéristics)

-The fact that we have vertical pimples alignment and a low density can change the effect depending of the orientation of the blade.

- The fact that the sponge is softer and more springy it will have a more trampoline effect and go faster. Does it will produce less control ? we will see.

The rubber react a bit to the spin but how much ? will see in the practice. It seems a very exiting rubber. I will play it this week and do a review and the rating for it.
Author:  maddrag [ 29 Jun 2018, 13:49 ]
Post subject:  Re: new Medium pips list carateristics-Help us to create a l
So I played 3hrs with Power pipes. Here is a review with my previous interpretation:

1-Speed 9
2-Control 9
3-short game 8,5
4-long game 8
5-own underspin 7,5
6-own topspin 7
7-reverse 5,5
8-disruption 7,5
9-block 9
10-attack 9
11-defense 8
10-flat hit 9
11-float 9
12-knuckle ball 6,5
13-push 7
14-classic chop 7,7
15-throw angle medium-low

interpretation:

The power pipes is definitely on the short pimples side. Yes it is. Attack with block, counter and flat hit is the bread and butter of this MP

-The sticky side of the pimples will control the ball better and will create spin or stop the spin. How much it will stop the spin, will be determine in the game.The pips has a lot of control to play. it effectively stop spin and add spin. I didn't find a lot of thing that it can't do with control

-The fact that the pimple are quite long can create possible wobble ,sink, and good underspin. It's difficult to say as the pips are fast. The chop can be done in different way, classic, sp shop way, rip chop, I didn't see a lot of spin but the fact it is fast the opponant is running to the fast ball so is he just late to hit the ball and miss it or it is underspin. ONe thing I know is that I was always hitting the back line of the table with my chop. It look it fall suddenly but not sure. It is very joyfull to have my chops always hit the back of the table with speed. Difficult to drive them or smash it or making a stop ball

- The fact that the pimples tops are slick can give more reversal. We can roll the ball on top of the pimples without interaction with the pimples but as soon the pimples start to be bent, it grab the ball intensively. But how much it will interact,we will see. ( the agressor have grippy tops so can't roll the ball without a small interaction with the pimples) If you hit the ball with a blade very horizontally it almost not moving forward. You can create a false underspin ball with a big gesture chop but the ball fall very short just on the other side of the net. Big surprise. YOu can do a very horizontal movement with a blade totally vertical at 90 degree and create fast floating ball.On the other hand if I hit more with an certain angle the ball fly low and fast with a bit of top spin. The small variation of angle make a huge difference. excellent for service

-The fact that the density is less and the pimples a bit thinner than the agressor the the ball will go easier between the pimples and the sponge will interact more with the ball. Usually godd for control, block,hit and top spin. ( inverted rubber caratéristics)it exactly what happened The last time I was able to sent much top spin and smash back on the table with a block was with TSP PR3 alpha. The ball fall on the backline of the table.

-The fact that we have vertical pimples alignment and a low density can change the effect depending of the orientation of the blade. The angle and orientation of the blade change you shot. Just amazing. Long low fast shop like an SP, slow LP chop, horizontal or vertical block fast or slower. a counter with closed blade for reducing the speed and good placement etc.. This is really something !!!!

- The fact that the sponge is softer and more springy it will have a more trampoline effect and go faster. Does it will produce less control ? we will see. When you are back form the table and have to just pick up the ball after the opponant make a short push from you chop, it just do that like a spring and the ball goes on the other side with fast speed. Same with the roll.

Finally I can say that htis mp is universal and can do all the shot I learn in my 6 years of playing LP.
I just have to see what I will do in real game .
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