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 Post subject: Butterfly Defence III
PostPosted: 24 Oct 2012, 19:52 
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The successor of Butterfly Defence II will appear in January 2013.

Three plies of willow
6,4 mm
92 g

Seems to be slightly lighter and, looking at the picture, it seems to have three plies troughout the whole blade instead of 5 plies at the handle side such as Def II. Overall I don't think it will be very different from Def II, except for the price...?

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butterfly-defence-3.jpg
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PostPosted: 24 Oct 2012, 22:22 
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I am definitely looking forward to the release of this blade. It would be sick if this one would be just a bit faster.

At the moment I have 2 Def II with different rubbers and one of them is a bit splintered.
So naturally I need another one :D My plan is to have a "competition" paddle with new (but broken in) rubbers on it, then I need training paddle that would be same as competition one, but rubbers will be worn out most of the time. And I need third one for various tests with different rubbers :D

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PostPosted: 24 Oct 2012, 22:24 
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why is Def 3 without 5 plies in the handle like Def 2 ?.. why did they produce Def 2 with 5 plies in the handle ?..


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PostPosted: 25 Oct 2012, 21:06 
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deva sarjan wrote:
why is Def 3 without 5 plies in the handle like Def 2 ?.. why did they produce Def 2 with 5 plies in the handle ?..


I think both questions are interconnected. My guess would be that the 5 plies in the handle (also in a part of the head) would add some flex, especially when touching the ball at the bottom part of the blade (when is that?). But the fact that Def 3 is without these 5 handle plies suggest that it didn't do anything special. It could be that the blade is slightly faster now, but it won't be much, I guess. I don't know whether the blade dimensions will be the same, probably they are.

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PostPosted: 25 Oct 2012, 23:02 
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I was under the impression that the partial 5th ply in the Defense II made it considerably less flexible, and dampened vibrations in the handle a bit.

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PostPosted: 25 Oct 2012, 23:35 
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QuickDraw wrote:
I was under the impression that the partial 5th ply in the Defense II made it considerably less flexible, and dampened vibrations in the handle a bit.

You are right, def 2 has no flex and i think that 5 plies at the bottom helped.

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PostPosted: 26 Oct 2012, 01:25 
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nittaku willtria - 3 plys of willow all the way through....


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PostPosted: 26 Oct 2012, 20:45 
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QuickDraw wrote:
I was under the impression that the partial 5th ply in the Defense II made it considerably less flexible, and dampened vibrations in the handle a bit.


Your impression... To what blade are you comparing Def II there?

So far, I have only bounced the ball a bit on my Def II (will try it next week against opponent) and the blade is quite stiff, but when the ball comes near the handle I felt some clear vibrations. I think the 3 ply-part feels stiffer because it has one thick willow core, instead of 5 thinner plies. I would expect the thicker the plies, the stiffer the blade?

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PostPosted: 26 Oct 2012, 23:44 
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only three plies , less operation when producing blade


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PostPosted: 18 Mar 2013, 09:05 
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Any more news on a release date for this blade? I see it is already available on tt-japan.net, but I wonder if it will see a worldwide release soon. Seems like a good option for those of us that missed the opportunity to pick up a Defence 2.

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PostPosted: 29 Mar 2013, 06:18 
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I recently read something about either a Stiga or a Tibhar blade (I think Tibhar) which was 5 ply with 9 plies in the handle, according to the manufacturer to reduce vibrations. The 5 plies went into the handle for about 3 cm, I believe, entering between the 9. That type of construction would dampen vibration because the vibrating plies of the face are clamped between the non-vibrating ones of the handle. I can't imagine any manufacturer going into that kind of technical trouble just to raise the price, so I guess it should do something. There are different approaches to the problem of vibration which, hoewever, all seem to make use of the same idea of dampening. Friendship has at least one blade, the Sensor Grip, with a kind of foam between the wood of the grip and the wood of the blade within the grip; expressly for the same purpose. I think I have seen other blades with layers of cork for the same thing.

I believe flexibility is (at least in some blades) increased by doing sort of the opposite, that is, taking away some wood at the throat of the blade. TSP Reflex blades have this gimmick, if I remember right.

It may seem a bit odd to want to take away vibration out of a defensive blade, as defense really does need good touch and therefore good feed-back from the blade; but a three-ply blade is probably vibrating more than 4 or 5 ply blades and excess of vibration can get in the way of good touch, so it may make sense to apply dampening techniques. I wouldn't expect to see them in 5 ply defensive blades.
Maybe Butterfly found a way to make the Defence III more rigid (different gluing for instance, or a way of treating the wood before assembling the blade) so dampening was no longer needed.

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PostPosted: 29 Mar 2013, 22:25 
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Kees wrote:
It may seem a bit odd to want to take away vibration out of a defensive blade, as defense really does need good touch and therefore good feed-back from the blade


I couldn't agree more with that. I don't like Def II because there is hardly any flex and feedback which influences both my chopping as my looping ability in a negative way. For me, it doesn't feel 'dead' at all. For hitting it is a very good blade. Also better for loop-drives than for brush-loops. Not my cup of tea with my current rubbers (XP and 531A)... Maybe I have to find a better blade-rubber combination: slower japanese pips and hard tacky inverted?

Kees wrote:
but a three-ply blade is probably vibrating more than 4 or 5 ply blades and excess of vibration can get in the way of good touch, so it may make sense to apply dampening techniques. I wouldn't expect to see them in 5 ply defensive blades. Maybe Butterfly found a way to make the Defence III more rigid (different gluing for instance, or a way of treating the wood before assembling the blade) so dampening was no longer needed.


Or Def III has some (more) flex compared to Def II. But isn't willow wood very stiff on its own?

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PostPosted: 29 Mar 2013, 23:48 
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Quote:
But isn't willow wood very stiff on its own?
No, it is "bendy", but not fast in resuming its shape; it is also rather loosely fibred, therefore soft (compared to harder woods). That is why it absorbs speed up to a point.

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PostPosted: 30 Mar 2013, 01:57 
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So has anyone had a a chance to try out the new Defence 3 yet?

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PostPosted: 30 Mar 2013, 06:29 
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If my local dealers haven't lied to me, I should have this blade in 2 weeks time.

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Setups (click on writings to read reviews):
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3) Ross Leidy "White Shadow" / P1R (1,3) / Hexer PS (1,7)


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